THE SABBATH TRUTH!

Bob S · Apr 2, 2020

visionary said:
So what laws is Paul using to condemn?
Galatians 5:19-21
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

As you can plainly read all were not from the ten commandments. I don't even know if all of those are even mentioned in all of the old covenant laws. Maybe you can enlighten me on that.

Bob S · Apr 2, 2020

Dkh587 said:
David prophesied about it in Psalms 110

Where does it mention His second coming. It says:
The Lord says to my lord:

‘Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet.’
The Word sat at the right hand of God from eternity.

Dkh587 · Apr 2, 2020

Bob S said:
Where does it mention His second coming. It says:
The Lord says to my lord:

‘Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet.’
The Word sat at the right hand of God from eternity.

Why did you stop at verse 1?

do you not believe the Messiah is returning to the earth?

visionary · Apr 2, 2020

Bob S said:
As you can plainly read all were not from the ten commandments. I don't even know if all of those are even mentioned in all of the old covenant laws. Maybe you can enlighten me on that.

You think that the ten are only literal or do you just not see the spiritual application Yeshua was trying to teach?

Jesse Johnson · Apr 2, 2020

Bob S said:
Please show me where anyone prophesied anything about His second coming in the Old Testament.

And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
Zechariah 12:10

Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.
Daniel 2:34-35

Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him. He shall call to the heavens from above, and to the earth, that he may judge his people. Gather my saints together unto me; those that have made a covenant with me by sacrifice. And the heavens shall declare his righteousness: for God is judge himself. Selah.
Psalms 50:3-6

And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
Isaiah 2:4

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
Isaiah 9:6,7

And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Isaiah 11:11-12

The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth. And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited. Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously.
Isaiah 24:20-23

He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of His people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it. And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for Him,
and He will save us: this is the Lord, we have waited for Him, we will be glad and rejoice in His salvation.
Isaiah 25:8-9

Thy dead shall live, my dead body shall arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
Isaiah 26:19

There are just too many to list.

visionary · Apr 2, 2020

1984 Orson Wells told a story about the double talk, where it is stated one way but taken another by others. So is this thread. People have been taught one way which isn't the Jewish mind understanding or point they were trying to make when it was written.

LoveGodsWord · Apr 2, 2020

Bob S said:
Lets see what James is really telling us since the law keeper has used it to discredit my post.
James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one [point], he is become guilty of all. 11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou dost not commit adultery, but killest, thou art become a transgressor of the law. In other words if I were under the WHOLE law and I broke any of the 613 commands of the WHOLE law that pertained to the citizens who were/are under those laws I would be guilty of breaking all of them. What a burden to have to bear.

Not really Bob, here is why. Your trying to read into the scriptures what the scriptures do not say or teach. For example "the whole law" is in reference to the context and subject matter being discussed. The context and subject matter being discussed is God's 10 commandments....

JAMES 2:10-12 [10], For WHOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW, AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE IS GUILTY OF ALL. [11], For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, SAID ALSO, DO NOT KILL. NOW IF YOU COMMIT NO ADULTERY, YET IF YOU KILL, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF THE LAW. [12], So speak you, and so do, as they that shall be JUDGED BY THE LAW OF LIBERTY.

Notice that JAMES is quoting the sixth and seventh commandments from God's 10 commandments found in EXODUS 20:13-14 directly from God's 10 commandments? How many commandments are there in God's 10 commandments; 9; 10 or 613? (scripture please).

Here are mine...

EXODUS 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote on the tables the words of the covenant, the TEN COMMANDMENTS.

DEUTERONOMY 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them on two tables of stone.

DEUTERONOMY 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the TEN COMMANDMENTS, which the LORD spoke to you in the mount out of the middle of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them to me.

James is stating that if we break any one of God's 10 commandments we stand guilty before God as breaking all of His laws v10. This includes Gods' 4th commandment which is one of God's 10 commandments *EXODUS 20:8-11. It is not a burden to love God and keep his commandments *JOHN 14:15. It is a burden if we do not love God and a sign we need to seek God for a new heart to love according to his new covenant promise to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12 from JEREMIAH 31:31-36.

Bob S said:
I am so thankful that I am not under the whole law. I am also so thankful that God has given me the wisdom to search in scripture for the real truth. I have barely scratched the surface of scripture that refutes those who would put me under the laws of the Sinai covenant, Hagar. I joyfully submit myself to be under the Royal Law of Love, Jesus new covenant, Sarah.

