The Sabbath timing in the first century AD

[Deafsilence]

It's not in the Holy Bible, like I stated I only go by God's written Word. We are told to not change one Word Proverbs 30:5-6 and Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Scripture is the true Word of God and I choose to stay in scripture so I am not deceived. You have free will.

If you were alive in the 4th century AD, that would have been possibly your only Holy Bible. Now if you believe your not to change one Word, then you should wonder why it was removed from the Bible.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Again, stop jumping from place to place and from topic to topic and let us keep the discussion about the verse in question.

This is the same topic and same conversation. If you can't answer the question, just say so, otherwise please provide the scripture. You seem to be making the accusation that the Sabbath commandment was no longer a commandment after Jesus died and/or rose. If this is what you believe, then we would surely have scripture that reinforces your belief. You have not posted any, so I assume its not there. Which goes back to my point that we are required to keep all of the commandments of God including the Sabbath commandment for everyday Christian living and was shown by Jesus and the apostles as our example to follow.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

If you were alive in the 4th century AD, that would have been possibly your only Holy Bible. Now if you believe your not to change one Word, then you should wonder why it was removed from the Bible.

The New Testament Christians were all reading and teaching from the Old Testament. I believe God is in charge of His Word but I know the devil is doing his best to deceive as many as possible.

This is all the time I have for now. Have a blessed day. Take care.

 

[trophy33]

This is the same topic and same conversation. If you can't answer the question, just say so, otherwise please provide the scripture. You seem to be making the accusation that the Sabbath commandment was no longer a commandment after jesus died and/or rose. if this is what you believe, then we would surely have scripture that reinforces your belief. You have not posted any, so I assume its not there. Which goes back to my point that we are required to keep all of the commandments of God including the Sabbath commandment for everyday Christian living and was shown by Jesus and the apostles as our example to follow.

Again, let us stay in Luke 23:56, thats the current topic.

Let me remind you - you posted the verse as the first one for proving we must keep Sabbath. I am asking you how this verse proves it.

The verse is about Jewish women keeping the commandment before the New Covenant was clear to them. Therefore, it cannot be used for your case.

 

[DamianWarS]

Agreed, there are more laws than the Ten Commandments, but that is certainly part of God's laws. Jesus used the word "fulfilled" to not mean the opposite i.e. destroy or no longer required and shown in context to Matthew 5:19. Fulfill means to fill-full. When I fulfill my wedding covenant it means I am keeping it, not disregarding so I can commit adultery and thats no longer a sin.

You have a logic problem then. You accept a selection of laws while rejecting another selection while saying at the same time we should keep and teach them all. You have a covenant relationship in marriage that you are not bound to if one should die. So covenants are not innately universal and in the right conditions may be rendered complete.

A covenant is an agreement. The agreement was changed, not the laws. Which is why you have God writing His laws in our hearts and minds in the New Covenant. Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33 and why we see the Ten Commandments repeated in the New Testament for everyday Christian living. It is still a sin to break the Ten Commandments in the New Covenant as shown in Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7, 1 John 3:4, James 2:10-12, Matthew 19:17,

The 10 commands are "the two tablets of covenant law" They are not the tablets that transcend covenant law or the tablets of universal law. The agreement is to keep the laws which the tablets are of the laws and the Sabbath is a sign of the agreement (Ex 31) where the laws don't change the agreement to keep them does. Your sources for the 10 commandments shown in scripture are about law not about explicitly the 10 commandments. What justification do you have to conflate these verses to just the 10? And if not the 10 and the entire law then we are back to the logic problem of supporting some laws but not others.

No, I very clearly showed you the meaning verse by verse. All I receive from you in an opinion not backed by the scriptures.

I have backed it all up with scripture. Which part do you say there is no scripture to back it up?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Again, let us stay in Luke 23:56, thats the current topic.

Let me remind you - you posted the verse as the first one for proving we must keep Sabbath. I am asking you how this verse proves it.

The verse is about Jewish women keeping the commandment before the New Covenant was clear to them.

