The problems I see with a God who predetermines and predestines all (of everything)...

[Neogaia777]

The problems I see with a God who determines or made or predetermined and predestined "all" to the way it all is, all the time and always, and people to be who and what they are, all that, is: for one, how could he (God) judge or condemn someone for being bad, if that's the way he made them (to be)...? I answer that by saying that yes, he does make some bad people and bad seeds, and predestines some to go to hell even, and they did not have any choice in the matter, which makes him (God) responsible, right...?

Well, some are made for this fallen world and fallen time for the purpose of being a "standing example to us in the next life", as to what "not" to do, or how "not" to be, all that, what mistakes not to make, so we won't mess up the next life, where we will have to choice or option to... Cause there (in heaven) will we will have the option and choice of messing it up if we want to, just like in the beginning, the difference is we will have some experience as to what that choice to mess it up will do, and we have those created to be examples to and for us as to what not to do or how not to be... Anyway, we will be able to mess up heaven basically, but absolutely none of will ever choose to ever or anymore, or for forevermore... Partially due to the people who were made to be examples to and for us (who end up in hell, and who were made to go to be in hell)...

Now, that being said, the problem is, in this life here, we "don't know"... We "don't know" who is who, what is what, basically... So, we have to proceed based on that not knowing and not being able to know, (who's who, what's what, basically)... And the way we proceed based on not knowing is that everyone is "in question" as to where they stand with God, their salvation, (or going to hell) (all that) form our point of view or perspective... We just "don't know" where hardly anyone is or stands in that for sure... So, we have to, for one, first determine what is required to be saved or to be standing on the right side of things in the afterlife, and cause we generally don't know where anyone is or stands (with God) (or in the afterlife) for sure, we have determine what it is that determines that, and then try to make sure that we are on the right side and in right standing, and also, as many others as we can also...

Now God already knows, but we don't... In fact, he already predetermined, "all" long ago, but we do not get to have much insight into, or know much anything about that, (that he knows about), (till we get to the afterlife)...

Once we determine what will make us on the right side in the afterlife, we then need to tell others and help others be or wind up on the "right side" also... Problem is that their seems to be no solid black and white in this, and it usually depends on the heart of an individual, and individual by individual circumstances, that, we also, don't know much about most of the time, or do not have much insight into a lot of the time... Sure, some think there is a solid black and white, and think they know, but how often have they turned out to be so very wrong most of the time and have sinned greatly in doing so...?

We may be able to say that, for certain, in most cases, specific really terrible, horrible sins, in most cases (though maybe not absolutely all) unrepented of, or unchanged, will keep a person out of heaven and will land them in hell... On these things we might be able to judge and speak out against, done for the sake of trying to warn others and save them...

But, what are these... That's what we need to figure out I think, before we judge anything...

Anyway,

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

The problems I see with a God who determines or made or predetermined and predestined "all" to the way it all is, all the time and always, and people to be who and what they are, all that, is: for one, how could he (God) judge or condemn someone for being bad, if that's the way he made them (to be)...? I answer that by saying that yes, he does make some bad people and bad seeds, and predestines some to go to hell even, and they did not have any choice in the matter, which makes him (God) responsible, right...?

Well, some are made for this fallen world and fallen time for the purpose of being a "standing example to us in the next life", as to what "not" to do, or how "not" to be, all that, what mistakes not to make, so we won't mess up the next life, where we will have to choice or option to... Cause there (in heaven) will we will have the option and choice of messing it up if we want to, just like in the beginning, the difference is we will have some experience as to what that choice to mess it up will do, and we have those created to be examples to and for us as to what not to do or how not to be... Anyway, we will be able to mess up heaven basically, but absolutely none of will ever choose to ever or anymore, or for forevermore... Partially due to the people who were made to be examples to and for us (who end up in hell, and who were made to go to be in hell)...

Now, that being said, the problem is, in this life here, we "don't know"... We "don't know" who is who, what is what, basically... So, we have to proceed based on that not knowing and not being able to know, (who's who, what's what, basically)... And the way we proceed based on not knowing is that everyone is "in question" as to where they stand with God, their salvation, (or going to hell) (all that) form our point of view or perspective... We just "don't know" where hardly anyone is or stands in that for sure... So, we have to, for one, first determine what is required to be saved or to be standing on the right side of things in the afterlife, and cause we generally don't know where anyone is or stands (with God) (or in the afterlife) for sure, we have determine what it is that determines that, and then try to make sure that we are on the right side and in right standing, and also, as many others as we can also...