Bob, I believe you are confused here as according to the scriptures, no one is "UNDER THE LAW" if they have through faith have God's forgiveness for their sins (breaking God's LAW) *1 JOHN 3:4; 1 JOHN 1:9; ROMANS 8:1-4. We are only "UNDER THE LAW" according to the scriptures if we stand before God guilty of breaking the law (sin) because through the law is the knowledge of sin.

ROMANS 3:19-20 [19], Now we know that what things soever the law said, it said to them who are UNDER THE LAW: THAT EVERY MOUTH MAY BE STOPPED, AND ALL THE WORLD MAY BECOME GUILTY BEFORE GOD. [20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN.

Bob S said:
Galatians 4:20-26, 30-31
Hagar and Sarah
21 Tell me, you who want to be under the law, are you not aware of what the law says? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the slave woman and the other by the free woman. 23 His son by the slave woman was born according to the flesh, but his son by the free woman was born as the result of a divine promise. 24 These things are being taken figuratively: the women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children who are to be slaves: this is Hagar. 25 Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother...... 30 But what does Scripture say? ‘Get rid of the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman’s son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman’s son.’ 31 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.

Galatians 5:18
But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law (the whole law).

Galatians 4:3-5
3 So also, when we were under age, we were in slavery under the elemental spiritual forces of the world. 4 But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those under the law, that we might receive adoption to sonship.

Romans 6:14
For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.

Bob I have no problem with the scriptures you quote here as ROMANS 3:19 as shown above defines what it means to be "UNDER THE LAW". To be "UNDER THE LAW" simply means in that case to be guilty before God of breaking the law (SIN).

No one is suggesting here whatsoever that our salvation comes from keeping the law. According to the scriptures we are only saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW what Gods Word says. Doing what God's Word says is the FRUIT of faith that works by a new heart that LOVES given in the new covenant promise of a new heart *HEBREWS 8:10-12. Salvation is from sin (breaking any one of God’s 10 Commandments) not to continue in sin *ROMANS 6:1-23; JOHN 8:31-36. This is God's work in us * PHILIPPIANS 2:13. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. You cannot separate faith and works according to the scriptures just the same as you cannot separate love and law as it is the fruit of OBEDIENCE to God's Word which is how love to God and man is expressed. This is the same as how we express our faith by doing what God asks us to do.

The scriptures your posting are in relation to the two covenants. Letters on stone to condemnation and death and God's LAW written on the heart to love through the Spirit which is God's new covenant promise of HEBREWS 8:10-12 from JEREMIAH 31:31-36 to love and love is the establishing and fulfilling (doing) God's Law in all those who believe and follow Gods' Word. This is why JESUS says "ON THESE TWO GREAT COMMANDMENTS OF LOVE TO GOD AND MAN HANG ALL THE LAW and the prophets *MATTHEW 22:36-40.

Paul teaches the same thing here...

ROMANS 13:8-10 [8], Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.

Note: the Greek word used here for FULFILLED G4137 πληρόω; plēroō means to execute and to satisfy; to accomplish; to perfect; to complete; to perfect or to supply or give. The context is the law nomos; application and context is the 10 commandments.

[9], For this, YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT KILL, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, YOU SHALL NOT COVET; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly summed up in this saying, namely, YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.
[10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

This is also what JAMES is referring to here...

JAMES 2:8-11 [8], IF YOU FULFILL THE ROYAL LAW ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE, YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF, YOU DO WELL:

Note: Paul says in ROMANS 13:8-10 that Loving your neighbore is simply summing up six of God's 10 commandments *EXODUS 20:12-17 as quoted by Paul in Romans

[9], But IF YOU HAVE RESPECT TO PERSONS, YOU COMMIT SIN, AND ARE CONVINCED OF THE LAW AS TRANSGRESSORS. [10], FOR WHOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW, AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE IS GUILTY OF ALL. [11], For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, SAID ALSO, DO NOT KILL. Now if you COMMIT NO ADULTERY, YET IF YOU KILL, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF THE LAW.

James is saying the same as Paul in reference to ROMANS 13:8-10.

This is why JESUS says "IF YOU LOVE ME KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS in JOHN 14:15. If we are born again to LOVE brother we will not practice sin *1 JOHN 3:6-9 which is defined in God's Word as breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments *1 JOHN 3:4; JAMES 2:10-11 because LOVE is expressed through obedience to what God says through faith.

