The Transcendent Unity of Religions, Perennialism ,Tradition

[Drunk On Love]

As to other traditions being viable vehicles or paths to salvation:

"Truly those who believe, and the Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabeans- whoever believeith in God and the Last Day and performith good deeds- surely their reward is with their Lord, and no fear shall come upon them, neither shall they grieve." 2:266

Allah (swt) COULD have made us all one religious community but instead he allows for a multitude of them to exist. They are to compete with one another in good works.

To each [religious community] we have given a direction which it follows, so compete [all together] in [the performance of] good deeds. Whosesoever you may be, God shall certainly gather you all [for Divine Judgment]. God certainly has power over all things.(2:148)

 

[Drunk On Love]

Here are two other important Quranic verses on the topic of the providential differnces in forms and shariahs:

For each We have appointed from you a Law and a Way (Shir'atin wa minhajan). Had God willed He could have made you one community. but that He might try you by that which He hath given you [He hath made you as you are]. So vie with one another in good works. Unto God ye will return, and He will inform you wherein ye differed.
5:48

Unto each community We have given sacred rites (mansakan) which they are to perform; so let them not dispute with thee about the matter, but summon them unto thy Lord
22:67

 

[Montalban]

Welcome to Baha'i 1.01

 

[Drunk On Love]

Welcome to Baha'i 1.01

It's possible that Baha'i adherents might agree with these Quranic concepts. Baha'i grew out of Babism. Babism was (and still is because not all of them became Baha'i) an Islamic apocalyptic movement. The Babi's were/are Twelve Imam Shi'ites of a somewhat unorthodox character. It would make sense that there were some similarities between the two religions.

Rumi and Ibn Arabi lived long before the creation of the Baha'i movement. It would be rather anachronistic to call their teachings "Baha'i". Obviously the same is also true with the Qur'an!

 

[Drunk On Love]

I should also note that not a single Traditionalist I mentioned was a Baha'i. The majority were Muslim, a good number were Christians (Catholic or Orthodox) , one was a Hindu, and another was a Buddhist. As a rule they haven't looked to favorably on Baha'i either. No offense intended towards the Baha'i here in me saying that. Just mentioning a fact.

 

[Drunk On Love]

Rene Guenon / Shaykh Abd al-Wahid Yahya 1886-1951

Guenon and Schuon together in the early 20th C.

Seyyed Hossein Nasr


I found some good pictures of a few of them.

 

[steve_bakr]

The station of the Real itself is beyond everything known as "religion". It is beyond the expedient forms that made the journey possible.

True. But we human beings need religion in order to navigate to the "other shore".

 

[Drunk On Love]

True. But we human beings need religion in order to navigate to the "other shore".

I agree. It's dangerous trying to cross the ocean without a raft.

Like the quote from Nasir Khusraw in my signature said 'Religion is the Alchemy that will make it [the soul] gold."

 

[steve_bakr]

Rene Guenon / Shaykh Abd al-Wahid Yahya 1886-1951

Guenon and Schuon together in the early 20th C.

Seyyed Hossein Nasr

I found some good pictures of a few of them.

I have not read Guenon, but I enjoy Schuon and Nasr very much. Nasr did a lot of work in the area of Islamic Philosophy. Schuon's writings about Christianity are collected in a book called, The Fullness of Truth.

 

[Drunk On Love]

You might enjoy Jean Borella then. He is a Roman Catholic theologian who was influenced by Traditionalism. He also had some areas of disagreement with Guenon on Christiantiy though. He thought that as a Muslim he was misunderstanding certain important aspects of the Christian way. He wrote a book on that topic called "Guenonian Esoterism and Christian Mystery."

This books was great as well "
The Secret of the Christian Way: A Contemplative Ascent Through the Writings of Jean Borella.

Father Rama Coomaraswamy is also a Catholic and of the traditionalist school of thought. Here is a link to his books: http://www.superbookshop.net/index.php?page=contributor&contributorId=001409393

 

[Drunk On Love]

The Fullness of Truth.