Now God already knows, but we don't... In fact, he already predetermined, "all" long ago, but we do not get to have much insight into, or know much anything about that, (that he knows about), (till we get to the afterlife)...

Once we determine what will make us on the right side in the afterlife, we then need to tell others and help others be or wind up on the "right side" also... Problem is that their seems to be no solid black and white in this, and it usually depends on the heart of an individual, and individual by individual circumstances, that, we also, don't know much about most of the time, or do not have much insight into a lot of the time... Sure, some think there is a solid black and white, and think they know, but how often have they turned out to be so very wrong most of the time and have sinned greatly in doing so...?

We may be able to say that, for certain, in most cases, specific really terrible, horrible sins, in most cases (though maybe not absolutely all) unrepented of, or unchanged, will keep a person out of heaven and will land them in hell... On these things we might be able to judge and speak out against, done for the sake of trying to warn others and save them...

But, what are these... That's what we need to figure out I think, before we judge anything...

Anyway,

God Bless!

In fact this fallen world and fallen time was and is (a) very necessary part of the overall plan for a much better and brighter future... Without the fallen time as part of the plan or "program" the much brighter future would not be possible...

It is all necessary...(part of the plan/program) (were all running)...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

The problems I see with a God who determines or made or predetermined and predestined "all" to the way it all is, all the time and always, and people to be who and what they are, all that, is: for one, how could he (God) judge or condemn someone for being bad, if that's the way he made them (to be)...? I answer that by saying that yes, he does make some bad people and bad seeds, and predestines some to go to hell even, and they did not have any choice in the matter, which makes him (God) responsible, right...?

Well, some are made for this fallen world and fallen time for the purpose of being a "standing example to us in the next life", as to what "not" to do, or how "not" to be, all that, what mistakes not to make, so we won't mess up the next life, where we will have to choice or option to... Cause there (in heaven) will we will have the option and choice of messing it up if we want to, just like in the beginning, the difference is we will have some experience as to what that choice to mess it up will do, and we have those created to be examples to and for us as to what not to do or how not to be... Anyway, we will be able to mess up heaven basically, but absolutely none of will ever choose to ever or anymore, or for forevermore... Partially due to the people who were made to be examples to and for us (who end up in hell, and who were made to go to be in hell)...

Now, that being said, the problem is, in this life here, we "don't know"... We "don't know" who is who, what is what, basically... So, we have to proceed based on that not knowing and not being able to know, (who's who, what's what, basically)... And the way we proceed based on not knowing is that everyone is "in question" as to where they stand with God, their salvation, (or going to hell) (all that) form our point of view or perspective... We just "don't know" where hardly anyone is or stands in that for sure... So, we have to, for one, first determine what is required to be saved or to be standing on the right side of things in the afterlife, and cause we generally don't know where anyone is or stands (with God) (or in the afterlife) for sure, we have determine what it is that determines that, and then try to make sure that we are on the right side and in right standing, and also, as many others as we can also...

Now God already knows, but we don't... In fact, he already predetermined, "all" long ago, but we do not get to have much insight into, or know much anything about that, (that he knows about), (till we get to the afterlife)...

Once we determine what will make us on the right side in the afterlife, we then need to tell others and help others be or wind up on the "right side" also... Problem is that their seems to be no solid black and white in this, and it usually depends on the heart of an individual, and individual by individual circumstances, that, we also, don't know much about most of the time, or do not have much insight into a lot of the time... Sure, some think there is a solid black and white, and think they know, but how often have they turned out to be so very wrong most of the time and have sinned greatly in doing so...?

We may be able to say that, for certain, in most cases, specific really terrible, horrible sins, in most cases (though maybe not absolutely all) unrepented of, or unchanged, will keep a person out of heaven and will land them in hell... On these things we might be able to judge and speak out against, done for the sake of trying to warn others and save them...

But, what are these... That's what we need to figure out I think, before we judge anything...

Anyway,

God Bless!

The one who were made for and to go to hell are to be standing examples for those who were made for and go to heaven when they get there and have to option of messing ti all up if they want to... (but God already know's "won't", or we (all) (that he chooses for heaven) won't)... (very much in major part due to the ones he made for and to go to hell) (in fact that's why they were made)... (And also due to having been in a fallen world with them already also, as well)...

