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The Pinnacle of Evolution

Gene2memE

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I see you as pretty shallow...or even afraid.

The videos show the complexity of life. But, if you refuse to take the time to watch them..and I guarantee you will enjoy them..I don't have much to say to you.

I've watched both before.

The first is an interesting and thorough explanation of the internal workings of a cell, that could do with some modification of the levels of its backing music.

The second is a piece of Intelligent Design dreck which fails on just about every level - its not good science, its not good propaganda for ID, its not religion or good theology and its central arguments are pretty poor overall. Its central positions about design, information, DNA coding and intelligence have already been thoroughly debunked by those with the relevant expertise, Christian believer and non-believers alike. Even Christian apologists have laid into it.
 
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Hoghead1

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If you truly desire education..you'll watch the videos. The inner life of a cell is quite interesting.
I'm kinda disapointed that you as a christian would blow off my recomdation to watch the video......what do you have to lose??
I gave you good reason why I, as a Christian, am ignoring those videos. They are not going to tell me anything more than I already know. What I don't know, what I am curious abut is where you are going with these videos. What did you take away from them that you consider important enough to share here?
 
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Hoghead1

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I find it hard to reply to your ignorance.

Watch the short videos. They say more than I could ever say.

If you can't watch the short videos...Our conversation is over. The videos are amazing and show how a cell works,,,if you want to remain ignorant to that...and be able to debate the issue....then so be it.
As i said, creationist or evo-minded...you'll love the videos as they show how a cell works, But, remain ignorant if that is your desire. It's tough to discuss this topic with the ignorant.
Remain ignorant of what? From what I'm hearing these films are just so much creation-science propaganda. If you are interested in discussing the argument form design, that is another matter. I can understand why you would want to do that. Is that what you want to do? If so, there's tons of literature here, so we don't need those films at all.
 
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PsychoSarah

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First video: just an initial comment, I find the music in the background a bit distracting, as it is a bit too close to the same volume as the narrator. It also begs to be paired with a professor to explain the mechanisms shown visually, but not chemically. I would not recommend this video for someone lacking a background in biology, but it would be redundant for someone in a biology-based career. Also, I did not find it interesting, that narrator had a case of BenSteinism (droll tone). Furthermore, it mentions many structures without stating what they do, like mitochondria (their primary function being energy production). Overall, this first video bit off more than it could chew, wanting to go through every little step in the inflammatory response of a leukocyte, but sacrificing detail for it, which amounts to an interesting visual, but too many gaps in information for this video to be useful to anyone that has a weak biology background.

Second video: Misleading representation of how DNA results in the production of proteins. It's a chemical reaction, nothing is really "read" by anything, and most DNA codons are redundant, with multiple ones having the same function despite being made of different bases. Furthermore, mRNA is not a copy of the strand used to make it; it's a complimentary RNA strand to it (which means where there is a C in the DNA, the RNA will have a G in that place). RNA also contains Uracil, which DNA does not, in the place of the T you see there (can't spell the bases off the top of my head, and too lazy to look them up). The strand is not "spat out", it moves through like an assembly line, with part of it moving through until it ceases being produced thanks to the presence of a stop codon, and the rest moves through. It calls the nuclear pore complex "a machine", even though all it is is a selectively permeable membrane that, or more basically, holes that are a size that prevents molecules bigger from them from going through, as well as ones containing components chemically repelled by the membrane, and lets the rest go through because the size and chemistry allows it to happen. The ribosome also is not a machine, and it does pretty much the same thing as the protein that produced the mRNA, but for making proteins. There are tons of ribosomes, to the point that inevitably, the mRNA is going to bump into an appropriate one and the protein will be produced. This is all just a sequence of chemical reactions, but the video acts as if it is consciously guided, but it isn't. A barrel-shaped machine? Really? Not gonna use proper terminology, video? I guess saying molecular chaperones was too hard (by the way, proteins will often attain the correct shape due to chemical interactions between its constituent atoms, even without these, they just catalyze the process and act as chemical barriers to the formation of incorrect configurations). Also, the chain is still a protein prior to folding into a specific configuration. Also, no mention of the Golgi Apparatus and it's role? Sigh.
 