Sorry Bob, it seems Gods Word disagrees with you.

Hope this is helpful.

Religiot · Apr 4, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all friendly discussion please.

Some try to claim that the Sabbath given at creation is a claim that is not true but is that the truth according to the scriptures? I would like to examine this in detail to show why the Sabbath was indeed given to mankind at creation and this was the reason God made the Sabbath.

So the question we are considering here is...

1. WAS THE SABBATH GIVEN TO MANKIND AT CREATION?
2. WHY DID GOD MAKE THE SABBATH?

..................

Let's start with the scriptures showing when God made the seventh day Sabbath and see why it was made and who it was made for and connect all the scriptures starting in GENESIS...

WHERE IS THE SABBATH IN GENESIS 2:1-3?

GOD's 4th Commandment is refering to GENESIS 2:1-3 in EXODUS 20:8-11.

GENESIS 2:1-3 [1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. [2], And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] on the SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made. [3], And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY: because that in it he had RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] from all his work which God created and made.

Links to God’s 4th Commandment

EXODUS 20:8-11 [8], REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY, TO KEEP IT HOLY [Made Holy at creation GENESIS 2:3]. [9], Six days shall you labor, and do all your work: [10], But THE SEVENTH DAY [ Genesis 2:1-3] IS THE SABBATH OF THE LORD YOUR GOD : in it you shall not do any work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, your manservant, nor your maidservant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger that is within your gates: [WHY?] [11], FOR IN SIX DAYS THE LORD MADE HEAVEN AND EARTH, THE SEA, AND ALL THAT IS IN THEM IS, AND RESTED THE SEVENTH DAY; WHEREFORE THE LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY. [Refering to GENESIS 2:1-3]

Look at the HEBREW WORD meanings again...

GENESIS 2:1-3 [1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. [2], And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] on the SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made. [3], And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY: because that in it he had RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] from all his work which God created and made.

The Hebrew word for RESTED used here is שׁבת; shâbath (H7673). It's meaning is; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, KEEP SABBATH, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

שׁבת; shâbath or REST (H7673) is the ORIGIN or ROOT word for שׁבּת; shabbâth (H7676) which is used in God's 4th commandments translated into english as SABBATH. The HEBREW Word for shabbâth meaing is the intermission between SABBATHS or shâbath (H7673) REST or the continuation meaing from one SABBATH REST to the Next SABBATH REST continuation or EVERY SABBATH. It's application is in God's 4th commandment EXODUS 20:8 is to REMEMBER [EVERY] Sabbath [shabbâth H7676].

In the 4th commandment *EXODUS 20:8-11; v11 tells us the ORIGINS of God's 4th commandments Sabbath is in reference to GENESIS 2:1-3 and the reason why it is given as a memorial of Greation to whorship God as the creator of Heaven and Earth.

...............

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - H7673
REST from GENESIS 2:1-3 שׁבת shâbath A primitive root; to REPOSE, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, CELEBRATE, cause (make) to fail, KEEP SABBATH, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) REST, rid, still, take away.

REST is the root word verb for SABBATH KEEPING. SABBATH is the noun of what is being kept.

Note here in GENESIS 2:1-3 that it was in the creation week when God had finished his creation in six days that He rested on the SEVENTH DAY of the week from all His Work that he had made and He "SET APART" the seventh day of the week and "BLESSED" the seventh day" and made the seventh day a "HOLY DAY" of rest. The seventh day SABBATH therefore according to the scriptures is "GOD'S REST"

In the Hebrew the word for "REST" used in GENESIS 2:1-3 is the root word of "SABBATH which is a noun or discription of what is being RESTED. The Hebrew word used here for "REST" is the verb for Sabbath keeping while the Hebrew word for Sabbath is simply the noun of what is being kept by "RESTING". The verb REST or RESTING is how the SABBATH is kept (שׁבת; shâbath (H7673).

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong -
RESTED 7673. שָׁבַת shâbath, shaw-bath´; a prim. root; to repose, i.e. desist from exertion; used in many impl. relations (caus., fig. or spec.):—(cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep or observe the sabbath, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

The HEBREW word for REST (שָׁבַת shâbath) is the verb of how the SABBATH (שַׁבָּת shabbâth) noun is to be kept which is by RESTING from our works while what is being rested is the noun which is the SABBATH.

The word RESTED used above in Genesis 2 is the root word used in the 4th Commandment. This word means to "KEEP SABBATH" to desist from exertion [context is work or ending work and blessing and making the SEVENTH DAY a HOLY DAY].

