The Scriptural documentation of the Pre-trib Rapture of the Church and its timing

[Douggg]

1. The falling away was fulfilled in the apostasy of Roman papalism which began in the 4th century.
2. The succession of popes occupied the temple of God (a "naos" spiritual temple, in the Greek), i.e. the Church.
3. The Day of the Lord has not yet occurred, but Paul did not specify a time when it would. Rather, he declared that the two predictions above would occur first, and they have. The Day of the Lord remains to be fulfilled.

Does not match what Paul wrote and Jesus said. It is not a long drawn out over 1600 years - then the Day of the Lord begin. No, it is something in one generation, the parable of the fig tree generation, in a compressed amount of time, those three pre-requirements, and the Day of the Lord begin.

 

[jgr]

Does not match what Paul wrote and Jesus said. It is not a long drawn out over 1600 years - then the Day of the Lord begin. No, it is something in one generation, the parable of the fig tree generation, in a compressed amount of time, those three pre-requirements, and the Day of the Lord begin.

Nowhere does Paul say that everything occurs within one generation.

History confirms Paul's first two predictions.

 

[Douggg]

Nowhere does Paul say that everything occurs within one generation.

History confirms Paul's first two predictions.

Do you know what the Reformers are a duplication of ?

They were like the Thessalonians in 2Thessalonians2, thinking they were in the imminent time of the Day of the Lord. So they were rationalizing that the Papacy was the beast and the Pope(s) the Antichrist, and that the church had become Israel.

But no way was Paul referring to a 1600 year period of time, that began back at the time of Papacy. That misinterpretation totally negates how anyone is to tell that the Day of the Lord is at hand.

Paul was pinpointing when the Day of the Lord was going to take place in concert with what Jesus said regarding the parable of the fig tree - which is a specific generation - not spread over 23 generations (1600 years/70) - with no fulfillment of the Day of the Lord in any of them - proving the Papacy theory to be a misinterpretation.

Everything in our day is matching up with what Jesus said and Paul said - not the Reformers. They got it wrong. Anyone following the reformers theory has to change the days and months in the multitude of end times prophecies to years - in order to force fit a totally failed interpretation.

Israel is a nation again. Jerusalem in the hands of the Jews. The nations listed in Ezekiel 38/39 are getting ready for Gog/Magog. The Jews are expecting their messiah (thinking it is someone else than Jesus) to begin the messianic age of peace and safety. And wanting to rebuild their temple.

The Papacy cannot possible qualify to be the person as the Antichrist and beast. It is one specific man, not an office. That man has to deny that Jesus is the messiah. The Papacy does not say that Jesus is not the messiah - the key element of the Antichrist and revealed man of sin.

The pre-requirements to the Day of the Lord - of the specific generation parable of the fig tree generation - are concentrated to fit in the last week of Daniel 9:27.

So therefore - given that the things regarding the end times generation are at hand - we are to encourage one another that the rapture/resurrection the redemption of our bodies from the earthly to the heavenly is at hand.

 

[seventysevens]

The Papacy cannot possible qualify to be the person as the Antichrist and beast. It is one specific man, not an office. That man has to deny that Jesus is the messiah. The Papacy does not say that Jesus is not the messiah - the key element of the Antichrist and revealed man of sin.

All of these threads and no one actually addressees who the false prophet is
The Papacy does qualify to fill that role as seen by the various things they have already done to mislead people , endorsing the one world church -gathering as many religions as they can to assemble together as one church, - calling Jesus as satan's son, the talk of alien visitors from other worlds - the abrupt removal of the former Pope and replacing him with someone who has an altered view , some reports say that he has denied Jesus as the Son of God
looks to be if one looks for what the papacy does say , there is talking out both sides of the mouth , one side says one thing and the other side say a the opposite -
Is the Pope the Antichrist? | Tribulation | Lamb and Lion Ministries
Pope faces indigenous Canadians' anger over refusal to apologize for past abuse

there are various reports that show what both sides are saying -

 

[seventysevens]

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[seventysevens]

There is not 3.5 years stated in the bible either. It is in the middle of the week, the middle part, not the exact middle, that the person commits the transgression of desolation act. Then a short time later after he is killed and brought back to life as the beast, that the image of him, the abomination of desolation idol, is made and placed in the temple.... 1335 days before Jesus returns.