But, we don't know who's who, or even what's what, right now, here and now...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

When we get there he will tell us all why he chose us for heaven and how it was different (the way were were made, yes, made) from the way they were made...

Once we know that, we will now (then) all know is only because God chose us and made us that way (that is different from them) and he will tell us, "Now... now that your all here, do not be doing or being or now choosing like them, K...? (and none of us will)... (for we will have that option but won't ever chose it ever again)... (In some part due to "them")... (And is why they were or had (have) to be)...

God Bless!

 

[joshua 1 9]

God does not choose for people. Each and every individual has to make the choice for themselves. The Bible says many are called but few are choosen meaning that few respond to God's call.

 

[Neogaia777]

God does not choose for people. Each and every individual has to make the choice for themselves. The Bible says many are called but few are choosen meaning that few respond to God's call.

Sorry, but, your "wrong"... There is a God (The Father God) who knows/knew every single, (even the smallest) "choice" we make way, way, way ahead of time and long, long, long before we ever (supposedly) choose it... And "all" from the moment of setting "all" in motion... He knows "all" and how "all" would go and turn out and be, from the very beginning of setting "all" in motion, including "all" our (supposed) choices, in a very highly, very predictable and fully knowable way and pattern and "program" to him, from the very very beginning...

I suggest you just "deal" with the fact that there is one, a God like this... And proceed from there...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

If you think hard and deep on ALL the "factors" that influence or guide our (supposed) choices and decisions, they would seem "innumerable" to us, but that's only "to us"...

However, God numbers and can number them all, and fully knows them all... And, also how they came about, or progressed, from the very beginning... All the way back to when he set everything into motion, or things came into being or from the very moment that he gave it all "life"... It's all a program to him.... Much like a extremely complex and very highly advanced computer program, of which we are all just dancers...

It's all very highly predictable and "we" are all very highly predictable and all (is) fully knowable to him... All the way back from very, very long ago...

God Bless!

 

[bling]

You are making a huge assumption about time and God being limited by man’s time frame.

Salvation can be predestined from the beginning of time for all those that accept God’s charity, without impacting free will.

Predestination something that has not even happened for God is placing God in our time frame.

We can talk about our future being predestined by God, but as soon as we say it is also future for God we are limiting God by time. God does and will talk about things being in the future but that is our future.

Christians talk about: “God being outside of time”, which is not beyond the thinking of the atheist or agnostic since:

For the last 100 years people have been trying to disprove “The Theory of Relativity” and yet nothing has disagreed with the theory and all experiments have supported relativity. If time is relative how relative would time be for God, who possible even created “time”?

If God is not outside of time and there is an infinite amount of time before man is created, then man has not been created, since an infinite amount of time has not finished? (This suggests God would be outside of time.)

There has also been hypothesizes with nothing being shown yet that if time is “warped”, there could be possible “wormholes” or something like a wormhole going between two different times.

God could have his own sequencing of events, but God would not be limited by human time.

It is difficult to think about God being “outside of our time” with no before or after for God, but this subject requires us to think.

It should not be hard for you to imagine time being relative and warped since that is what science has been showing, so one way God could “know” everything is by God at the end of man’s time sending back the whole history of man (which includes all the free will choices man made [it is historic at that point]) to Himself at the beginning of time, so the God at the beginning of man’s time knows all man’s free will choices throughout time as purely historical events and not even God can change history.

If God is outside of time He can know all there is to know, but that does not mean God knows that which cannot be known. As this would relate to man: At the same instant, God decides to make a human, for God; that being was born lived made some very limited sovereign free will choices, died and went to in heaven or hell (it is all history for God). If God does not decide to make a being (there is an infinite number of these) then God does not know what this non-ever to exist being did, since it did not do anything.

So how does God know for certainty what man will do in the future and still allow man to make free will choices; seems to be a dilemma, since the “future” is set by God knowing the future? The “future” is only “future” as far as man is concerned, since the future is set by being pure “history” as far as God is concerned. God is not forcing or setting man’s “future” free will choices, but it is man himself setting the man’s future, by the free will choices man “did make” in the future (which is history for God).