That was a great book.

 

[steve_bakr]

You might enjoy Jean Borella then. He is a Roman Catholic theologian who was influenced by Traditionalism. He also had some areas of disagreement with Guenon on Christiantiy though. He thought that as a Muslim he was misunderstanding certain important aspects of the Christian way. He wrote a book on that topic called "Guenonian Esoterism and Christian Mystery."

This books was great as well "
The Secret of the Christian Way: A Contemplative Ascent Through the Writings of Jean Borella.

Father Rama Coomaraswamy is also a Catholic and of the traditionalist school of thought. Here is a link to his books: http://www.superbookshop.net/index.php?page=contributor&contributorId=001409393

In my Wishlist at Amazon!

 

[ElijahW]

Lots of names and words I don’t know so this is coming from a fairly ignorant position but I don’t believe in a perennial philosophy… at least not in the esoteric metaphysics area. Ethical beliefs are going to be common just due to the alternatives not being viable for a functional society. I think in the west, the unity is mostly found in the nation they are trying to build, that is thought to be ideal for humanity.

Moses, Plato, Jesus and Muhammad I think would find common ground in trying to build an ideal society, more than a common understanding of the universe. Other than not being superstitious and instead rational attempts at understanding the universe and God. Superstition may be seen as a problem to society by them but I don’t know if that is the same as placing salvatory (?) value on a particular metaphysical belief or mystic ability, other than aligning oneself with reason.

I think the perennial problem trying to be solved is found here with Huxley “So long as men worship the Caesars and Napoleons, Caesars and Napoleons will duly rise and make them miserable. “

The main problem with any type of unity in thinking, is that it is going to be hard to reconcile philosophies that start from the idea that the universe has a beginning, with those that believe it has no beginning. Unless you interpret people who are commonly thought to think one way, as thinking the opposite, to get everyone inline.

 

[Rationalt]

The station of the Real itself is beyond everything known as "religion". It is beyond the expedient forms that made the journey possible.

Totally Unislamic idea.

 

[Tariki]

Totally Unislamic idea.

Well, it is the idea of a human being who chooses to identify as a Muslim.

Maybe the problem is that many seek to define each and every "thing".......and having done so if anything falls outside of their own definition - now considered unanswerable and irrefutable - it is declared not that "thing" at all.

I think the actual world is more fluid than that.

 

[Rationalt]

Well, it is the idea of a human being who chooses to identify as a Muslim.

I am fine with that.

Maybe the problem is that many seek to define each and every "thing".......and having done so if anything falls outside of their own definition - now considered unanswerable and irrefutable - it is declared not that "thing" at all.

I think the actual world is more fluid than that.

Much of this going over my head.But the very idea that islam condones leave alone promote unity of religions is FACTUALLY incorrect.

 

[Montalban]

Well, it is the idea of a human being who chooses to identify as a Muslim.


Maybe the problem is that many seek to define each and every "thing".......and having done so if anything falls outside of their own definition - now considered unanswerable and irrefutable - it is declared not that "thing" at all.

I think the actual world is more fluid than that.

We believe words actually have meaning though.

 

[Tariki]

We believe words actually have meaning though.

Of course they do. Yet they can also "congeal" and blind us to reality as it is.

 

[Montalban]

Of course they do. Yet they can also "congeal" and blind us to reality as it is.

When you said...

Well, it is the idea of a human being who chooses to identify as a Muslim.

were you only offering a truism?

 

[Tariki]

I am fine with that.



Much of this going over my head.But the very idea that islam condones leave alone promote unity of religions is FACTUALLY incorrect.

Once again, IF a human being, grounded in the Islamic Faith, seeks the "unity of religions" then.............

Why talk about "mysterious ways" and then deny it?

(I appreciate you are not a Christian who speaks of "God's mysterious ways")

In one sense we could say that there is no such thing as "Islam", only those who identify with it, each unique.