The reason why the SABBATH was made was not because God needed rest but for mankind to remember and celebrate God as the God of creation. JESUS in His own Words as the God of creation says this in His own words here...

MARK 2:27 [27], And he said to them, THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN and not man for the Sabbath.

The Greek word used here for MAN is G444 ἄνθρωπος; anthrōpos From G435 and ὤψ ōps (the countenance ; from G3700); manfaced, that is, a human being: - certain, man.

JESUS tells has that the Sabbath was made for mankind on the "SEVENTH DAY" of the creation week. JESUS is the LORD of the SABBATH *MARK 2:28 and commands His people to "REMEMBER" the Sabbath which is the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week and to keep the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week as a "HOLY DAY OF REST" as a memorial of creation and a celebration of JESUS as the God of creation in EXODUS 20:8-11. Lets look at the links in God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments to GENESIS 2:1-3 of when the seventh day Sabbath was created and link this back to the new testament scriptures...

EXODUS 20:8-11 [8], REMEMBER the SABBATH DAY, to KEEP IT HOLY. <Why?> [Because JESUS made it a Holy day of rest for mankind and commands us to keep it as a Holy day] [9], Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: [10], But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the LORD thy God [This is a direct reference from God's Word defining what the Sabbath is; The SABBATH = the SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK]: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: <WHY> [11], For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

The reason for the Sabbath Commandment is to REMEMBER the God of creation. He rested on the SEVENTH DAY of the WEEK, BLESSED the SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK and made it a HOLY DAY that no work is to be done. v11 Refers back to Genesis 2:1-3 and the origin of the Sabbath. v8 shows that this commandment is a MEMORIAL of creation v11 [the reason for the 4th commandment].

Summary of the above is simply that GENESIS 2:1-3 is the origin of when God made the Sabbath for all mankind according to the words of JESUS. RESTING on the Sabbath from our work is SABBATH KEEPING or how the Sabbath is kept. As we from the heart obey Gods' 4th commandment we enter into Gods' REST of the "seventh day Sabbath"
GENESIS 2:1-3 is INDEED the ORIGIN of the SABBATH (First Sabbath). It is the SEVENTH DAY of creation that God blessed, set apart and made a HOLY DAY for all mankind. Nearly every section of GENESIS 2:1-3 is repeated in EXODUS 20:8-11 of God's 4th commandment as the reason why we are to REMEMBER God's Sabbath.

This links directly into the new testament scriptures of believing the gospel of our Lord JESUS Christ here...

HEBREWS 4:1-11
[1], Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into HIS REST, any of you should seem to come short of it.
[2], For to us was the gospel preached, as well as to them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
[3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into MY REST: ALTHOUGH THE WORKS WERE FINISHED FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.
[4], FOR HE SPOKE IN A CERTAIN PLACE (GENSIS 2:1-3) OF THE SEVENTH DAY ON THIS WISE, AND GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS.
[5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into MY REST.

NOTE: CONTEXT is God's REST from the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST OF CREATION (v4-5) and those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD's WORD enter into God's SABBATH REST as GOD did on the SEVENTH DAY of the week. CONTEXT is GOD's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST and those who BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD enter into that rest which God's WORD defines as the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH which is GOD'S REST!

The scriptures show that God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH according to the very words of JESUS was made for mankind at the seventh day of the creation week. While mankind was made on the sixth day of the creation week. ADAM and EVE where the first to keep God's SABBATH.

God bless.

Yes, brother, to anyone who looks into it, the Sabbath of the Lord was obviously made as a gift to man, and just like God gave His Son to man, but most men rejected Him, so too do they the same with His Sabbath.

To reject God's gifts is to reject Him, and to reject Him is certain death.

Moreover, it is obvious, that the Sabbath has also been a sign, to all of mankind, that God did indeed create the Heaven and the Earth, and made Himself known by the obviously arbitrary orders all creation must follow, especially that of the seven-day week -- a rule so completely contrary to the conventions of men, who decide all manner of order by round numbers of ten, yet throughout the history of man, the week remains at seven, regardless of language, culture, or preference...

The following is picture from a document that illustrates the above comment:

Religiot · Apr 4, 2020

Religiot said:
Yes, brother, to anyone who looks into it, the Sabbath of the Lord was obviously made as a gift to man, and just like God gave His Son to man, but most men rejected Him, so too do they the same with His Sabbath.