Try playing God for a minute: If you got information sent back to you in a wormhole from the future that told you perfectly the free will choice a person will make in China one hour from now and you had no way of contacting that person in the next hour, would that mean they did not make a free will choice because you perfectly knew their choice ahead of time?

God operates in a similar fashion, but He could contact the person, but since He always does the best thing there is to do; there is no changing what He does/did.

 

[Neogaia777]

You are making a huge assumption about time and God being limited by man’s time frame.

Salvation can be predestined from the beginning of time for all those that accept God’s charity, without impacting free will.

Predestination something that has not even happened for God is placing God in our time frame.

We can talk about our future being predestined by God, but as soon as we say it is also future for God we are limiting God by time. God does and will talk about things being in the future but that is our future.

Christians talk about: “God being outside of time”, which is not beyond the thinking of the atheist or agnostic since:

For the last 100 years people have been trying to disprove “The Theory of Relativity” and yet nothing has disagreed with the theory and all experiments have supported relativity. If time is relative how relative would time be for God, who possible even created “time”?

If God is not outside of time and there is an infinite amount of time before man is created, then man has not been created, since an infinite amount of time has not finished? (This suggests God would be outside of time.)

There has also been hypothesizes with nothing being shown yet that if time is “warped”, there could be possible “wormholes” or something like a wormhole going between two different times.

God could have his own sequencing of events, but God would not be limited by human time.

It is difficult to think about God being “outside of our time” with no before or after for God, but this subject requires us to think.

It should not be hard for you to imagine time being relative and warped since that is what science has been showing, so one way God could “know” everything is by God at the end of man’s time sending back the whole history of man (which includes all the free will choices man made [it is historic at that point]) to Himself at the beginning of time, so the God at the beginning of man’s time knows all man’s free will choices throughout time as purely historical events and not even God can change history.

If God is outside of time He can know all there is to know, but that does not mean God knows that which cannot be known. As this would relate to man: At the same instant, God decides to make a human, for God; that being was born lived made some very limited sovereign free will choices, died and went to in heaven or hell (it is all history for God). If God does not decide to make a being (there is an infinite number of these) then God does not know what this non-ever to exist being did, since it did not do anything.

So how does God know for certainty what man will do in the future and still allow man to make free will choices; seems to be a dilemma, since the “future” is set by God knowing the future? The “future” is only “future” as far as man is concerned, since the future is set by being pure “history” as far as God is concerned. God is not forcing or setting man’s “future” free will choices, but it is man himself setting the man’s future, by the free will choices man “did make” in the future (which is history for God).

Try playing God for a minute: If you got information sent back to you in a wormhole from the future that told you perfectly the free will choice a person will make in China one hour from now and you had no way of contacting that person in the next hour, would that mean they did not make a free will choice because you perfectly knew their choice ahead of time?

God operates in a similar fashion, but He could contact the person, but since He always does the best thing there is to do; there is no changing what He does/did.

Look, if God is truly 100% all-knowing then we don't really have choice, it's as simple as that...

Linear or not doesn't really matter, cause if he knows it "all" then we don't really have choice, but only the illusion of choice... And must proceed (in the "here" and "now") as if we do have choice, and we all do have, and do make choices in the matter(s), based on what we don't and probably more than likely "cannot know" (yet) and will not know till we get to the next life...

And the true God does not, "not know" anything, cause he knows everything, otherwise he is is not the true God...

Our "choices" are all based on a large number or prior "factors" involved (before that) that make us choose what we do, and those factors before that were based on a large number of factors before that, ect, ect...

Al known and fully knowable and fully predictable, back to the very beginning by God...

God Bless!

 

[sdowney717]

Out of evil things, God makes something good. Like the fall in Eden, who let Satan into the garden?
But then we got the first indication of a savior to come to free some of all mankind yet to be born from death, but it was a death God had determined beforehand, God had rules, and at the first, just the one rule not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Our head parents, Adam and Eve could not obey that one thing, Satan the liar put it into their minds, the temptation to be like God, which is his own failing sin. The Christ was predestined to die, slain from the foundation of the world, at the foundation there was not yet sin, everything was very good, as God even says, so the fall God had predetermined.

 

[Neogaia777]

Look, if God is truly 100% all-knowing then we don't really have choice, it's as simple as that...

