The pre-advent Investigative Judgment of Daniel 7

Major1 said:

YOU want me to read a SDA website to prove YOUR theology?????

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No. I asked you to consider the historical references directly cited within. It would save me time from having to re-post them here.

BobRyan said:

Why do you keep insisting that Jesus had sin - each time I post that scripture says He did not?

I find your logic illusive at that point.

A separate thread on why you feel that either Hebrew is not a high context language or why you feel Jesus had sinned - would be in order if either of those are your claim

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I agree! JESUS HAD NO SIN!!!!!!!!

If Jesus had any sin then He could not be the Saviour and the Scriptures would be a lie which makes God a liar resulting in all of us not being saved at all.

liberty of conscience said:

No. I asked you to consider the historical references directly cited within. It would save me time from having to re-post them here.

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ONE at a TIME!

There is no need to overpower us with words.

DaDad said:

Yep, and when my wife make a grocery list (Intelligent Design -- chronological) and then re-writes it according to the store aisles (Intelligent Design) and throws away the first, -- apparently SHE's SMARTER THAN GOD! Because GOD is often confused, disoriented, distracted, or simply random -- and seldom uses Intelligent Design in HIS explanations to his creation.

And of course, who would be so gullible to think that our present "kingdom" is "divided" between three superpowers and the United Nations. (Ref. 2:41) What rubbish.

MOST of us are -- Smarter than GOD!
DaDad

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you said...….
MOST of us are -- Smarter than GOD!

Please tell me that you were being sarcastic or fooling us.

YeshuaFan said:

The 70th week still ahs yet to be fulfilled, cannot happen until the prince to come, the Antichrist, is set up and tries to destroy Israel!

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Correct!

2 Thessalonians 2:3-7 ……….
"Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God. 5Don't you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things? 6And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time. 7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way."

DaDad said:

FINALLY, someone who has some perception.

CEV Footnote:

1. 9.25 the Chosen Leader: Or “a chosen leader.” In Hebrew the word “chosen” means “to pour oil (on someone’s head).” In Old Testament times it was the custom to pour oil on a person’s head when that person was chosen to be a priest or a king.

There is absolutely NOTHING in Daniel 9 which remotely supports a "Jesus" fulfillment. The text, context, and history all refute any such premise.

... Now there are a couple of "kings" which DO fulfill the text, context, and history, -- but you won't find them in ANY commentary. Perhaps the commentators should have followed the angel's instructions in 12:4 & 9.

Thanks,
DaDad

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I can not agree with you Dad. Dan 9:24-27 are

There are many good reasons to use this text in an apologetic case for Jesus as the Messiah. First, though it is difficult to demonstrate the exact time of the decree for the start date or the exact date of Christ’s crucifixion, Daniel definitely predicts an event that would take place extremely close to Christ’s life.

The skeptics would have difficulty arguing that this text is mistaken. Second, the fact that this is a Messianic prophecy is not up for debate. Even the Jewish Rabbi Rashi interpreted the text as referring to events in the first century relating to the Messiah.
( I am indebted to the insightful work of Arnold G. Fruchtenbaum, Messianic Christology: A Study of Old Testament Prophecy Concerning the First Coming of the Messiah, Tustin, CA: Ariel Ministries, 1998, for this helpful division of Daniel 9:24-27).

The passage even uses the word Messiah! Third, it seems reasonable to argue there is a gap between the sixty-ninth and seventieth weeks. Therefore, it seems reasonable to conclude that this text at least predicts the exact year of the Messiah’s coming, which was fulfilled in Christ.

Though not without its hermeneutical questions, this text is certainly an amazing prophecy that one definitely should use in his or her apologetic case for Jesus as the Messiah. One should feel compelled to agree with Archer’s conclusion, “Only God could have predicted the coming of His Son with such amazing precision; it defies all rationalistic explanation.”
(Michael L. Brown, Answering Jewish Objections to Jesus: Messianic Prophecy Objections, volume three, Grand Rapids: Baker Books, 2000, p. 97.)

liberty of conscience said:

No. I asked you to consider the historical references directly cited within. It would save me time from having to re-post them here.

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But it would take me a lot of time to read it and find it and since you wanted it know then you should post it.

liberty of conscience said:

Then they are not serious students of scripture, nor history (and that includes the Reformation) and I pity them. All seeking truth should at least consider it, even if scanning it.

This is true, but as I said, the WTS/JW borrowed that doctrine from the Reformation, and yet twisted it, to reduce Michael/Jesus to a mere creature, as Roman Catholicism does. WTS/JW have a mixed theology, half Roman Catholicism, half Reformation. That is demonstrated in the material provided.