To reject God's gifts is to reject Him, and to reject Him is certain death.

Moreover, it is obvious, that the Sabbath has also been a sign, to all of mankind, that God did indeed create the Heaven and the Earth, and made Himself known by the obviously arbitrary orders all creation must follow, especially that of the seven-day week -- a rule so completely contrary to the conventions of men, who decide all manner of order by round numbers of ten, yet throughout the history of man, the week remains at seven, regardless of language, culture, or preference...

The following is picture from a document that illustrates the above comment:

Added a pdf also:

LoveGodsWord · Apr 5, 2020

Religiot said:
Yes, brother, to anyone who looks into it, the Sabbath of the Lord was obviously made as a gift to man, and just like God gave His Son to man, but most men rejected Him, so too do they the same with His Sabbath.

To reject God's gifts is to reject Him, and to reject Him is certain death.

Moreover, it is obvious, that the Sabbath has also been a sign, to all of mankind, that God did indeed create the Heaven and the Earth, and made Himself known by the obviously arbitrary orders all creation must follow, especially that of the seven-day week -- a rule so completely contrary to the conventions of men, who decide all manner of order by round numbers of ten, yet throughout the history of man, the week remains at seven, regardless of language, culture, or preference...

The following is picture from a document that illustrates the above comment:

Yes great posts Religiot. I would rate them WINNER if I could. I have some interesting resources on this if your interested let me know and I will try and track them down for you. What I have is

1. A compilation of historical references showing that JESUS and the apostles and the disciples of the early Church all through time to this very present day kept the Sabbath unbroken (many scriptures and historical references as evidence)

2. The seventh day is known as the Sabbath day in most languages arount the world (includes dictionary definitions showing that Saturday is the seventh day Sabbath). This list (and I think I chart I have as well) proves that Saturday is the seventh day Sabbath in most cultures and countries around the world.

Let me know if your interested I will see if I can track them down.

Blessings

Religiot · Apr 5, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Yes great posts Religiot. I would rate them WINNER if I could. I have some interesting resources on this if your interested let me know and I will try and track them down for you. What I have is

1. A compilation of historical references showing that JESUS and the apostles and the disciples of the early Church all through time to this very present day kept the Sabbath unbroken (many scriptures and historical references as evidence)

2. The seventh day is known as the Sabbath day in most languages arount the world (includes dictionary definitions showing that Saturday is the seventh day Sabbath). This list (and I think I chart I have as well) proves that Saturday is the seventh day Sabbath in most cultures and countries around the world.

Let me know if your interested I will see if I can track them down.

Blessings

Yes, brother, I am very interested, thank you.

pasifika · Apr 6, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all friendly discussion please.

Some try to claim that the Sabbath given at creation is a claim that is not true but is that the truth according to the scriptures? I would like to examine this in detail to show why the Sabbath was indeed given to mankind at creation and this was the reason God made the Sabbath.

So the question we are considering here is...

1. WAS THE SABBATH GIVEN TO MANKIND AT CREATION?
2. WHY DID GOD MAKE THE SABBATH?

..................

Let's start with the scriptures showing when God made the seventh day Sabbath and see why it was made and who it was made for and connect all the scriptures starting in GENESIS...

WHERE IS THE SABBATH IN GENESIS 2:1-3?

GOD's 4th Commandment is refering to GENESIS 2:1-3 in EXODUS 20:8-11.

GENESIS 2:1-3 [1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. [2], And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] on the SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made. [3], And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY: because that in it he had RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] from all his work which God created and made.

Links to God’s 4th Commandment

EXODUS 20:8-11 [8], REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY, TO KEEP IT HOLY [Made Holy at creation GENESIS 2:3]. [9], Six days shall you labor, and do all your work: [10], But THE SEVENTH DAY [ Genesis 2:1-3] IS THE SABBATH OF THE LORD YOUR GOD : in it you shall not do any work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, your manservant, nor your maidservant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger that is within your gates: [WHY?] [11], FOR IN SIX DAYS THE LORD MADE HEAVEN AND EARTH, THE SEA, AND ALL THAT IS IN THEM IS, AND RESTED THE SEVENTH DAY; WHEREFORE THE LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY. [Refering to GENESIS 2:1-3]

Look at the HEBREW WORD meanings again...

GENESIS 2:1-3 [1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. [2], And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] on the SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made. [3], And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY: because that in it he had RESTED [שׁבת; shâbath H7673; Keep Sabbath] from all his work which God created and made.

