The Scientific Method & Macroevolution?

[whois]

Where does resenberger say fraud?

i posted the quote verbatum, do you have any comments on it?

 

[bhsmte]

i posted the quote verbatum, do you have any comments on it?

Point to where he said "fraud".

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

Reading back:

<edit>


No, that's not the evidence for common descent. When I've presented you with a small piece of the evidence, you said it was over your head. If you know that you don't understand the evidence for something as basic as common descent, why on earth do you think you are in a position to judge what experts mean about more subtle matters? Why, indeed, aren't you trying to understand the evidence you've been giving, rather than raising different points?

i presented you with evidence in regards to "your experiment", evidence you have yet to answer.

whois,
Please provide me with a link to sfs' experiment and your evidence?

 

[whois]

whois,
Please provide me with a link to sfs' experiment and your evidence?

that's a matter between me and sfs.

 

[crjmurray]

i posted the quote verbatum, do you have any comments on it?

You said Rensberger claimed that horse transitional fossils are frauds. I asked about fraud. Where does rensberger say fraud?

 

[crjmurray]

"We would not have predicted stasis from population genetics, but I am now convinced from what the paleontologists say that small changes do not accumulate."- from the article in Science by Lewin, attributed to Dr. Ayala

"I don't know how Roger Lewin could have gotten in his notes the quotation he attributes to me. I presented a paper/lecture and spoke at various times from the floor, but I could not possibly have said (at least as a complete sentence) what Lewin attributes to me. In fact, I don't know what it means. How could small changes NOT accumulate! In any case, virtually all my evolutionary research papers evidence that small (genetic) changes do accumulate."- direct quote of Dr Ayala from personal correspondence between him and Richard Arrowsmith.

Just wanted to throw this into the conversation.

 

[whois]

"We would not have predicted stasis from population genetics, but I am now convinced from what the paleontologists say that small changes do not accumulate."- from the article in Science by Lewin, attributed to Dr. Ayala

"I don't know how Roger Lewin could have gotten in his notes the quotation he attributes to me. I presented a paper/lecture and spoke at various times from the floor, but I could not possibly have said (at least as a complete sentence) what Lewin attributes to me. In fact, I don't know what it means. How could small changes NOT accumulate! In any case, virtually all my evolutionary research papers evidence that small (genetic) changes do accumulate."- direct quote of Dr Ayala from personal correspondence between him and Richard Arrowsmith.

Just wanted to throw this into the conversation.

too bad sepkoski uses the very same quote 10 years after the fact in a paper co authored by gould.
gould was at the conference where this quote was made.
i seriously doubt if gould would have allowed this qoute if it was cooked.
i asked seposki about this and he refused to answer the question.

 

[crjmurray]

too bad sepkoski uses the very same quote 10 years after the fact in a paper co authored by gould.
gould was at the conference where this quote was made.
i seriously doubt if gould would have allowed this qoute if it was cooked.
i asked seposki about this and he refused to answer the question.

The guy who supposedly said it, says he didn't say it. Gould doesn't get to decide what other people say. What's the title of the paper?

 

[Loudmouth]

yes, when you post them.

You mean that you have never looked? You are making the claim that human HOX genes can not change by one base without ever looking at human genetic variation?

Just from common sense perspective, you are ignoring all of the synonymous mutations right off the bat. For example, a known mutation in the human PAX2 gene that is carried by 37% of the population:

click here

it's the most recent that i'm aware of.

Sure looks like they had a meeting in 2014:

Evolution 2014 | Evolution 2014

I am guessing that you didn't even do a simple Google search for "evolution conference"? I have found that creationists tend to be averse to using Google, for some odd reason.

i never said they did to my knowledge.

We are talking about the accumulation of mutations. Perhaps you should quote appropriate material?

 

[crjmurray]

And don't forget my question about fraud.

 

[bhsmte]

And don't forget my question about fraud.

You will get your answer, when I get mine, in regards to whois' claim that there are laws that force the teaching of evolution.

 

[Loudmouth]

too bad sepkoski uses the very same quote 10 years after the fact in a paper co authored by gould.
gould was at the conference where this quote was made.
i seriously doubt if gould would have allowed this qoute if it was cooked.
i asked seposki about this and he refused to answer the question.

Like many creationists, you seemed obsessed with quotes and seem to ignore the evidence.

 

[sfs]

yes, when you post them.

Here:

The little red lines at the bottom of the page, labeled with rs numbers, are nonsynonymous (that's what the red means) genetic variants in the gene HoxB3 (shown in the blue blocks near the top).

it's the most recent that i'm aware of.
have any others where 150 scientists gathered to discuss the issue, if so then post it now.

I already told you of two meetings on evolution that happen every year. SMBE meeting get about 600 attendees (I've spoken at that one) and the vertebrate paleontologists get about twice that number. If you want dates, google "SMBE annual meeting".

 

[crjmurray]

You will get your answer, when I get mine, in regards to whois' claim that there are laws that force the teaching of evolution.

Lots of court cases and statutes against the teaching of evolution but none requiring it that I'm aware of.

Edit: Found no statutes BUT I have found school boards requiring the teaching of biological evolution. Florida in 08 for example.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

that's a matter between me and sfs.

It may be seen that way to you, but this is a public forum. Your replies here in this regard are now part of this thread and therefore my request for a link to sfs' experiment and your evidence, is a perfectly reasonable request. Thanks in advance.

 

[Loudmouth]

The little red lines at the bottom of the page, labeled with rs numbers, are nonsynonymous (that's what the red means) genetic variants in the gene HoxB3 (shown in the blue blocks near the top).

Thanks. I was trying to figure that out at HapMap.

I already told you of two meetings on evolution that happen every year. SMBE meeting get about 600 attendees (I've spoken at that one) and the vertebrate paleontologists get about twice that number. If you want dates, google "SMBE annual meeting".

The European EvoDevo meeting would be fun to attend:

https://evodevo2014.univie.ac.at/

 

[sfs]

that's a matter between me and sfs.

Then for my sake tell me where your evidence is, because I must have missed it (preferably without accusing me of lying again).

 

[bhsmte]

Lots of court cases and statutes against the teaching of evolution but none requiring it that I'm aware of.

Edit: Found no statutes BUT I have found school boards requiring the teaching of biological evolution. Florida in 08 for example.

Yes, school boards don't make laws, as whois has claim regarding laws being in place to force the teaching of evolution.

 

[Loudmouth]

Yes, school boards don't make laws, as whois has claim regarding laws being in place to force the teaching of evolution.

I am also unaware of any law that forces the teaching of creationism. I am only aware of various lawsuits that has prevented religious beleifs, like creationism, from being taught in public school science classes.

 

[whois]

You mean that you have never looked?

yes i have.

You are making the claim that human HOX genes can not change by one base without ever looking at human genetic variation?

where oh where did i make such a post?

For example, a known mutation in the human PAX2 gene that is carried by 37% of the population:

click here

????

Sure looks like they had a meeting in 2014:

Evolution 2014 | Evolution 2014

from the link:
When you are at the Museum, check out the artwork on display by former NESCent artist-in-residence, Lynn Fellman. At the conference, look out for the NESCent/HHMI Evolution Film Festival on Saturday night — all of these mixers and receptions are included with registration.

i was talking about a serious, invite only, conference, not a "social" gathering.

I am guessing that you didn't even do a simple Google search for "evolution conference"? I have found that creationists tend to be averse to using Google, for some odd reason.

correct.
i do not use google.

We are talking about the accumulation of mutations. Perhaps you should quote appropriate material?

i have been, maybe you missed it.