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No sir, I do not agree. Some of us are elderly and do not have the ability or the eye sight to go through such a porifera of info.

Major1 said:

Correct!...

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No, incorrect. The "prince that shall come", was Jesus (the word is only used for Jesus in Daniel).

Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

It isn't "the prince that shall come" that destroy's the "city", but rather it was "the people of" said "prince" that destroyed the city:

"... the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary ..."

The Jews themselves by their rejection of Jesus, brought destruction upon their own city (which came in the form of the Roman armies, the "eagles" that surrounded it). God withdrew:

Mat_23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luk_13:35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Luk_21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.

It was no longer His Father's house (John 2:16).

Major1 said:

No sir, I do not agree. Some of us are elderly and do not have the ability or the eye sight to go through such a porifera of info.

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Have some one else read it to you, enlarge the font. Enough excuses. You have read plenty on these forums and spent enough time typing.

Major1 said:

ONE at a TIME!

There is no need to overpower us with words.

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Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

[1] great earthquake

[2] sun became black as sackcloth of hair

[3] and the moon became as blood

Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

[4] the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when shaken of a mighty wind

(we are here, and soon to come ...)

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

[5] the atmosphere (first heaven) will split in two ...

[6] every mountain and island will be moved (great earthquake that never was before)

Do you agree with the order of events as listed by this passage in Revelation?

Here is a short listing of events:

... Afterwards, then follows several signs in the earth/heaven itself, namely, "shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven ...", which is paralleled in several other verses, namely:

[1,290, AD 508 unto AD 1798]
Daniel 12:11 KJB - "... a thousand two hundred and ninety days."

[1,335, AD 508 unto AD 1843/44]
Daniel 12:12 KJB - "Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days."
Revelation 14:13 KJB - "... Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth ..."

[70 Weeks, 62 + 7 + 1 [1/2 + 1/2], 457 BC unto AD 27 [Baptism], unto AD 31 [Cross], unto AD 34 [Stephen], then the remaining 1810, unto AD 1843/44]
Daniel 9:24-27 KJB - Whole ...

[5 Anti-typical feast Months, AD 31-100, unto AD 1833/34, Day of Trumpets, from Pentecost; Leviticus 23; Woe 1, Woe 2 and Woe 3, encompassing the whole 'Exodus', 'Wilderness' unto 'Canaan']
Revelation 9:5 KJB - "... five months ..."
Revelation 9:6 KJB - "... those days ..."
Revelation 9:10 KJB - "... five months ..."

[1,260, 42 months, time, times and 1/2 time; AD 538 unto AD 1798]
Daniel 7:25 KJB - "... a time and times and the dividing of time." ["wear out the saints"]
Daniel 12:7 KJB - "... a time, times, and a half ..." ["scatter the power of the holy people"]
Matthew 24:29 KJB - "... the tribulation of those days ..." [reference to Daniel]
Mark 13:24 KJB - "...that tribulation ..." [reference to Daniel]
Luke 21:24 KJB - "... the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled."
Revelation 6:11 KJB - "... killed as they were ..." [two groups, past and future, see Rev. 20:4 KJB]
Revelation 11:2 KJB - "... given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months."
Revelation 11:3 KJB - "... a thousand two hundred and threscroe days ..."
Revelation 12:6 KJB - "... a thousand two hundred and threescore days."
Revelation 12:14 KJB - "... a time, and times, and a half a time ..." ["persecuted", see vs 13]
Revelation 13:5 KJB - " ... forty and two months." ["power" was given to "him" [1st [sea] Beast, Rev. 13]]

[Great Lisbon Earthquake, AD 1755, November 1]
Revelation 6:12 KJB - "... a great earthquake ..."

[Great Dark Day, AD 1780, May 19 - Sun]
Joel 2:10 KJB - "... the sun ... shall be dark ..."
Joel 2:31 KJB - "The sun shall be turned into darkness ..."
Matthew 24:29 KJB - "... shall the sun be darkened ..."
Mark 13:24 KJB - "... the sun shall be darkened ..."
Luke 21:25 KJB - "And there shall be signs in the sun ..."
Acts 2:20 KJB - "The sun shall be turned into darkness ..."
Revelation 6:12 KJB - "... and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair ..."

[Great Dark Day, AD 1780, May 19 - Moon]
Joel 2:10 KJB - "... and the moon shall be dark ..."
Joel 2:31 KJB - "... and the moon into blood ..." [before the great and terrible day of the LORD come]
Matthew 24:29 KJB - "... and the moon shall not give her light ..."
Mark 13:24 KJB - "... and the moon shall not give her light,"
Luke 21:25 KJB - "... and in the moon ..."
Acts 2:20 KJB - "... and the moon into blood ..." [before that great and notable day of the Lord come]]
Revelation 6:12 KJB - "... and the moon became as blood;"

[Reign of Terror, French Revolution, AD 1793 unto AD 1797/8; 'spiritually Egypt and Sodom']
Revelation 11:9 KJB - "... three days and an half ..."
Revelation 11:11 KJB - "... after three days and a half ..."