The Hebrew word for RESTED used here is שׁבת; shâbath (H7673). It's meaning is; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, KEEP SABBATH, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

שׁבת; shâbath or REST (H7673) is the ORIGIN or ROOT word for שׁבּת; shabbâth (H7676) which is used in God's 4th commandments translated into english as SABBATH. The HEBREW Word for shabbâth meaing is the intermission between SABBATHS or shâbath (H7673) REST or the continuation meaing from one SABBATH REST to the Next SABBATH REST continuation or EVERY SABBATH. It's application is in God's 4th commandment EXODUS 20:8 is to REMEMBER [EVERY] Sabbath [shabbâth H7676].

In the 4th commandment *EXODUS 20:8-11; v11 tells us the ORIGINS of God's 4th commandments Sabbath is in reference to GENESIS 2:1-3 and the reason why it is given as a memorial of Greation to whorship God as the creator of Heaven and Earth.

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Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - H7673
REST from GENESIS 2:1-3 שׁבת shâbath A primitive root; to REPOSE, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, CELEBRATE, cause (make) to fail, KEEP SABBATH, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) REST, rid, still, take away.

REST is the root word verb for SABBATH KEEPING. SABBATH is the noun of what is being kept.

Note here in GENESIS 2:1-3 that it was in the creation week when God had finished his creation in six days that He rested on the SEVENTH DAY of the week from all His Work that he had made and He "SET APART" the seventh day of the week and "BLESSED" the seventh day" and made the seventh day a "HOLY DAY" of rest. The seventh day SABBATH therefore according to the scriptures is "GOD'S REST"

In the Hebrew the word for "REST" used in GENESIS 2:1-3 is the root word of "SABBATH which is a noun or discription of what is being RESTED. The Hebrew word used here for "REST" is the verb for Sabbath keeping while the Hebrew word for Sabbath is simply the noun of what is being kept by "RESTING". The verb REST or RESTING is how the SABBATH is kept (שׁבת; shâbath (H7673).

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong -
RESTED 7673. שָׁבַת shâbath, shaw-bath´; a prim. root; to repose, i.e. desist from exertion; used in many impl. relations (caus., fig. or spec.):—(cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep or observe the sabbath, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

The HEBREW word for REST (שָׁבַת shâbath) is the verb of how the SABBATH (שַׁבָּת shabbâth) noun is to be kept which is by RESTING from our works while what is being rested is the noun which is the SABBATH.

The word RESTED used above in Genesis 2 is the root word used in the 4th Commandment. This word means to "KEEP SABBATH" to desist from exertion [context is work or ending work and blessing and making the SEVENTH DAY a HOLY DAY].

The reason why the SABBATH was made was not because God needed rest but for mankind to remember and celebrate God as the God of creation. JESUS in His own Words as the God of creation says this in His own words here...

MARK 2:27 [27], And he said to them, THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN and not man for the Sabbath.

The Greek word used here for MAN is G444 ἄνθρωπος; anthrōpos From G435 and ὤψ ōps (the countenance ; from G3700); manfaced, that is, a human being: - certain, man.

JESUS tells has that the Sabbath was made for mankind on the "SEVENTH DAY" of the creation week. JESUS is the LORD of the SABBATH *MARK 2:28 and commands His people to "REMEMBER" the Sabbath which is the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week and to keep the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week as a "HOLY DAY OF REST" as a memorial of creation and a celebration of JESUS as the God of creation in EXODUS 20:8-11. Lets look at the links in God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments to GENESIS 2:1-3 of when the seventh day Sabbath was created and link this back to the new testament scriptures...

EXODUS 20:8-11 [8], REMEMBER the SABBATH DAY, to KEEP IT HOLY. <Why?> [Because JESUS made it a Holy day of rest for mankind and commands us to keep it as a Holy day] [9], Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: [10], But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the LORD thy God [This is a direct reference from God's Word defining what the Sabbath is; The SABBATH = the SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK]: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: <WHY> [11], For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

The reason for the Sabbath Commandment is to REMEMBER the God of creation. He rested on the SEVENTH DAY of the WEEK, BLESSED the SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK and made it a HOLY DAY that no work is to be done. v11 Refers back to Genesis 2:1-3 and the origin of the Sabbath. v8 shows that this commandment is a MEMORIAL of creation v11 [the reason for the 4th commandment].

