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The presidential race

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Markus6

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In a war you don't rule in or out any weapons...including nuclear weapons. Iran will use nuclear weapons against us and Israel when they get them so we should be prepared to use them against our enemies if need be.
Greetings Catholics.
I am not a Catholic but having checked the rules I think this post is allowed as I'm not giving advice that goes against Catholic teaching.

I believe there ARE certain weapons that you should rule out in war. For example the USA and the UK will not use terror tactics in the war on terror (i.e. bombing heavily populated civilian targets to try and inspire terror in the population) like Al Queda have used on us. Similarily I think that nuclear weapons should be ruled out. Firstly because of the negative impact on the enviroment and the possiblility of nuclear winter. Secondly because of escalation, if we use nuclear weapons then our enemies will almost certainly use theirs if they have them. And thirdly because of the number of innocent people that will be killed by such a bomb.

I don't know if any of you have heard of the 'Just War theory' but one of the conditions given for a 'Just War' is 'just means' and I don't think the war on terror can be considered just if nuclear weapons are used.
 
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fragmentsofdreams

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Well, you are right about a lot of things. The only way to end abortion is to pass a Human Life Amendment to the Constitution. Even an overturn of Roe v. Wade will just end abortion in the red states where it is unavailable or restricted anyway, particularly in rural areas, and increase it in blue states.

That's the only way to outlaw abortions. It is important to remember there is a difference.
 
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fragmentsofdreams

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Well Guiliani is not a pro lifer so your argument isn't valid. The only way I would vote for Guiliani is if he ended up being the Republican nomination because he would be a lot better than either of the Democrats. It would be voting for the lesser of the 2 devils.

Isn't that the way every election goes?
 
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fragmentsofdreams

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I think that any nation that says it is "One Nation Under God" must pledge never to make a first strike with nuclear weapons.

I am glad that we have developed nuclear defense shields, and we should continue to perfect and develop them. I think that a rogue nation's knowledge that we can deflect and protect ourselves from their attacks while they remain vulnerable to our counterattack is an excellent deterrent (because the aim, after all, is to insure that no country ever uses nuclear weapons.)

Defensive shields can't protect against a bomb that isn't delivered by missile or even that isn't launched from where we are expecting. Furthermore, the stuff we have doesn't perform well even under tests stacked in its favor.
 
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Fantine

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Defensive shields can't protect against a bomb that isn't delivered by missile or even that isn't launched from where we are expecting. Furthermore, the stuff we have doesn't perform well even under tests stacked in its favor.
That's why I said we should continue to perfect and develop our defense shields.

The main reason for building a defense shield is not to shield us from actual attacks but to convince those considering launching an attack that it would not only be futile but also bring down a possible counterattack on them.

It's one of a number of steps we should take, including diplomacy.
 
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thereselittleflower

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I think that any nation that says it is "One Nation Under God" must pledge never to make a first strike with nuclear weapons.

I am glad that we have developed nuclear defense shields, and we should continue to perfect and develop them. I think that a rogue nation's knowledge that we can deflect and protect ourselves from their attacks while they remain vulnerable to our counterattack is an excellent deterrent (because the aim, after all, is to insure that no country ever uses nuclear weapons.)

Do you know that acid rain from China's polluted manufacturing plants has traveled as far as Oklahoma?

Detonating nuclear weapons is a form of global suicide.

You are absolutely right.Dust froms dust storms in Africa is carried all the way to the US.

How can anyone think that a nuclear first strike is ever a thinkable choice?

Bush is to be feared because he doesn't read, he doesn't listen, he doesn't compromise, he doesn't change his mind, and, according to forensic psychologists, has an IQ of 91 (the lowest of any President they've tracked.) But, thank goodness, he has become a pariah in even his own party, so his wings are pretty much clipped....

I don't know anything about his IQ, but there are other issues that concern me.

But soon, unless something terrible happens that stops the next presidential elections, there will be another president . . . are we going to elect someone who believe that a nuclear first strike is "thinkable"?

.
 
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Fish and Bread

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Just a point of clarification: Fred Thompson was at the 1996 Republican convention advocating for the removal of the pro-life platform plank, as at the time he was a pro-choice Republican (ala Gulliani). Over the last ten years or so, his position has shifted, and now he claims to be pro-life. It isn't really clear at what point in the last decade the change happened, but he says it did at some point. So, in a sense everyone's recollection is correct, at different times he's taken different stances. :)
 
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PetertheRock

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My candidate is Huckabee. I know he has no real chance but I know he did poll really well in the last debate but still not enough to move him into the top 2-3 candidates. Romney did extremely well and in fact many say he won the debate.
 
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Maynard Keenan

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I am an Obama lean right now. I am still a big fan of Wesley Clark but have given up on him running. I don't like Clinton that much but I would support her if she were the Democratic nominee. Same with Edwards. I'd support their policies more often than not, and far more often than any of the front running Republicans. Ron Paul is my favorite Republican and probably the only one I could stomach voting for.
 
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BillH

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As I've said elsewhere, I'm basically a two-issue voter this election: abortion and the war. Ron Paul, in my humble opinion, seems to be the only candidate who unambiguously gets both right.

Will he win? Almost certainly not. But I suppose that I'll feel a little better next November if I gave my humble support to the candidate I thought was best while I had the chance.
 
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Rising_Suns

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Just a point of clarification: Fred Thompson was at the 1996 Republican convention advocating for the removal of the pro-life platform plank, as at the time he was a pro-choice Republican (ala Gulliani). Over the last ten years or so, his position has shifted, and now he claims to be pro-life. It isn't really clear at what point in the last decade the change happened, but he says it did at some point. So, in a sense everyone's recollection is correct, at different times he's taken different stances. :)

It is good to hear that he is pro-life now.

