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The Unforgivable Sin

Discussion in 'Traditional Theology' started by Airaux, Aug 14, 2019.

  1. Airaux

    Airaux New Member

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    I am unsure if this is the appropriate forum to post this, but it seems to me to be as good as any.
    Since "finding Christianity" in 1985, I've been acquainted with the doctrine of the "unforgivable sin", 'though opinions differ throughout denominations and individuals as to what it actually is. Questions arise, such as "What is it?"; "Who can commit it?"; "Who has committed it?"; "Who, if anyone, can longer commit it?".
    To me, from Jesus' words, it seems to be attributing a demonic or negative source to a Godly act.
    I'd be interested in hearing anyone's (backed up by evidence/ reasons) beliefs/ views on this matter.
     
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  2. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Specifically, it is to blaspheme the Holy Spirit, right? Interesting that it isn't blaspheming the Father or Son, just the Holy Spirit.

    Anyway... the word blaspheme specifically means to speak against... if one speaks against the Holy Spirit (this has to be with purpose, not an accident.... i.e. a rebellious type of talk) then it isn't forgivable. When Yeshua told us about this, Pharisees had attributed his holy works to the devil. They were speaking against the Holy Spirit (the power inside that allowed him to accomplish what he did) by verbally attributing His works to something else. That is how THEY spoke against the Holy Spirit.
     
  3. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It is a phobia of a subset of Protestants who obsess about having committed this unforgivable sin, folks who would otherwise believe they were 'once saved always saved' and yet they seem to know that isn't true in their bones. Sure there is a final impenitence, but the phobia about the unforgivable sin is an odd obsession for a believing Christian. I would say the solution is to go to confession.
     
  4. Airaux

    Airaux New Member

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    First - my last question in my first post was meant to say "Who can NO longer commit it?".
    Chevyontheriver: Your post seems strangely dismissive of such a serious and seemingly valid fear.
    Ken Rank: Do you have any view(s) on the question I asked in my first post?
     
  5. topher694

    topher694 Go Turtle!

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    You've got it right there.

    The reason it is the unforgivable sin is not because God is unwilling to forgive. It is because the Holy Spirit is the one that brings the conviction that leads us to repentance, which includes asking for forgiveness. If we reject anything the Holy Spirit does as demonic then we have completely closed the door to the one who guides us to that place of repentance and actually vilified Him. So how can we then receive His forgiveness?

    A good number of people come here from time to time worried that they've committed blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, my response is always the same: If you're worried that you've done it, you haven't. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is a such complete utter rejection of Him that you leave no path to consider otherwise... or simply put, you just don't care.
     
  6. Airaux

    Airaux New Member

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    Topher694: Thanks for your response.
    I've been, at various times and to varying degrees, terrified of this since 1985.
    As I said - I've been exposed to so many differing beliefs on this matter.
    Could you give any biblical or logical specifics as to why you can so assuredly asserts that one wouldn't care if one had committed it?
     
  7. topher694

    topher694 Go Turtle!

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    You're welcome. The answer to your question is more involved than I have time for at the moment, but the scriptures below offer a good starting point. Try to look for how they all fit together in the context of your question:

    John 16:8-11
    Matt 6:14-15
    2 Peter 3:9
     
  8. Acts2:38

    Acts2:38 Well-Known Member

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    You have plenty of examples today. Though, if you wish it to be an example from scripture only, I would have to reference the Pharisees off the top of my head.

    Matthew 9
    33 And when the devil was cast out, the dumb spake: and the multitudes marvelled, saying, It was never so seen in Israel.
    34 But the Pharisees said, He casteth out devils through the prince of the devils.

    Matthew 12
    24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
    31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
    32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

    Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit was committed when someone witnessed Jesus perform a miracle, and then attributed it to the power of the Devil. This indicated a heart so hardened that the individual was unable to respond to the teaching of the gospel. Anyone who does not accept the gospel will be lost.

    If a person persistently rejects the New Testament evidence that support the Savior’s credibility, has he not in principle exhibited the same attitude and actions as did the Pharisees? Has he not committed an “eternal sin”? Is there any other method of redemption available to him?

    Thus, there are many examples today that one can find to cover this.
     
  9. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It is a fear outside of all proportion. There are people who obsess about accidentally committing the unforgivable sin. But a serious sin requires free choice, deliberation, and grave matter. So it isn't accidental at all. And we see people come back from years of living in serious damning sin frequently enough. The unforgivable sin is in not caring to bother to be forgiven. Which means that most everyone who worries about having committed that sin hasn't really. The ones who have committed it don't want to be bothered by grace and wouldn't worry one bit about walking away from God.
     
  10. charsan

    charsan Active Member

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    Exactly
     
  11. charsan

    charsan Active Member

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    It was nice to get into Traditional Christianity where this phobia does not exist
     
  12. Stranger36147

    Stranger36147 Member

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    Or worry obsessively that they have already somehow. You have to feel bad for those Christians....especially the ones who have OCD. They have my sympathy....because I have OCD and there was a time when I worried that I had accidentally committed this sin. I went through some dark times as a result. Even today, I'm still not entirely sure I didn't commit it. Well....guess I'll find out one day if I did or not.
     
  13. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes, I think it does involve some OCD. But I think it is theology dependent as well. Seems that Catholics are immune to it. I don't know that it affects Lutherans either.
     
  14. charsan

    charsan Active Member

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    I wonder if it is because of "Bible alone"
     
  15. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I don't know. I doubt it is that simple.
     
  16. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    And it's about thinking....not talking.
     
  17. Airaux

    Airaux New Member

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    Actually, I have a life-long history of OCD and a few years ago, I was diagnosed as autistic, 'though I have doubts as to the accuracy of my diagnosis.
    Medical people have said this explains certain hampering aspects of my younger life.
     
  18. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Actually it is not. We are not penalized for thinking, we are penalized for what we do or don't do. Remember the parable of the two sons... one says he will do it and doesn't, the other says he won't and then does. Who was praised? The one who said no but then did it. Anyway...

    Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit has never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
    Blaspheme - blasphēmeō (G987) - From G989; Strong's: to vilify; specifically to speak impiously:

    Thayer Definition:
    1) to speak reproachfully, rail at, revile, calumniate, blaspheme
    2) to be evil spoken of, reviled, railed at

    Respectfully, blaspheming the Spirit doesn't have anything to do with speaking, the word itself is geared entirely around speaking against.
     
  19. Airaux

    Airaux New Member

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    Ken Rank: Is it not true that THINKING bad thoughts is a sin? Someone recently said that when we sleep we do not sin. That seems incorrect to me. When we sleep, we still think out of our sinful hearts according to the implications of scripture, don't we?
     
  20. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    According to the spirit of the law... it isn't thinking but when our heart is aimed at sin that we cross the line. Yeshua used adultery as an example. The act itself IS a sin... but what is also a sin is when we lust in the heart for another. Now, that involves looking and thinking... but the weight is on the heart. Still... you have a point where sin can be tied to thinking. However, this thread isn't about any regular sin... this thread is specifically about the unforgivable sin which is to "blaspheme" the Holy Spirit. And that word isn't about thinking, it is about railing against, speaking against, verbally coming against.

    Blessings.
    Ken
     
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