Linear or not doesn't really matter, cause if he knows it "all" then we don't really have choice, but only the illusion of choice... And must proceed (in the "here" and "now") as if we do have choice, and we all do have, and do make choices in the matter(s), based on what we don't and probably more than likely "cannot know" (yet) and will not know till we get to the next life...

And the true God does not, "not know" anything, cause he knows everything, otherwise he is is not the true God...

Our "choices" are all based on a large number or prior "factors" involved (before that) that make us choose what we do, and those factors before that were based on a large number of factors before that, ect, ect...

Al known and fully knowable and fully predictable, back to the very beginning by God...

God Bless!

The prior factors, may seem innumerable, but they are not to God, our choices are based on all those prior factors, and those prior factors, were determined by prior factors before them, ect, ect, all the way back to the very beginning of everything...

All totally predictable and all fully knowable by and all-knowing God...

Look, if you can tell me that any of us, you, me, anyone, makes and choice, or choices at all completely and totally free of and completely independent of any of these prior factors that influence and dictate, I believe all choices, for almost all beings... Anyway, If you can somehow tell me otherwise or somehow prove that they don't, or don't have to, or that's not the way it has to work or is, then, great, maybe we do make true choices, but, I just don't believe that is the case in any case, ever, or will be the case ever in any cases to come either...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

God could not show him/themselves to us, unless one of them became limited enough to do so, for it would be impossible to do so in "all" or his complete full glory, omniscience, all that... God could not show him/themselves to us unless one of them became limited enough to do so, or do just that, other wise it would not be possible...

This is why we have the Father and the Son I believe (and the Holy Spirit connecting the two) (and the trinity in general)...

Why the trinity if this is not so, (that in order for them to show us them, one would have to be or become (for a time) limited enough to do just that) (show us them)... (and not only them, but ourselves and how we ourselves are like them (as beings like them) at the same time)...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Technically there still is not choice from God the Father's perspective, knowing all choices that will or would be ever made way ahead of time... For example he knew Adam and Eve would choose to forfeit their choice by choosing to/the fall and fall, just like when we (who are chosen) are presented with that same kind of choice in heaven, God already knows that all whom he chose for that life never will never choose that again after that... And that has something to do with having been in a/the fallen world, and lost fallen people who went to hell as and example for us fueling that choice to never choose that (falling) ever again, even though we technically could if we wanted to, but God already knows we won't after that... So, is it or any of it really a true "choice" or not is the big question...

IOW's if he (God) already knows what we are going to choose, well and way beforehand, how can we make a choice...?

Why he would make us all the way we are, some for hell, others for heaven, the "why" is the big question, and we must assume it for loving reasons...

That's the only "why" I can come up with with a God who already knows everything and even made certain ones and us all (to all be) the way we (all) are... So, we won't mess up the next life if presented with a very similar choice to that which we had in the Garden of Eden...

Can you think of any other "why's" or reasons for or to this maybe...?

We have to consider, I think, whether being and only existing in a fallen world for "eternity" is "hell"...? And if those people that only exist for fallen worlds or realities are even really "real" or not...? Or are they just continually recycled (not really real ones) for fallen worlds only, and never "transcend" or go to a higher reality or a higher plane of existence (heaven) that some of us (whomever God chooses for such) do...

Again it comes down to "why"...? Why me and not them...? If I am chosen and they are not "why"...? And especially if I am no different nor better from any of them, and is do to nothing of myself, nothing at all of myself, but just only due to God's choosing then, again, "why"...? "Why, why, why...? Why me and not them...?

This question haunts and plagues and stalks me, I have even told God if it is only me and not them, (or most of them) and especially if I cannot know "why" other than his choosing, but no "reason" (other than strictly that) then I have even told him that I do not even know if I want it or not, in that case, cause that's how much I care about "them"... But, I was told that is not up to me... Still it plagues me and haunts me though...

I wonder if that was what Paul was thinking when he said he would wish that he could even be accursed for them (Romans 9:3), but then in the rest of Romans 9, saying that was not up to him, but only God...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Technically there still is not choice from God the Father's perspective, knowing all choices that will or would be ever made way ahead of time... For example he knew Adam and Eve would choose to forfeit their choice by choosing to/the fall and fall, just like when we (who are chosen) are presented with that same kind of choice in heaven, God already knows that all whom he chose for that life never will never choose that again after that... And that has something to do with having been in a/the fallen world, and lost fallen people who went to hell as and example for us fueling that choice to never choose that (falling) ever again, even though we technically could if we wanted to, but God already knows we won't after that... So, is it or any of it really a true "choice" or not is the big question...