In the end, I think it is going to come down to either Fred Thomson or Giuliani. No one else really stands a chance, especially the democratic side. The democrats have no one to offer, so Giuliani or Thomson will win by default.

-Davide
 
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MrPolo

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It seems to me that the 2 party-system has not worked for some time now. We the People aren't choosing. We are choosing between 2 or 3 or 4 people that are given to us as a choice. Republicans and Democrats are more compliments of each other than anything.

I'd like to see many many more 3rd parties (or no-parties who just stand on their own merit and ideas), and more referendums. I hear people talk about how that is throwing your vote away, but that comment also guarantees perpetuating a country that has consistently decayed in freedom and morality for decades.

Try something different I say.
 
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Fish and Bread

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As I've said elsewhere, I'm basically a two-issue voter this election: abortion and the war. Ron Paul, in my humble opinion, seems to be the only candidate who unambiguously gets both right.

Will he win? Almost certainly not. But I suppose that I'll feel a little better next November if I gave my humble support to the candidate I thought was best while I had the chance.

I suggest anyone considering voting for Ron Paul make sure they first understand the nature of libertarianism and it's implications. Paul once ran for President on the Libertarian Party ticket and still considers himself a "small l" libertarian. This is a movement that opposes things like publicly funded construction of roads, the US postal service, anti-trust laws, labor protection laws (All of them), environmental protection laws (all of them), the income tax (Which they equate to slavery), a legal minimum age of consent for sexual acts, government recognition of marriages, social security, Medicare, Medicaid, the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and a whole laundry list of important laws and programs, while favoring legalized prostitution. Ultimately they want a government so minimal that the end result would be either anarchy or a small group of large corporations and associations that essentially treat the rest of us as slaves.

I'm not saying Congressman Paul is in line with the libertarian position on all of these items (He probably has to be more moderate than that to have been elected to congress), but people should be aware that he has freely aligned himself with a party devoted to many of them in the past and still uses the term "libertarian" to describe himself. I could never and would never vote for a libertarian under any circumstances, personally.

I do agree with Bill on being against the war and being pro-life, and it's nice that the Congressman agrees with us on those two things also, but overall the Congressman becoming President would be a huge disaster for this nation, in my opinion.

In the end, I think it is going to come down to either Fred Thomson or Giuliani. No one else really stands a chance, especially the democratic side. The democrats have no one to offer, so Giuliani or Thomson will win by default.

The entire Republican field is opposed to guaranteed health care for children. The entire Republican field, minus Rep. Paul, continues to back staying in Iraq and saber rattling towards Iran. They could have a rough time of it in 2008, unless something surprising happens to change the political landscape in the interim.

Then again, even though I am a Democrat, I do not think the Democrat field is particularly strong in terms of electability. Senator Clinton has the experience and intelligence and statescraft skills to lead the nation, but so many find her personally unlikeable that she could have trouble in swing states (Particularly those in the south). Senator Obama is a good man, but he's shown in the debates that he needs a lot more seasoning, as his comments sometimes show a lack of understanding of the nuances of foreign policy and politics. Still, I would vote for any Democrat in the field over any of the Republicans in the field (Well, okay, I wouldn't vote for Mike Gravel. ;)). And I think the mood of the country is such and stances taken by the GOP are such that Clinton, Obama, or Edwards if nominated is going to be the odds-on favorite to win the Presidency with the electorate. They picked the right time to run, the country is ready for a change that they might not have made in years past if these were the candidates they had to pick from.

By the way, give the nature of this forum, it might be interesting to point out that Senator Joe Biden (Democratic candidate for President) sent his children to Catholic school and prays the rosary daily. For what it's worth. :)
 
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fragmentsofdreams

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It seems to me that the 2 party-system has not worked for some time now. We the People aren't choosing. We are choosing between 2 or 3 or 4 people that are given to us as a choice. Republicans and Democrats are more compliments of each other than anything.

I'd like to see many many more 3rd parties (or no-parties who just stand on their own merit and ideas), and more referendums. I hear people talk about how that is throwing your vote away, but that comment also guarantees perpetuating a country that has consistently decayed in freedom and morality for decades.

Try something different I say.

Referendums sound good at first, but it suffers from the fact that voters are unable to modify the proposal if it isn't well balanced and well written. They also leave mandates that are hard to get rid of when situations change.
 
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Sandlapper277

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I think that any nation that says it is "One Nation Under God" must pledge never to make a first strike with nuclear weapons.

I am glad that we have developed nuclear defense shields, and we should continue to perfect and develop them. I think that a rogue nation's knowledge that we can deflect and protect ourselves from their attacks while they remain vulnerable to our counterattack is an excellent deterrent (because the aim, after all, is to insure that no country ever uses nuclear weapons.)

Have you read the reports that there may be as many as ten suitcase nukes already in the US? Sure, they're about as weak as nukes come, 1-5 kilotons, and they'd have to be detonated at surface level when nukes are more effective detonated at somewhere abound 50-200 meters, I honestly can't remember what the optimal altitude is.

But it still should scare the daylights out of you. They won't knock down buildings like the pictures of Hiroshima, but think about the effects of ten American downtowns covered in nuclear fallout.

Then remember the most perfect missle shield possible couldn't do a damned thing to stop a surface nuke.

We should never strike first with a nuke, but if we think we're immune from a nuclear strike in an American city, we're only fooling ourselves.
 
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