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Nathan David said:OK, no problem.
Volition: animals desire sex, and make a conscious decision (volition) to pursue sexual relations.
Perception: animals perceive that they enjoy sex.
I don't think my dog makes a conscious decision to eat horse manure, but she sure takes pleasure in it.
Jet Black said:dolphins also show self awareness.
Colossians said:Not more NECESSARY more EFFECTIVE. To use an analogy, a bow and arrow will kill, but a gun is far more efficient.
You are comparing apples with oranges: evolution has no perception or intelligence. You analogy is moot.
Nathan David said:I think this is the best worded of the many correct answers to the questions in the OP.
I also think there is a misconception in the OP. Animals do not desire [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], they desire sex. Once they experience [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], they are likely to desire sex even more through simple Pavlovian conditioning.
Both.Něco hrubého said:What category is my prize in?
Ridiculousness?
Unpronounceability?
Then we just will assume that your name is "Kittycat of the Gods".Něco hrubého said:It's not easy to explain Czech that way...There's a few online dictionaries with soundbites of each word you can find.
It's a real bummer of a language to learn, too...kind of like Georgian. People are known to commit suicide after a really good Georgian class.
Colossians said:We have seen alot of bluff here. But no answers from the evolutionist camp which address the philosophical impasse.
Colossians said:And we have seen bluff of the kind designed to suck in naive moderators to rule against things like "trolling". (Always assign a label to the opposition's style which is ostensibly in the name of diplomacy - makes you at least look noble when you lack brilliance. If you can't beat them then by your argument, at least you can disqualify them by the rules!)
Colossians said:Here is a typical example of the sort of cart-before-horse thinking we get from their camp, which sums up just nicely the redundancy of their position:
Pleasure is a good incentive to reproduce. If you don't enjoy reproducing, you are less likely to be willing to invest the time and energy to reproduce
Synopsis:
I perceive a need to reproduce (of course I myself am a reproduction, but that doesn't matter here.. I'm don't notice circularity when I am presenting it), and so I have a great incentive to reproduce (afterall, if I dont reproduce, my grand children won't be able to talk about me in years to come.)
Colossians said:But although I have this great incentive, it is not great enough: I need to 'evolve' a pleasure on top of my incentive, which will become my incentive.
So the pleasure which evolves emanates out of my initial incentive to stay alive, but by some special wizardry, is more necessary than my initial incentive to stay alive (otherwise I would not have needed to evolve it).
And although I cannot evolve all of an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] in my own life-time, I pass on the part I have evolved (sort of like passing on part-pregnancy) to those whom I am currently reproducing without [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], in order that they might be able to reproduce....eh...
Colossians said:Evolutionists like trying to pull themselves off the ground by their own bootstraps.
And then they tell you this occured because their bootstraps needed to be pulled.
Colossians said:The evolutionist has convinced himself that no intelligence behaves as one with intelligence would behave.
He reasons that an organism can memorize pleasure, and then change itself so that it will get more of the same in generations to come. So he has organisms with perception, who like joy-trips, and wished they'd evolved more of them in their own life-time.
I can just hear these organisms now: "If only we'd known what pleasure we could have had earlier! Now it's too late! But let's pass on what we have learned to our progeny whom we produce without this pleasure! Yeah! Great idea!"
Once again our evolution friends have our ends producing another's path to it.
In the Republic of Evolutionary, rain falls on people because cows are wearing raincoats.
Colossians said:Jet Black,
Here is a hint or 2 for you and your cronies (to help you get to the gist of things):
1. Pleasure has no utility where volition is absent.
Colossians said:2. Pleasure is a non-entity where perception is absent.
Evolution 'needs' for species to reproduce, that is the whole idea!Colossians said:You need to think again, this time at the fundamental level.
I am logging off now - it is late in this part of the world. When I next attend this thread, I will expect a thoughtful response to the full ramifications of the 2 pointers I have provided in bold font.
And I shall expect such from you.
www.dictionary.com said:ev·o·lu·tion
- A gradual process in which something changes into a different and usually more complex or better form. See Synonyms at development.
- Biology.
- Change in the genetic composition of a population during successive generations, as a result of natural selection acting on the genetic variation among individuals, and resulting in the development of new species.
they seem to find sex pleasurable and do it for fun, like certain other great apes. dolphins are also one of the only animals other than humans that commit gang rape.the_gloaming said:Oh yeah...oops. Anyone know if they have [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] ?
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