[Great Leonid Meteor Shower, AD 1833, November 13]
Matthew 24:29 KJB - "... and the stars shall fall from heaven ..."
Mark 13:25 KJB - "And the stars of heaven shall fall ..."
Luke 21:25 KJB - "... and in the stars ..."
Revelation 6:13 KJB - "And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth ..."

[Day of Atonement, AD 1844, October 22; 2,300 which began in 457 BC, Ezra 7, Daniel 9, etc ending in AD 1843/44]
Daniel 8:14 KJB - "... Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed."
Revelation 9:15 KJB - "... prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year ..." [Rev. 14:6-7; Leviticus 23:26-32; 1 Kings 8:2; Daniel 8:13,14,26, etc]
Revelation 10:6 KJB - "... that there should be time no longer ..." [no more prophetic time as a test]

Luke 21:25 KJB - "... and upon earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;"

Isaiah 13:7 KJB - "Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:"
Isaiah 13:8 KJB - "And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrow shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth ..."
Luke 21:26 KJB - "Men's heart's failing them from fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth ..."

Isaiah 13:10 KJB - "For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine."
Joel 2:10 KJB - "... and the stars shall withdraw their shining:"
Joel 3:15 KJB - "The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining."

[The Close of probation for mankind in receiving and assimilating the Everlasting Gospel]
Daniel 12:1 KJB -"And at that time shall Michael stand up ... there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time ..."
Luke 13:25 KJB - "When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without ..."
Revelation 10:7 KJB - "In the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished ..."
Revelation 22:11 KJB - "He that is unjust, let him be unjest still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still."

[7 Last plagues, Wrath of God poured out]
Job 14:13 KJB - "... thy wrath ..."
Revelation 11:18 KJB - "... and thy wrath is come ..." [Revelation 16:2-17 KJB]

[Final Events]

Jeremiah 25:30 KJB - "... The LORD shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout, as they that tread the grapes, against all the inhabitants of the earth."
Joel 2:11 KJB - "And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army ..."
Joel 3:16 KJB - "The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, utter his voice from Jerusalem ..." [New Jerusalem in Heaven]

Joel 3:16 KJB - "... and the heavens and the earth shall shake ..."
Mark 13:25 KJB - "... and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken."
Luke 21:26 KJB - "... for the powers of heaven shall be shaken."
Hebrews 12:26 KJB - "... I shake not the earth only, but also heaven:"

1 Kings 18:44 KJB - "... ariseth a little cloud out of the sea, like a man's hand ..."
Matthew 24:30 KJB - "And then shall the appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven ..."

Revelation 6:14 KJB - "And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together ..."

Revelation 16:18 KJB - "... a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great."

Revelation 6:14 KJB - "... and every mountain and island were moved out of their places."
Revelation 16:20 KJB - "And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found."

Matthew 24:30 KJB - "... and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."
Mark 13:26 KJB - "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory."
Luke 21:27 KJB - "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and glory."
Revelation 6:15 KJB - "And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every freeman, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;"

Major1 said:

But it would take me a lot of time to read it and find it and since you wanted it know then you should post it.

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I do not mind doing so, but also wanted you to have a quick reference guide to said historical material.

Therefore, shall we begin with the prophecies (Daniel/Revelation), and link them to the history of the Great (Lisbon) Earthquake (Nov. 1 1755) (Revelation 6:12)? If so, we have to begin in Daniel 2, connect to Daniel 7, then to Daniel 8, then to Daniel 9, then to Daniel 10-12, then to Revelation itself.

Do you agree with the basic outline as given here, already on Daniel 2:
The pre-advent Investigative Judgment of Daniel 7

If no, please be specific as to which point you disagree with, and allow for further detail as needful.