On one hand you say it is not specific amount of time - then you choose a specific amount of days , so it can be specific as long as it is you that chooses the specific amount
Doug , you need to learn that many people including myself do not feel the need to speak in very specific numbered days when it is not possible to know the exact number of days when prophecy takes place - you make many assumptions . Do you ever text on phones ? lol, brb, I use terms like 3.5 years because it is easy & faster and shorter than typing out mid-week - (8 keystrokes vs 3) If you would try to allow some latitude to understand this it will help your understanding of what people say -

 

[seventysevens]

Their saying peace and safety in 1Thessalonians5 has nothing to does with peace talks or a peace treaty.
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But that is simply your opinion as you cannot prove one way or the other

 

[jgr]

They were like the Thessalonians in 2Thessalonians2, thinking they were in the imminent time of the Day of the Lord. So they were rationalizing that the Papacy was the beast and the Pope(s) the Antichrist, and that the church had become Israel.

There was no need for them to rationalize anything. They were living, and dying, in the belly of the beast. Their perspective was unsurpassed as they directly experienced and witnessed Paul's and other prophetic fulfillments. Their faith and sacrifice bought us the spiritual liberties we enjoy today.

The success of the Reformation in reclaiming the true Church from spiritual darkness is undeniable evidence of God's Hand on and in the Reformers and their efforts.

They didn't burn at the stake for a "rationalization".

 

[Andy centek]

GOOD conversation! Someone out there is thinking.

Andy Centek

 

[Douggg]

All of these threads and no one actually addressees who the false prophet is
The Papacy does qualify to fill that role as seen by the various things they have already done to mislead people , endorsing the one world church -gathering as many religions as they can to assemble together as one church, - calling Jesus as satan's son, the talk of alien visitors from other worlds - the abrupt removal of the former Pope and replacing him with someone who has an altered view , some reports say that he has denied Jesus as the Son of God
looks to be if one looks for what the papacy does say , there is talking out both sides of the mouth , one side says one thing and the other side say a the opposite -
Is the Pope the Antichrist? | Tribulation | Lamb and Lion Ministries
Pope faces indigenous Canadians' anger over refusal to apologize for past abuse

there are various reports that show what both sides are saying -

Do the prophecies regarding the false prophet take place in Rome or Jerusalem?

 

[seventysevens]

Do the prophecies regarding the false prophet take place in Rome or Jerusalem?

Why do you ask ? Why would it matter when the false prophet is the antichrist partner - they work together and there is something called airplanes
So if you are saying it can't be the papacy that would mean that you have no idea who would be the false prophet - does scripture say that the false prophet has to live in Jerusalem or is that just your assumption ?
There are things called embassies

 

[Douggg]

On one hand you say it is not specific amount of time - then you choose a specific amount of days , so it can be specific as long as it is you that chooses the specific amount
Doug , you need to learn that many people including myself do not feel the need to speak in very specific numbered days when it is not possible to know the exact number of days when prophecy takes place - you make many assumptions . Do you ever text on phones ? lol, brb, I use terms like 3.5 years because it is easy & faster and shorter than typing out mid-week - (8 keystrokes vs 3) If you would try to allow some latitude to understand this it will help your understanding of what people say -

For expediency, if a person is going to say 3.5 years, they should preface it by saying nominally 3.5 years.

While the Day of the Lord begins within the 7 years, somewhat near the end of the first half. I never say the Day of the Lord can be known as to the exact day on the 7 years time line - because there is not information to know the exact day the person will go into the temple, sit, claim to be God.

Which is why in 1Thessalonians5, when they say peace and safety - "sudden" destruction will come upon them as the Day of the Lord begins, triggered by the person's act - called the Transgression of Desolation in Daniel 8:12-13.

Differently, the Abomination of Desolation can be pinpointed on the 7 year timeline as to the exact day. It will be 1335 days before Jesus returns. Which the AOD will be setup on day 1185 on the 7 years timeline.