IOW's if he (God) already knows what we are going to choose, well and way beforehand, how can we make a choice...?

Why he would make us all the way we are, some for hell, others for heaven, the "why" is the big question, and we must assume it for loving reasons...

That's the only "why" I can come up with with a God who already knows everything and even made certain ones and us all (to all be) the way we (all) are... So, we won't mess up the next life if presented with a very similar choice to that which we had in the Garden of Eden...

Can you think of any other "why's" or reasons for or to this maybe...?

We have to consider, I think, whether being and only existing in a fallen world for "eternity" is "hell"...? And if those people that only exist for fallen worlds or realities are even really "real" or not...? Or are they just continually recycled (not really real ones) for fallen worlds only, and never "transcend" or go to a higher reality or a higher plane of existence (heaven) that some of us (whomever God chooses for such) do...

Again it comes down to "why"...? Why me and not them...? If I am chosen and they are not "why"...? And especially if I am no different nor better from any of them, and is do to nothing of myself, nothing at all of myself, but just only due to God's choosing then, again, "why"...? "Why, why, why...? Why me and not them...?

This question haunts and plagues and stalks me, I have even told God if it is only me and not them, (or most of them) and especially if I cannot know "why" other than his choosing, but no "reason" (other than strictly that) then I have even told him that I do not even know if I want it or not, in that case, cause that's how much I care about "them"... But, I was told that is not up to me... Still it plagues me and haunts me though...

I wonder if that was what Paul was thinking when he said he would wish that he could even be accursed for them (Romans 9:3), but then in the rest of Romans 9, saying that was not up to him, but only God...

God Bless!

Perhaps that is a difference, that I would wish myself accursed for them...? How I would love them, how I would die for them, how I would wish myself accursed for them... I don't think (but don't know) if they would do or wish the same for me (in my shoes)...

I'll probably never know the difference, other than God just saying "because of his choosing" and adding and saying nothing more than that... No reason, no answer as to "why", just, "because of his choosing" and nothing more, or anything other than that...

He knows I will still wrestle with it/that (question) all of my life here... Wonder if I'll ever get my answer here, or at all ever...?

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Perhaps that is a difference, that I would wish myself accursed for them...? How I would love them, how I would die for them, how I would wish myself accursed for them... I don't think (but don't know) if they would do or wish the same for me (in my shoes)...

I'll probably never know the difference, other than God just saying "because of his choosing" and adding and saying nothing more than that... No reason, no answer as to "why", just, "because of his choosing" and nothing more, or anything other than that...

He knows I will still wrestle with it/that (question) all of my life here... Wonder if I'll ever get my answer here, or at all ever...?

God Bless!

And it's not because I am in any way shape or form "suicidal" or want to die or be accursed either... I don't hate my life or want to die at all... My life is actually pretty good... But it is just because of love, my love for them, or for the rest of you...

Like I said they may not do the same in my shoes, but should that really matter...?

Oh, and I know there are some if they had my life, might not like it, or might want to die, be all depressed and/or suicidal or whatever... But, my life "suits me" and suits "me" well, and God knew and must have known that, even better than I did (in the past) when I thought I knew but really did not know...

But, it would not be for some, that much I do know, but I'm pretty happy and satisfied with it...

And I would give it all up if it saved some of you, but that's not up to me, but is up to God alone...

Anyway,

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

And it's not because I am in any way shape or form "suicidal" or want to die or be accursed either... I don't hate my life or want to die at all... My life is actually pretty good... But it is just because of love, my love for them, or for the rest of you...

Like I said they may not do the same in my shoes, but should that really matter...?

Oh, and I know there are some if they had my life, might not like it, or might want to die, be all depressed and/or suicidal or whatever... But, my life "suits me" and suits "me" well, and God knew and must have known that, even better than I did (in the past) when I thought I knew but really did not know...

But, it would not be for some, that much I do know, but I'm pretty happy and satisfied with it...

And I would give it all up if it saved some of you, but that's not up to me, but is up to God alone...

Anyway,

God Bless!

He has let me know that it wouldn't do anything and wouldn't change a thing...

So, in that case, I don't want a meaningless death... or to be a meaningless, or make any totally meaningless sacrifices either...