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PsychoSarah

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Where are they flawed? In fact the one is made by evolutionist. So where are they flawed? I would like to know?

I must also ask, were they not pretty cool? Well done?
Yeah, they both were pretty flawed, one was full of fluff and didn't elaborate where it needed to, while the other used very poor wording and was also missing details (though, I got more from that one than the first, despite it being half as long). There are better videos out there that are still quite short that do the job much better. I can find you some, if you want.
 
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DogmaHunter

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Collins - Theistic Evolution is clearly deterministic as apposed to non deterministic random events. Evolutionists universally claim that natural selection is anything but random and very deterministic. God had a plan for us - humans from the very beginning of the universe. Adam and Eve were the first humans 6,000 years ago. Adam was the first husband and Eve was the first wife, they were the first man and women, before them you had male and female. It would take a whole book to discuss all that happened in the Garden of Eden 6,000 years ago. All backed with rock solid scientific evidence. You may not understand the difference between theistic and atheistic evolution but that maybe because when you scan the brand of atheists there are areas of their brain that do not work on the same level as theists. Of course the reverse also shows that atheists have analogical areas of their brain that light up more then the theists.

That was not at all an answer to the question.
 
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DogmaHunter

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Your getting the threads mixed up. The evidence for God has to do with the brain scans and areas of the brain that are active in theists and not active in atheists.

Myeah... the same parts also light up in apple fanboys when they are shown iphones and imacs.
 
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DogmaHunter

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If you truly desire education..you'll watch the videos. The inner life of a cell is quite interesting.
I'm kinda disapointed that you as a christian would blow off my recomdation to watch the video......what do you have to lose??

I find it quite condescending of you to assume that people here aren't aware of the complexity of biological machinery.

Most of us don't need to watch some youtube clip to realise that.
 
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PsychoSarah

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I find it quite condescending of you to assume that people here aren't aware of the complexity of biological machinery.

Most of us don't need to watch some youtube clip to realise that.
-_- you used the word. machinery. It isn't machinery, gosh darn it, I hate these tendencies, calling DNA programming and the like, ugh.
 
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DogmaHunter

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-_- you used the word. machinery. It isn't machinery, gosh darn it, I hate these tendencies, calling DNA programming and the like, ugh.

I have no problems with those words. They only become a problem when creationists pretend they mean things that they don't mean.
 
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bhsmte

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Wow, where to begin. The question is how did it evolve?

I need you to watch two videos...Guaranteed you'll like them. Seriously, you'll enjoy them whether you are an evolutionist or a creationist.


and


Once you have watched them we can discuss. bhsmte, I'll be waiting your reply.

I know quite a bit about human cells. I have a graduate degree in physiology.
 
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bhsmte

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I don't have the time to watch some video. I am here to talk to you, not them. If you can't put it into your own words, I'm not interested. The fact of the matter is, God is not a scientific question, despite your appeal to some film.

Well stated.

I dont watch videos. If they cant support their claim in their own words, it tells you all you need to know.
 
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-57

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Yeah, they both were pretty flawed, one was full of fluff and didn't elaborate where it needed to, while the other used very poor wording and was also missing details (though, I got more from that one than the first, despite it being half as long). There are better videos out there that are still quite short that do the job much better. I can find you some, if you want.

To be honest...you didn't really say much...but if you could present better videos that would be great.
 
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-57

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I find it quite condescending of you to assume that people here aren't aware of the complexity of biological machinery.

Most of us don't need to watch some youtube clip to realise that.

I would love to hear the atheist take on how such complexity of biological machinery...can evolve using a process that contains chance...You see, it's impossible.
 
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-57

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If you could present a specific argument in your own words, that would be great.

The video show sophisticated complexity on the celluar lever...so complex no process of random mutations could develop.

Then again I'm not an atheist and don't have the faith required to believe the organelle in the videos evolved.
 
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