This is just one verse that reinforces the other 150+ about the Sabbath being the only holy day of the Lord thy God, the only day God blessed, the only day God sanctified, and the day God commanded man to keep holy Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11 the day Jesus kept as our example Luke 4:16-22, John 15:10 and the apostles kept as our example. The apostles were keeping the Sabbath long after Jesus descended back to heaven Acts 13:42, Acts 13:44, Acts 17:2. Acts 18:4 and Jesus spoke about the Sabbath being kept up until His second coming. Matthew 24:20. And after Isaiah 66:22-23.

The New Covenant started in the Old Testament Jermiah 31:34 and was repeated in the New testament Hebrews 8:10.

If there was a change to one of the commandments of God, where is the scripture? This would be huge considering it is what we will be judged on. James 2:10-12, Revelation 11:19. God saints keep the commandments up until the very end even though it is just a remnant Revelation 12:17, Revelation 14:12, Revelation 22:14-15.

I believe the clear written Word of God. We do not have a God of confusion and if you can't find the scripture that Jesus deleted the commandments that He kept as our example, I would be concerned. We are told in scripture the Sabbath would be changed, but not by God. Daniel 7:25. I am so grateful to our Lord and Savior for giving us clear scripture to safeguard our actions so we can be sure we are following God and not the other spirit who we are told deceives the whole world.

This is all the times I have for right now.

Be blessed and take care.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You have a logic problem then. You accept a selection of laws while rejecting another selection while saying at the same time we should keep and teach them all. You have a covenant relationship in marriage that you are not bound to if one should die. So covenants are not innately universal and in the right conditions may be rendered complete.



The 10 commands are "the two tablets of covenant law" They are not the tablets that transcend covenant law or the tablets of universal law. The agreement is to keep the laws which the tablets are of the laws and the Sabbath is a sign of the agreement (Ex 31) where the laws don't change the agreement to keep them does. Your sources for the 10 commandments shown in scripture are about law not about the explicitly the 10 commandments. What justification do you have to conflate these verses to just the 10? And if not the 10 and the entire law then we are back to the logic problem of supporting some laws but not others.



I have backed it all up with scripture. Which part do you say there is no scripture to back it up?

If my logic problem is following God's written Word, then I'm guilty. Previously addressed- there are more laws that we should keep aside from the Ten commandments, so you are making an argument that I am not making.

 

[DamianWarS]

If my logic problem is following God's written Word, then I'm guilty. Previously addressed- there are more laws that we should keep aside from the Ten commandments, so you are making an argument that I am not making.

I am quoted saying "You accept a selection of laws while rejecting another selection while saying at the same time we should keep and teach them all." I was intentionally careful and did not say that it was only the 10 commandments. Let's keep this to the words we say, not the words we don't say.

But this is avoiding the problem. Your logic problem is saying to follow a group of laws while not keeping another group then saying Christ tells us to keep them all. Another problem is your conflating broad statements about law with a very narrow list that the text does not establish.

So how exactly do you establish what the law/commandments of God are and what is your criteria for not including all the laws? More importantly what are you sources? You do realise some of the verses you quote explicitly say "all of the law"

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I am quoted saying "You accept a selection of laws while rejecting another selection while saying at the same time we should keep and teach them all." I was intentionally careful and did not say that it was only the 10 commandments. Let's keep this to the words we say, not the words we don't say.

But this is avoiding the problem. Your logic problem is saying to follow a group of laws while not keeping another group then saying Christ tells us to keep them all. Another problem is your conflating broad statements about law with a very narrow list that the text does not establish.

So how exactly do you establish what the law/commandments of God are and what is your criteria for not including all the laws? More importantly what are you sources? You do realise some of the verses you quote explicitly say "all of the law"

You make an accusation, but don't actually quote me saying this. Please post where I said we only need to keep the Ten commandments and reject all other laws? Not all laws are commandments, some are judgements, statues and ordinances. God made a distinction regarding this.

Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”
And the statutes, the ordinances, the law, and the commandment which He wrote for you, 2 Kings 17:37

There are different laws that serves different purposes. If you read in the new covenant, it clearly shows what changed. I'm happy to go over that with you when I have more time. But please do not accuse me of things that are not true and not supported by my posts.

God bless.

 

[trophy33]

This is just one verse that reinforces the other 150+

But how does it reinforce it? Thats my question.

What in the verse says or at least indicates that the Sabbath should be kept in the New Covenant?

If nothing, then we can move to another verse in your list.

Quantity is not quality. Having 150 verses when each one, if scrutinized, does not say it, is like having 0.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

But how does it reinforce it? Thats my question.

What in the verse says or at least indicates that the Sabbath should be kept in the New Covenant?

If nothing, then we can move to another verse in your list.

Quantity is not quality. Having 150 verses when each one, if scrutinized, does not say it, is like having 0.

I already answered your question. Here it is again. Hebrews 4:9-10, Luke 23:56, Matthew 24:20 and the examples of Jesus who kept the commandments and the Sabbath Luke 4:16, John 15:10 (do you not believe this scripture? 1 Peter 2:21-22) and the example of the apostles after Jesus went back to heaven as commissioned by Jesus, to teach the world what Jesus taught.

You keep wanting to have your opinion equal to scriptures. I don't see any scriptures you have posted that discredits the scriptures in my post. You are placing opinion vs scripture.

I also disagree, if you have 150 scriptures saying one thing and 1 scripture that seems like its saying something different you should reply on the weighted evidence. More than likely that one scripture is not saying what you think it does. All scripture has to reconcile and there is no scripture where you or anyone else that has answered these questions:

1. Where is the 4th commandment deleted in scripture?
2. Where does it say the first day (Sunday) is a new day of worship for God or for man?
3. Where did God bless the first day?
4. Where did God sanctify the first day?
5. Where does it say the first day is holy to God?
6. Where does it say the first day is the holy day to man?
7. Where is the commandment for Sunday keeping? Written by God’s own finger?
8. Where does it say on the New Earth and New heaven we will be worshipping now on the first day?

If one wants to follow God's Word you would think it would be written somewhere in scripture. . .these scriptures are all reserved for the seventh day Sabbath, the holy day of the Lord thy God from the very beginning Genesis 2:1-3 all throughout scripture and to eternity Isaiah 66:22-23 like God promised. Exodus 31:16.

 

[Deafsilence]

Hi everyone can we get back to the OP. I think things have gotten far off track here. Otherwise, I may request to just close this thread which I don't want to do.

 

[trophy33]

I already answered your question. Here it is again. Hebrews 4:9-10, Luke 23:56, Matthew 24:20 and the examples of Jesus who kept the commandments and the Sabbath Luke 4:16, John 15:10 (do you not believe this scripture? 1 Peter 2:21-22) and the example of the apostles after Jesus went back to heaven as commissioned by Jesus to teach the world what Jesus taught.

You keep wanting to have your opinion equal to scriptures. I don't see any scriptures you have posted that discredits the scriptures in my post. You are placing opinion vs scripture.

I also disagree, if you have 150 scriptures saying one thing and 1 scripture that seems like its saying something different you should reply on the weighted evidence. More than likely that one scripture is not saying what you think it does. All scripture has to reconcile and there is no scripture where you or anyone else that has answered these questions:

1. Where is the 4th commandment deleted in scripture?
2. Where does it say the first day (Sunday) is a new day of worship for God or for man?
3. Where did God bless the first day?
4. Where did God sanctify the first day?
5. Where does it say the first day is holy to God?
6. Where does it say the first day is the holy day to man?
7. Where is the commandment for Sunday keeping? Written by God’s own finger?
8. Where does it say on the New Earth and New heaven we will be worshipping now on the first day?

If one wants to follow God's Word you would think it would be written somewhere in scripture. . .these scriptures are all reserved for the seventh day Sabbath, the holy day of the Lord thy God from the very beginning Genesis 2:1-3 all throughout scripture and to eternity Isaiah 66:22-23 like God promised. Exodus 31:16.