He is letting me know he can get much more meaning out my life with me living and not making any (more) sacrifices, than if I did...

And while, at times, I may wonder how this is, he has asked me to just trust him on this, and go with it (that trust in him) (and his plans) (for me to live, ect, get meaning out of it, ect)...

So, I'm going to do just that...

So, here I am...? What now...? What now...? What's next...? That is the question, isn't it...

God Bless!

 

[sdowney717]

Simply Jesus told His disciples to rejoice that their names were written in Heaven.
Psalm 139 is a good read for you.
Here is a snippet of goodness.

13 For You formed my inward parts;
You [f]covered me in my mother’s womb.
14 I will praise You, for [g]I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Marvelous are Your works,
And that my soul knows very well.
15 My [h]frame was not hidden from You,
When I was made in secret,
And skillfully wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.

16 Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed.
And in Your book they all were written,
The days fashioned for me,
When as yet there were none of them.

17 How precious also are Your thoughts to me, O God!
How great is the sum of them!
18 If I should count them, they would be more in number than the sand;
When I awake, I am still with You.

19 Oh, that You would slay the wicked, O God!
Depart from me, therefore, you bloodthirsty men.
20 For they speak against You wickedly;
[j]Your enemies take Your name in vain.
21 Do I not hate them, O Lord, who hate You?
And do I not loathe those who rise up against You?
22 I hate them with [k]perfect hatred;
I count them my enemies.

23 Search me, O God, and know my heart;
Try me, and know my anxieties;
24 And see if there is any wicked way in me,
And lead me in the way everlasting.

 

[bling]

Look, if God is truly 100% all-knowing then we don't really have choice, it's as simple as that...

Linear or not doesn't really matter, cause if he knows it "all" then we don't really have choice, but only the illusion of choice... And must proceed (in the "here" and "now") as if we do have choice, and we all do have, and do make choices in the matter(s), based on what we don't and probably more than likely "cannot know" (yet) and will not know till we get to the next life...

And the true God does not, "not know" anything, cause he knows everything, otherwise he is is not the true God...

Our "choices" are all based on a large number or prior "factors" involved (before that) that make us choose what we do, and those factors before that were based on a large number of factors before that, ect, ect...

Al known and fully knowable and fully predictable, back to the very beginning by God...

God Bless!

That is not true at all!

Just as I can know historically free will choices, which cannot be changed and those choices still be free will choices, God can know all the free will choices “you made” which includes all the free will choices you will make in your future as historical and unchangeable happenings. God is outside of time.

Just because in your way of thinking future decisions have not been made does not mean they have not been made in God’s timeframe. God is existing in the future right now.

Most of our choices are totally predictable, but the one choice to accept or reject God’s charity is the only free will choice we need to make for salvation.

 

[Neogaia777]

That is not true at all!

Oh but it is....

Most of our choices are totally predictable, but the one choice to accept or reject God’s charity is the only free will choice we need to make for salvation.

Talking about God the Father, the always fully truly omniscient one, No... That has already been determined already from the beginning... "All" has already been determined from his perspective...

God Bless!

 

[sdowney717]

That is not true at all!

Just as I can know historically free will choices, which cannot be changed and those choices still be free will choices, God can know all the free will choices “you made” which includes all the free will choices you will make in your future as historical and unchangeable happenings. God is outside of time.

Just because in your way of thinking future decisions have not been made does not mean they have not been made in God’s timeframe. God is existing in the future right now.

Most of our choices are totally predictable, but the one choice to accept or reject God’s charity is the only free will choice we need to make for salvation.

The free will choices you make have been guided by your circumstances. So you can only make choices within the boundaries of your situation.
God determines the extent and boundaries of all the people over the earth, He changes the circumstances, recall the tower of Babel for one example. God does intervene, even against the will of the creature. Someday we will all be aware of how much God has His hands in all things..But for believers, it is all for their good.

Romans 11 speaks to God controlling the fate of the gentile and jewish nations.
'For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.' is highly appropriate to consider here. by saying v36, we know God is responsible ultimately for all things.
And honestly this should be of strong consolation to anyone who is a believer in Christ.


28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31 even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God has [h]committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.

33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!

34 “For who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has become His counselor?”
35 “Or who has first given to Him
And it shall be repaid to him?”

36 For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.