Here is an additional prophetic time listing, with a broader scope:

457 BC [begins the 2,300, and thus the portion of it, the 70 weeks [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24]
AD 26 [begins John the Baptist, the forerunner of Jesus' first Advent]
AD 27 [ends the 7 + 62 [69] weeks of KJB Daniel 9:25-26; Mark 1:15, and begins the final week, KJB Daniel 9:27]
AD 31 [ends the midst of [3 ½] the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27, begins the 5 anti-typical months of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 from Pentecost, until 1833/34 with warning of Judgment to come by William Miller in AD 1833/34]
AD 34 [ends the final week of the 70 [490] of KJB Daniel 9:24-27]
AD 70 [end of the “generation”, within 40 years of Jesus' prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem by Rome under Titus; KJB Matthew 23:36, 24:2; Mark 13:2; Luke 19:44, 21:6]
AD 303 [begins the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]
AD 313 [ends the 10 years tribulation of KJB Revelation 2:10]
AD 508 [begins the 1,290 of KJB Daniel 12:11 and 1,335 of KJB Daniel 12:12]
AD 538 [begins the 1,260, forty and two months, time, times and dividing of time, of KJB Daniel 7:25, 12:7; Revelation 11:2,3, 12:6,14, 13:5; Luke 21:24]
AD 1755 [November 1, earthquake that shook the world; KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]
AD 1776 [Beast out of the earth with two horns like a Lamb [Church without a pope, and State without a King, Protestantism, Republicanism], begins to arise with the aide of France, to become the USA, KJB Revelation 13:11]
AD 1780 [May 19, dark day, sun and moon, KJB Revelation 6:12; Luke 21:25, time of the 6th Seal]
AD 1793 [begins the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France]
AD 1797 [ends the 3 ½ years of KJB Revelation 11:9,11, in France, see also Revelation 11:13, in the political upheaval of France, 1/10 of the 10 horns of KJB Daniel 7:7]
AD 1798 [ends the 1,290 and 1,260, ending in the beginning of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], and France removed from helping USA]
AD 1833 [November 13th, stars falling; KJB Luke 21:25; Revelation 6:13, time of the 6th Seal]
AD 1833/4 [ends the 5th Trumpet of KJB Revelation 9:5,6,10 in the Feast of Trumpets, 5 anti-typical months from Pentecost in AD 31.]
AD 1842-1844 [First and Second Angels messages go forward, KJB Revelation 14:6-8 and Midnight Cry of Matthew 25:6, in first phase]
AD 1844 [ends the 1,335 and 2,300, ending in the ending of the time of the end [AD 1798 – 1844], the “daily” becomes the “yearly”, and 10 years after Feast of Trumpets [1833/34] is now October 22 1844, the Day of Atonement begins; Leviticus 16 & 23; Revelation 14:7, thus given also as the hour [of His judgment, KJB Revelation 14:6-7], day [10th day, Day of Atonement; KJB Leviticus 23:26-32], month [7th month, Ethanim; KJB Leviticus 23:27; 1 Kings 8:2], year [KJB Daniel 8:14, 12:12] in Revelation 9's the sixth Trumpet introduction [KJB Revelation 9:13-15]]
AD 1844 [Third Angels Message goes forward; KJB Revelation 14:9-12]
AD 1880's-1888 [first siege, as in the days of Cestius of Rome, Sunday laws begin to be passed and persecution was happening, Blair Bill almost goes through, but is suddenly halted]
AD 1989 [Holy Alliance - USA [2nd Beast of KJB Revelation 13] teams with Vatican/Papacy [First Beast of KJB Revelation 13] to help bring down USSR]
AD 1990 [the USA, the sole remaining Super-power, “all the power”, “power over” the nations, as per KJB Revelation 13:2,3,7,12,16]
AD 1995 [Christian coalition seeking to gain Roman support]
AD 1998
AD 1999 [Catholics/Lutherans reach agreement]
AD 2001 [tower fell 9/11, just as type foretold, KJB Luke 13:4]
AD 2004 [3rd Event; Sunday being promoted more and more; Roman Catholicism joins Christian Coalition]
AD 2005 [4th Event; Leading Protestant Churches unite on common doctrines; KJB Revelation 13:11,12,14 “they should make an image to the beast” - Catholic Universal, One World Church; see KJB Revelation 13:7,8, “war” [state], “worship” [church]]
AD 2008 [5th Event; National/International money crisis truly begins, KJB Luke 12:25, “with perplexity”, which will become worldwide and in the church, KJB Genesis 47:13,15; effecting a new economic system to come, and buying and selling effected eventually, KJB Revelation 13:7; Daniel 11:43]
AD 2010 [further events between king North, and South]
AD 2011 [further events between king North, and South]
AD 2013 [July 4th; Francis I [the Jesuit], Benedict XVI [Master of the Office of the Inquisition] invoke the weapon of war, just as type foretold, Caiaphas and Annas, KJB Luke 3:2, about to finish the King of the South off [6th Head, the Beast from the bottomless pit of KJB Revelation 11], Secular Humanism/Atheism as ruling power, and the false reliance of Israel, to turn over into the Healing of the deadly wound of the First Beast of Revelation 13:1, when persecution arises in the USA]
AD 2015 [Sept. 22-27th, Francis I [the Jesuit] speaks at Washington D.C., which sits between Mary-land and Virgin-ia]
AD 2016-2017 [Donald Trump is elected President of the USA, and is "prayed" over by the Evangelical apostasy, and begins to give power back to churches to speak about political matters in pulpit; repeals the Johnson Amendment, church and state re-uniting more closely]

