The seriousness of "soteriology"

[BibleBeliever1611]

Your belief about salvation determines whether you go to heaven or will burn in the lake of fire for all eternity. Have you ever thought how serious this is? It's not something you want to play around with. The Bible teaches that it would be even better for you to physically cut off your own limb than go to hell. I couldn't even imagine doing that. You say I'm saying things too repulsive for a Christian forum, no, it's the Bible that says it. It's like in a horror movie, except that the Bible is far more scarier than any horror movie ever produced in the history of film industry.

Heaven/Hell is a pretty serious subject and it feels crazy that people are just arguing about all these different teachings on salvation. It's like arguing which is the right way to dissemble a nuclear bomb except even more serious than that. The term "soteriology" makes it sound like salvation was some kind of scientific field of study or something, when in reality it should be as obvious as 1 + 1 = 2. People who have a wrong view on salvation are just as far from God and from heaven as any atheist or Hindu or a Muslim. That's the true story.

"And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:" - Mark 9:45

 

[JohnB445]

it is so serious, that if anyone were to be cast into hell, they would wish they never existed at all, and wish that their existence is extinguished (to cease to exist).

No amount of joy or pleasure derived from this temporary world is worth eternal torment in an inferno.

 

[disciple Clint]

Your belief about salvation determines whether you go to heaven or will burn in the lake of fire for all eternity. Have you ever thought how serious this is? It's not something you want to play around with. The Bible teaches that it would be even better for you to physically cut off your own limb than go to hell. I couldn't even imagine doing that. You say I'm saying things too repulsive for a Christian forum, no, it's the Bible that says it. It's like in a horror movie, except that the Bible is far more scarier than any horror movie ever produced in the history of film industry.

Heaven/Hell is a pretty serious subject and it feels crazy that people are just arguing about all these different teachings on salvation. It's like arguing which is the right way to dissemble a nuclear bomb except even more serious than that. The term "soteriology" makes it sound like salvation was some kind of scientific field of study or something, when in reality it should be as obvious as 1 + 1 = 2. People who have a wrong view on salvation are just as far from God and from heaven as any atheist or Hindu or a Muslim. That's the true story.

"And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:" - Mark 9:45

A formal education in Theology is nice to have but totally unnecessary for salvation. Salvation is simple, accept Jesus and what He did for you, return the love He has shown for you by following His simple instructions, love the Lord your God with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself. There is nothing to fear or to study, Jesus has done it all. If you love God you will want to read His letters to you (the Bible), they explain everything.

 

[testifier_uk]

Is there nothing to fear, when Jesus says to fear ?

Is there people not fearing, and making that mistake ?

Jesus has done it all ( to overcome this world) did Jesus then say we have nothing to do, or instead says, we are to overcome this worlds EVEN AS HE ALSO OVERCAME ?



Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;


Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.






Then the sensible thing to do is to discuss and study deeper than ever before, how to diffuse the wrath of the Lamb, and the burning of the entire world in fire soon, this is old this way of course..



2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

 

[public hermit]

Your belief about salvation determines whether you go to heaven or will burn in the lake of fire for all eternity

People who have a wrong view on salvation are just as far from God and from heaven as any atheist or Hindu or a Muslim. That's the true story

What about people with cognitive deficiencies, do they burn in hell if they don't have the right belief about salvation? I have a neighbor that is a very low functioning autistic, he doesn't even speak. Is he going to burn in hell if he doesn't have the right soteriology? If not, why not?

 

[testifier_uk]

Literally people were deaf, and blind and Jesus cured all illnesses so the deaf could hear, plus gave the Spirit to understand God in the Spirit.

The entrance of Gods words into anyone gives light, which is understanding to the simple..





Isaiah 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.




Psalm 119:130 The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.

 

[BibleBeliever1611]

What about people with cognitive deficiencies, do they burn in hell if they don't have the right belief about salvation? I have a neighbor that is a very low functioning autistic, he doesn't even speak. Is he going to burn in hell if he doesn't have the right soteriology? If not, why not?

I think pretty much everyone is able so understand some language. Little babies would be an exception but if a little baby dies it goes to heaven because we're born innocent. But if you think about it philosophically, there is still an objective truth out there whether someone is able to understand or know about it or not.

 

[testifier_uk]

I think pretty much everyone is able so understand some language. Little babies would be an exception but if a little baby dies it goes to heaven because we're born innocent. But if you think about it philosophically, there is still an objective truth out there whether someone is able to understand or know about it or not.

Psalm 58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Job 3:16 Or as an hidden untimely birth I had not been; as infants which never saw light.

 

[public hermit]

I think pretty much everyone is able so understand some language. Little babies would be an exception but if a little baby dies it goes to heaven because we're born innocent. But if you think about it philosophically, there is still an objective truth out there whether someone is able to understand or know about it or not.

"Whether someone is able to understand it or not" is precisely what matters according to your OP. You said: your belief determines whether you burn in hell or not. So, if someone can't form the right belief, then they burn in hell?

On the other hand, if there are people to whom God is gracious and prevents from burning in hell, like innocent children or those with cognitive deficiencies, then your claim in the OP is in error. What determines is God's grace and not one's belief.

 

[testifier_uk]

Christ died for our sins, we need to turn from them, that is the grace of God, and He calls us by His words of testimony ( told in all the world) and nobody is without excuse all are guilty without exception, all men are commanded everywhere to repent..


Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Acts 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:




The wicked are estranged from the womb, nobody is exempted, that is why all these testimonies have been told, and all the world is become guilty now before God so are commanded to repent or die in unbelief.