Summary of the above is simply that GENESIS 2:1-3 is the origin of when God made the Sabbath for all mankind according to the words of JESUS. RESTING on the Sabbath from our work is SABBATH KEEPING or how the Sabbath is kept. As we from the heart obey Gods' 4th commandment we enter into Gods' REST of the "seventh day Sabbath"
GENESIS 2:1-3 is INDEED the ORIGIN of the SABBATH (First Sabbath). It is the SEVENTH DAY of creation that God blessed, set apart and made a HOLY DAY for all mankind. Nearly every section of GENESIS 2:1-3 is repeated in EXODUS 20:8-11 of God's 4th commandment as the reason why we are to REMEMBER God's Sabbath.

This links directly into the new testament scriptures of believing the gospel of our Lord JESUS Christ here...

HEBREWS 4:1-11
[1], Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into HIS REST, any of you should seem to come short of it.
[2], For to us was the gospel preached, as well as to them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
[3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into MY REST: ALTHOUGH THE WORKS WERE FINISHED FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.
[4], FOR HE SPOKE IN A CERTAIN PLACE (GENSIS 2:1-3) OF THE SEVENTH DAY ON THIS WISE, AND GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS.
[5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into MY REST.

NOTE: CONTEXT is God's REST from the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST OF CREATION (v4-5) and those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD's WORD enter into God's SABBATH REST as GOD did on the SEVENTH DAY of the week. CONTEXT is GOD's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST and those who BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD enter into that rest which God's WORD defines as the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH which is GOD'S REST!

The scriptures show that God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH according to the very words of JESUS was made for mankind at the seventh day of the creation week. While mankind was made on the sixth day of the creation week. ADAM and EVE where the first to keep God's SABBATH.

God bless.

Hello, I couldn’t find scripture of the 7th day sabbath being given to mankind at creation...but it was given to those who came out of Egypt...Ezekiel 20:10-12...”Therefore I led them out of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness. I gave them my decrees and made known to them my laws, by which the person who obeys them will live. Also I gave them my sabbaths as a sign between us, so they would know that I the Lord made them holy....

LoveGodsWord · Apr 6, 2020

pasifika said:
Hello, I couldn’t find scripture of the 7th day sabbath being given to mankind at creation...but it was given to those who came out of Egypt...Ezekiel 20:10-12...”Therefore I led them out of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness. I gave them my decrees and made known to them my laws, by which the person who obeys them will live. Also I gave them my sabbaths as a sign between us, so they would know that I the Lord made them holy....

Hello pasifika, nice to meet you. God's Sabbath according to JESUS was made for mankind on the seventh day of the creation week *MARK 2:27. What was it you could not understand from the very scriptures in the post you were quoting from which prove the Sabbath was made at the end of creation *GENESIS 2:1-3; EXODUS 20:8-11?

Jesse Johnson · Apr 6, 2020

pasifika said:
Hello, I couldn’t find scripture of the 7th day sabbath being given to mankind at creation...but it was given to those who came out of Egypt...Ezekiel 20:10-12...”Therefore I led them out of Egypt and brought them into the wilderness. I gave them my decrees and made known to them my laws, by which the person who obeys them will live. Also I gave them my sabbaths as a sign between us, so they would know that I the Lord made them holy....

What do you think "person" means?

Jesse Johnson · Apr 6, 2020

(Colossians 2:16)
Or of the Sabbath days - Greek, "of the Sabbaths." The word Sabbath in the Old Testament is applied not only to the seventh day, but to all the days of holy rest that were observed by the Hebrews, and particularly to the beginning and close of their great festivals. There is, doubtless, reference to those days in this place, since the word is used in the plural number, and the apostle does not refer particularly to the Sabbath properly so called. There is no evidence from this passage that he would teach that there was no obligation to observe any holy time, for there is not the slightest reason to believe that he meant to teach that one of the ten commandments had ceased to be binding on mankind. If he had used the word in the singular number - "the Sabbath," it would then, of course, have been clear that he meant to teach that that commandment had ceased to be binding, and that a Sabbath was no longer to be observed. But the use of the term in the plural number, and the connection, show that he had his eye on the great number of days which were observed by the Hebrews as festivals, as a part of their ceremonial and typical law, and not to the moral law, or the Ten Commandments. No part of the moral law - no one of the ten commandments could be spoken of as "a shadow of good things to come." These commandments are, from the nature of moral law, of perpetual and universal obligation.—Albert Barnes, Notes on the New Testament: Explanatory and Practical. Vol. VII: Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians, c. 1835