Revelation 17, 7 heads and an 8th:

1. [Babylon] - Lion 1 Head

2. [Med-Persia] - Bear 1 Head

3. [Greece] - He-Goat 1 Head

4. [Pagan Rome] - Terrible/Dreadful Beast 1 Head

5. [Papal Rome] - Man of Sin (a creature, a man without indwelling of Christ, is as a beast, see Nebuchadnezzar, Daniel 4) - 1 Head

five are fallen

6. [Atheism/Secular Humanism] - Beast from Bottomless Pit 1 Head

one is after the wilderness period began for Papal Head, Beast of Rev 11. This gave the deadly wound to the 5th Head,and helped the 7th come to power (France, etc) ...

7. USA/Apostate Protestantism - Beast from the Earth 1 head

other is not yet come, continue short space, "2nd Beast" of Rev 13; 10 horns, all the kings of the earth that take counsel against God (world leaders of the U.N., which sit upon the 7th Head)

8. Combined Mystery Babylon (Religious humanism), triumvirate, final [8th] re-vived Head of Papal Power

“As we approach the last crisis, it is of vital moment that harmony and unity exist among the Lord’s instrumentalities. The world is filled with storm and war and variance. Yet under one head—the papal power—the people will unite to oppose God in the person of His witnesses. This union is cemented by the great apostate. While he seeks to unite his agents in warring against the truth he will work to divide and scatter its advocates. Jealousy, evil surmising, evilspeaking, are instigated by him to produce discord and dissension. The members of Christ’s church have the power to thwart the purpose of the adversary of souls. At such a time as this let them not be found at variance with one another or with any of the Lord’s workers. Amidst the general discord let there be one place where harmony and unity exist because the Bible is made the guide of life. Let the people of God feel that a responsibility rests upon them to build up His instrumentalities. …” - Testimonies for the Church Volume 7, p. 182.2 (1) see also The Publishing Ministry, p. 114.4 (1) see also Testimony Treasures Volume 3, p. 171.2 (1) see also Maranatha, p. 187.2 (1) see also Last Day Events, p. 131.5 (1)

Here is another:

“Strange, eventful history is being recorded in the books of heaven. Everything in our world is in agitation. Events are changing to bring about the day of God, which hasteth greatly. The world is filled with storm and war and variance. Under one head, the papal power, it has united to oppose God in the person of His faithful witnesses. This union is cemented by the great apostate. All jealousy, evil surmising, and evil speaking are of him, and tend to produce discord and disunion. Then shall God’s people be at variance with one another? Shall they not be cemented together by the Holy Spirit, each worker filled with love and sympathy for his fellow-worker, each filling his appointment with faithful effort, seeking earnestly to prepare the way of the Lord? In the general discord there should be one place where harmony and unity should exist because the Bible is the guide. When the principles of God’s Word are followed, it becomes a bright light shining in a dark place. All who build on this Rock can be sure that their house will stand amid the tempest.” - ST February 7, 1900, par. 3

YeshuaFan said:

70th week refers to the time of Jacob' troubles, to Israel under wrath of Antichrist, yet to happen!

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Nope. Daniel wrote that he perceived (biyn -- Ref. 1 Kings 3, simple wisdom -shama vs Solomon wisdom - biyn) the Books, which turns out to the be Book of Psalms. So rather than guessing, you too can discover the actual prophecy and interpretation.
Thanks,
DaDad

BobRyan said:

Lev 4:3 says nothing about Christ being a sinner. How is that not obvious? ...

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Please do a word search on mashiyach (H4899).


... or be content in the commentator's error.

Thanks,
DaDad

BobRyan said:

... the 70 weeks of Daniel 9 ended 2000 years ago ...

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That's not what the angle instructed (Ref. 12:4 & 9), and it might be perilous to disobey an angel.
Thanks,
DaDad

liberty of conscience said:

Let's consider the text in English:

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Why would you dilute the literal text by using a translation? Don't you like what GOD actually said? Maybe GOD's words don't fit a given commentator's presentation, but given the choice, I'll stick with what GOD actually said: mashiyach.


... and if Jesus is the mashiyach then a provision was made for HIS sins.

Thanks,
DaDad