The Abominations of Desolation will be a idol made in the image of the beast. It triggers the great tribulation.

The Transgression of Desolation act (going into the temple, sitting, claiming to be God ), triggers the Day of the Lord - unknown the exact day during the 7 years, but somewhat near the end of the first half.

The Abomination of Desolation idol triggers the Great Tribulation - on the exact day 1185 of the 7 years.



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[Douggg]

Why do you ask ? Why would it matter when the false prophet is the antichrist partner - they work together and there is something called airplanes
So if you are saying it can't be the papacy that would mean that you have no idea who would be the false prophet - does scripture say that the false prophet has to live in Jerusalem or is that just your assumption ?
There are things called embassies

How many prophets are there in the Bible who are not Israelites, Jews ? The place of action of the false prophet is in Israel, because he has the world make the image of the beast, which will be placed in the temple to be worshiped, in Jerusalem. The beast kills the two witnesses in Jerusalem, as the Jews are fleeing when the image is setup in the temple by the false prophet.

The Jews set a cup for Elijah each Passover because they are expecting Elijah to come as part of the messianic era. And in Judaism, based upon history, the Kings of Israel when it was a single united nation were anointed by a prophet. In concert with messiah meaning anointed.

Since the real Elijah is not going to anoint the person as the King of Israel, it is rational to think it will be the false prophet, claiming to be a reincarnation of Elijah, to anoint the person the King of Israel to become the Antichrist. The false prophet will be a Jew. Has nothing to do with the Pope who is associated with Christianity.

That the false prophet is able to do the miracle of fire down from heaven, is another indication that the false prophet will claim to be Elijah - as that is what Elijah did.

 

[Douggg]

There was no need for them to rationalize anything. They were living, and dying, in the belly of the beast. Their perspective was unsurpassed as they directly experienced and witnessed Paul's and other prophetic fulfillments. Their faith and sacrifice bought us the spiritual liberties we enjoy today.

The success of the Reformation in reclaiming the true Church from spiritual darkness is undeniable evidence of God's Hand on and in the Reformers and their efforts.

They didn't burn at the stake for a "rationalization".

You are mixing apples and oranges.

The issue is not what the reformers achieved and suffered, but their interpretations of the end times prophecies.

 

[seventysevens]

For expediency, if a person is going to say 3.5 years, they should preface it by saying nominally 3.5 years..

NOT ! and I told you why not !

 

[seventysevens]

How many prophets are there in the Bible who are not Israelites, Jews ? The place of action of the false prophet is in Israel, because he has the world make the image of the beast, which will be placed in the temple to be worshiped, in Jerusalem. The beast kills the two witnesses in Jerusalem, as the Jews are fleeing when the image is setup in the temple by the false prophet.

The Jews set a cup for Elijah each Passover because they are expecting Elijah to come as part of the messianic era. And in Judaism, based upon history, the Kings of Israel when it was a single united nation were anointed by a prophet. In concert with messiah meaning anointed.

Since the real Elijah is not going to anoint the person as the King of Israel, it is rational to think it will be the false prophet, claiming to be a reincarnation of Elijah, to anoint the person the King of Israel to become the Antichrist. The false prophet will be a Jew. Has nothing to do with the Pope who is associated with Christianity.

That the false prophet is able to do the miracle of fire down from heaven, is another indication that the false prophet will claim to be Elijah - as that is what Elijah did.

So you just make assumptions as you go just to make scripture fit your suppositions

 

[Douggg]

NOT ! and I told you why not !

Cell phone usage is not a reason to give misleading information.

 

[Douggg]

So you just make assumptions as you go just to make scripture fit your suppositions

It is not the Pope for certain. He does not fit the 70 weeks profile of being for Daniel's people Israel and Jerusalem.

 

[seventysevens]

Cell phone usage is not a reason to give misleading information.

If you call using "generalized " terms misleading information then you have some real problems in understanding language , if you cannot understand that is your problem and not mine as you don't get to dictate anything on that matter !

 

[seventysevens]

It is not the Pope for certain. He does not fit the 70 weeks profile of being for Daniel's people Israel and Jerusalem.

More suppositions without any proof