 

[BibleBeliever1611]

"Whether someone is able to understand it or not" is precisely what matters according to your OP.

Isn't there an objective truth though? Some religion must be true. Something must be true. And I think everyone believes something. Everyone has some kind of belief about things like God, heaven, the purpose of life, etc. Getting the right belief is easy because if you seek you shall find.

 

[testifier_uk]

The light shined, and men are darkness and understand not the light.

Men ignorantly worship so Christ is declared to all.

Men seek the light ( but darkness comprehends not)

No man can approach to the light..




John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.



Acts 17:23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, To The Unknown God. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.

1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.


1 Timothy 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

 

[testifier_uk]

If anyone seeks with all their heart they can find, but all have a hardened heart which needs to be softened..




Jeremiah 29:13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

Ezekiel 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

 

[public hermit]

Isn't there an objective truth though? Some religion must be true. Something must be true. And I think everyone believes something. Everyone has some kind of belief about things like God, heaven, the purpose of life, etc. Getting the right belief is easy because if you seek you shall find.

Yes, there is a Truth. The question is: what is the determining factor for salvation. If it is having the correct belief, then the subjective state of the individual having the correct belief determines salvation. But if that is the case, then a whole host of people are eliminated through no fault of their own, e.g. those with cognitive disabilities, those who have never heard the info needed to form a correct belief, those who lived prior to Christ and could not have formed the correct belief, those who tried to form the right belief but mistakenly formed the wrong one. If, in contrast to that, God's grace determines salvation, then God determines who is saved according to the infinite wisdom of God, which is a much better and more trustworthy means for determing the everlasting state of God's creatures.

Who would you rather be in charge of your everlasting state, God who has infinite wisdom and love, or you and your ability to form the right belief?

 

[testifier_uk]

God sought out His sheep and it is done, they are now rerturned, keep up a bit..


Ezekiel 34:11 For thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I, even I, will both search my sheep, and seek them out.

Ezekiel 34:12 As a shepherd seeketh out his flock in the day that he is among his sheep that are scattered; so will I seek out my sheep, and will deliver them out of all places where they have been scattered in the cloudy and dark day.

1 Peter 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

 

[Hammster]

Your belief about salvation determines whether you go to heaven or will burn in the lake of fire for all eternity. Have you ever thought how serious this is? It's not something you want to play around with. The Bible teaches that it would be even better for you to physically cut off your own limb than go to hell. I couldn't even imagine doing that. You say I'm saying things too repulsive for a Christian forum, no, it's the Bible that says it. It's like in a horror movie, except that the Bible is far more scarier than any horror movie ever produced in the history of film industry.

Heaven/Hell is a pretty serious subject and it feels crazy that people are just arguing about all these different teachings on salvation. It's like arguing which is the right way to dissemble a nuclear bomb except even more serious than that. The term "soteriology" makes it sound like salvation was some kind of scientific field of study or something, when in reality it should be as obvious as 1 + 1 = 2. People who have a wrong view on salvation are just as far from God and from heaven as any atheist or Hindu or a Muslim. That's the true story.

"And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:" - Mark 9:45

You have a wrong view of salvation.

 

[d taylor]

What about people with cognitive deficiencies, do they burn in hell if they don't have the right belief about salvation? I have a neighbor that is a very low functioning autistic, he doesn't even speak. Is he going to burn in hell if he doesn't have the right soteriology? If not, why not?

Kadesh Barnea

Not one single person who has ever lived will end up in the lake of fire mistakenly.

The Rapture and the Age of Accountability – Grace Evangelical Society​

 

[public hermit]

Kadesh Barnea

Not one single person who has ever lived will end up in the lake of fire mistakenly.

The Rapture and the Age of Accountability – Grace Evangelical Society​

The article argues that God does not hold anyone accountable for what they are not able to do. That's a basic principle of justice, and part of what I'm getting at. If believe formation and having the correct belief determines salvation, then a whole host of people will not be able to meet that criteria. That host would include not only children and those with cognitive deficiencies, but also those who have never heard that upon which to form their belief (gospel), and all those who came prior to Christ. If we start making exceptions for those, then the whole idea that salvation depends on having correct belief falls apart. Even the demons have correct beliefs about God and Christ.

It seems to me the better and more appropriate determining factor is God's grace, which is nothing other than God's will.

 

[d taylor]

Receiving God's free gift of Eternal Life has been made so simple to receive by God.

Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

That many may miss it because satan along with man has created many false ways. That end up having people trust in their own actions, repentance, obedience, commitment, baptism, saying some kind of prayer (ie sinners prayer), confessing Christ, keeping the 10 commandments, loving God, Etc......

But The Messiah states:

You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life.

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

 

[d taylor]

The article argues that God does not hold anyone accountable for what they are not able to do. That's a basic principle of justice, and part of what I'm getting at. If believe formation and having the correct belief determines salvation, then a whole host of people will not be able to meet that criteria. That host would include not only children and those with cognitive deficiencies, but also those who have never heard that upon which to form their belief (gospel), and all those who came prior to Christ. If we start making exceptions for those, then the whole idea that salvation depends on having correct belief falls apart. Even the demons have correct beliefs about God and Christ.

It seems to me the better and more appropriate determining factor is God's grace, which is nothing other than God's will.

Not sure if you read the whole article but it states in the article. That God through grace may during the time of the millennium, raise up people who were handicapped in some way.

Giving them a body/mind not defected by this current sinful age where they can either trust in The Messiah or not.