It seems you do not understand my question.

My question is about Luke 23:56.

How does this one verse say or reinforce etc that we should keep Sabbath in the New Covenant. Where in the verse you see such thing?

 

[BABerean2]

Ignoring the Truth does not make it go away.

You are good at ignoring the scripture below.

Heb 8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.


Heb 12:18 For you have not come to the mountain that may be touched and that burned with fire, and to blackness and darkness and tempest, (Mount Sinai)

Heb 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.

.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

It seems you do not understand my question.

My question is about Luke 23:56.

How does this one verse say or reinforce etc that we should keep Sabbath in the New Covenant. Where in the verse you see such thing?

Answered...

And on the sabbath they rested according to the commandment. Luke 23:56

They are already in the New Covenant. The new covenant started in the Old Testament. Jeremiah 31:33 and repeated verbatim in the NT. Hebrews 8:10. God's laws written on the hearts and minds. I answered yours please answer mine.


1. Where is the 4th commandment deleted in scripture?
2. Where does it say the first day (Sunday) is a new day of worship for God or for man?
3. Where did God bless the first day?
4. Where did God sanctify the first day?
5. Where does it say the first day is holy to God?
6. Where does it say the first day is the holy day to man?
7. Where is the commandment for Sunday keeping? Written by God’s own finger?
8. Where does it say on the New Earth and New heaven we will be worshipping now on the first day?

 

[trophy33]

Answered...

And on the sabbath they rested according to the commandment. Luke 23:56

Ah, so you believe that the women already knew the New Covenant and its rules? Is this your presupposition?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Ah, so you believe that the women already knew the New Covenant and its rules? Is this your presupposition?

Yes and the commandment is still the commandment as supported by my previous posts, they were living in the New Covenant stated in the days of Jeremiah Jeremiah 31:33. Do you plan on ever answering my questions? Does not make for a nice discussion if I have to keep answering the same question over again, but you not answer any of mine.

 

[trophy33]

Yes and the commandment is still the commandment.

Finally I got some answer.

But if they knew and understood the new things, how is it that they did not even understand that Jesus will rise from the dead?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Finally I got some answer.

But if they knew and understood the new things, how is it that they did not even understand that Jesus will rise from the dead?

Who said they understood all things after Jesus died at that point? We can't read their minds only God can do that. They knew the Sabbath was still a commandment because that is what is shown in scripture and there is nothing stating otherwise and you have yet to prove this so it seems like a silly line of questioning.

I answered your question, please answer mine.

1. Where is the 4th commandment deleted in scripture?
2. Where does it say the first day (Sunday) is a new day of worship for God or for man?
3. Where did God bless the first day?
4. Where did God sanctify the first day?
5. Where does it say the first day is holy to God?
6. Where does it say the first day is the holy day to man?
7. Where is the commandment for Sunday keeping? Written by God’s own finger?
8. Where does it say on the New Earth and New heaven we will be worshipping now on the first day?

 

[trophy33]

Who said they understood all things after Jesus died at that point? We can't read their minds only God can do that. They knew the Sabbath was still a commandment because that is what is shown in scripture and there is nothing stating otherwise and you have yet to prove this so this seems like a silly line of questioning.

I answered our question, please answer mine.

1. Where is the 4th commandment deleted in scripture?
2. Where does it say the first day (Sunday) is a new day of worship for God or for man?
3. Where did God bless the first day?
4. Where did God sanctify the first day?
5. Where does it say the first day is holy to God?
6. Where does it say the first day is the holy day to man?
7. Where is the commandment for Sunday keeping? Written by God’s own finger?
8. Where does it say on the New Earth and New heaven we will be worshipping now on the first day?

Iam trying to understand why you see the verse as proving that we must keep Sabbath. Your constant try to react with dozen of antiquestions is not helpful and is very distracting. Please, concentrate on the verse.

So, you do not know if they understood the new things. Why then are they our example we should follow? We obviously know much more than they did in the day the verse is about.