Jesse Johnson · Apr 6, 2020

(Colossians 2:16)
It is plain from the argument that the Sabbath is here regarded not as it was primevally (Genesis 2:3) “made for man” (Mark 2:27), God’s benignant gift, fenced with precept and prohibition only for His creature’s bodily and spiritual benefit; but as it was adopted to be a symbolic institution of the Mosaic covenant, and expressly adapted to relation between God and Israel (Exodus 31:12-17); an aspect of the Sabbath which governs much of the language of the O.T. about it. In that respect the Sabbath was abrogated, as the sacrifices were abrogated, and the New Israelite enters upon the spiritual realities foreshadowed by it as by them. The Colossian Christian who declined the ceremonial observance of the Sabbath in this respect was right. An altogether different question arises when the Christian is asked to “secularize” the weekly Rest which descends to us from the days of Paradise, and which is as vitally necessary as ever for man’s physical and spiritual well-being.--Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges (Commentary), Colossians & Philemon - H. C. G. Moule - 1898

pasifika · Apr 6, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Hellpasifika, nice to meet you. God's Sabbath according to JESUS was made for mankind on the seventh day of the creation week *MARK 2:27. What was it you could not understand from the very scriptures in the post you were quoting from which prove the Sabbath was made at the end of creation *GENESIS 2:1-3; EXODUS 20:8-11?

Hello, do you think there is a difference if something "made" and something "given"... Mark 2:27 state that the Sabbath was "made" didn't mention was "given"...
I already quote you a verse that state when the Sabbath (s) was given...

LoveGodsWord · Apr 6, 2020

pasifika said:
Hello, do you think there is a difference if something "made" and something "given"... Mark 2:27 state that the Sabbath was "made" didn't mention was "given"...
I already quote you a verse that state when the Sabbath (s) was given...

Hello pasifika nice to see you again. Not sure what happened to the beginning of the post you are quoting from me as I never said "hellpasifika" to you. Back to your question.

MARK 2:27 [27], And he said to them, THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN and not man for the Sabbath.

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - G444
MAN is G444 ἄνθρωπος; anthrōpos From G435 and ὤψ ōps (the countenance ; from G3700); manfaced, that is, a human being: - certain, man.

Adam and Eve (MAN) who God created the Sabbath for were made on the Sixth day of Creation *GENESIS 1:26-31.

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - H120
אדם; 'âdâm; aw-dawm'From H119; ruddy, that is, a human being an individual or the species, mankind, etc.: - X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.

Webster's Unabridged Dictionary, 1828 - Man
MAN, n. plu. men. [Heb.species, kind, image, similitude.]
Mankind; the human race; the whole species of human beings; beings distinguished from all other animals by the powers of reason and speech, as well as by their shape and dignified aspect. ""Os homini sublime dedit."
And God said, Let us make man in our image, , after our likeness, and let them have dominion--Gen 1.
Man that is born of a woman, is of few days and full of trouble. Job 14.
My spirit shall not always strive with man. Gen 6.
I will destroy man whom I have created. Gen 6.
There hath no temptation taken you, but such as is common to man. 1 Cor 10.
It is written,man shall not live by bread alone. Mat 4.
There must be somewhere such a rank as man.
Respecting man, whatever wrong we call--
But vindicate the ways of God to man.
The proper study of mankind is man.
In the System of Nature, man is ranked as a distinct genus.
When opposed to woman, man sometimes denotes the male sex in general.
Woman has, in general, much stronger propensity than man to the discharge of parental duties.

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The Sabbath was made and given to man (Adam and Eve) on the "seventh day" of creation according to the scriptures in GENESIS 2:1-3 not EXODUS 20. Further proof the God's people already knew about the Sabbath is in GENESIS 26:5 and EXODUS 16.

Hope this is helpful

pasifika · Apr 6, 2020

Jesse Johnson said:
What do you think "person" means?

Individual from those (people) whom God specifically gave His decree, laws and Sabbath to...who do you think this passage (Ezekiel 20:10-12) is referring to?

LoveGodsWord · Apr 6, 2020

pasifika said:
Individual from those (people) whom God specifically gave His decree, laws and Sabbath to...who do you think this passage (Ezekiel 20:10-12) is referring to?

Sorry dear friend. Not sure what your trying to say here maybe it is me if so forgive me. Can you explain yourself a little further?

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