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Wow, that's a stretch! First of all, I agreed with you that if what you say is true about the movie then there are heretical statements. Second, I haven't tried to "explain away" God's immutable nature; in fact I said that His immutability speaks *to* His nature. And finally, I have never said I didn't believe His Word despite your unsubstantiated claim to the contrary.
It's been real.
As I already said (post #34), God is spirit.
Well given that God is spirit, I think He can manifest Himself anyway He wants to, so I don't see that as heretical.
I think heretical is too strong a word. Christians have had differences from the Bible times to today. In my mind thing that are heretical are things that will separate that person from God.
According to your interpretation of scripture.A false gospel does separate a person from God.
The things we're talking about are not adiaphora. They're not negotiable.
We're talking about things that define the Gospel and which side of these things you come down on determines whether you're following the Gospel of Christ or a false gospel.
So Salvation depends upon perfect Christology, and thus folks who deny Mary as the Mother of God, believed that God died on the cross, or teach the trinity using the analogy of ice, steam and liquid all being water are not saved? Or that Copts, Nestorians, Oriental Orthodox, Quakers,Church of Christ and Eastern Christians are not saved, being they do not ascribe to the first seven ecumenical councils? Not even the Catholic church goes that far. Again, this is not to say Christology is not important, but egads.A false gospel does separate a person from God.
The things we're talking about are not adiaphora. They're not negotiable.
We're talking about things that define the Gospel and which side of these things you come down on determines whether you're following the Gospel of Christ or a false gospel.
So Salvation depends upon perfect Christology
.....or some people are so locked in to their dogma they can't see another perspective (do you recall the Pharisees and their inability to recognize their Messiah?). The account of the stoning of Stephen is --IMO--a really important passage to study. There's a LOT going on there that can easily be missed if just glossed over. ** I mentioned all that, because it's a good biblical example of what happens when we allow our dogma to stagnate our beliefs (and don't allow for ANY flexibility).Some people already are falling for the heresies in the movie.
I think some (many) don't realize that all we have are theories. As an aside, I didn't realize there were so many.Alas, some folks integrate PSA theory into the Gospel and near totally ignore the 7 other major theories to say nothing of the minor ones.
I completely agree. Well said.Bottom line, the film pushes the edges of a box that man chose to put God in. I think that's a good thing, as it causes folks to think through what they really believe... and more so, might lead a few to dig into the scriptures.
Wow.....so your belief of God is that He draws a hard line on the knowledge/understanding/beliefs people have? They better get it right or they burn eternally?No, just sound Christology
For one thing: this occurred in Mac's dream--it wasn't depicted literally. And why is it so unfathomable that the Trinity--being One--submits to one another?Portraying God the Father and God the Holy Spirit as humans, stating that the three persons of the Godhead submit to one another
And not only unfathomable, but, according to some, heretical. This is great. Someone claiming heresy based on their understanding of the Trinity. I daresay NO ONE on earth knows how the Trinity "works" and yet there are those who judge based on it. Sad.For one thing: this occurred in Mac's dream--it wasn't depicted literally. And why is it so unfathomable that the Trinity--being One--submits to one another?
.....or some people are so locked in to their dogma they can't see another perspective
For one thing: this occurred in Mac's dream--it wasn't depicted literally.
And why is it so unfathomable that the Trinity--being One--submits to one another?
Wow.....so your belief of God is that He draws a hard line on the knowledge/understanding/beliefs people have. They better get it right or the burn eternally?
....and how do we discern when there are things left to mystery (which is a LOT)?
We don't know the "why" of a lot of things, because the Bible doesn't spell that out for us
Are you the official arbiter of what is sound doctrine?
Where in Scripture does it speak of this hierarchy?
And where in the movie does it show God submitting to man?
Isn't it said in the Bible that Jesus is "the mediator between God and man"?
The Trinity didn't come as doctrine until 300 years after Jesus, so you'd be right.
Are you the official arbiter of what is sound doctrine?The Bible doesn't allow for "other perspectives". It says that there is sound doctrine and unsound doctrine.
Where in Scripture does it speak of this hierarchy? And where in the movie does it show God submitting to man?Because it contradicts God's Word, which states that there is a hierarchy within the Godhead and that it is man who is to submit to God, never God to man.
....and how do we discern when there are things left to mystery (which is a LOT)? In my opinion---that's where we get caught up--assumptions and conjecture become restricted dogma. We don't know the "why" of a lot of things, because the Bible doesn't spell that out for us (but many have spoken/written as if they KNOW the mind of God--the theories of at-one-ment, for instance....and even salvation isn't crystal clear, but left to some mystery).The Bible doesn't allow for "other perspectives". It says that there is sound doctrine and unsound doctrine.
I'm not a biblical scholar....but from what I've read up on, according to what was debated at the early church councils (still conjecture, like you said)--it was a belief in a hierarchical Trinity that was determined to be heterodox.And not only unfathomable, but, according to some, heretical.
Isn't it said in the Bible that Jesus is "the mediator between God and man"?Portraying God the Father and God the Holy Spirit as humans, stating that the three persons of the Godhead submit to one another and to an, Universalism, the idea that the three persons of the Godhead "spoke ourselves into existence as the son of god", when "Papa" claims that Jesus never drew upon His divine power or authority as God, where "Jesus" says that he's merely one of any ways man may relate to God, etc
I'm not a biblical scholar....but from what I've read up on, according to what was debated at the early church councils (still conjecture, like you said)--it was a belief in a hierarchical Trinity that was determined to be heterodox.
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