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The Lord's Day Sabbath

Discussion in 'Semper Reformanda' started by JM, Dec 13, 2014.

  1. JM

    JM Particular Baptist Supporter

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    Do you keep a “Lord’s Day Sabbath?”

    Does it have to be Sunday?

    Is the Sabbath a 1 day in 7 principle? For example, could I keep Wednesday as a holy Day unto the Lord and it still be a Sabbath?

    Thanks,

    jm
     
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  2. BryanW92

    BryanW92 Hey look, it's a squirrel!

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    The well-researched and scripturally correct answer is probably no, but I've worked rotating shifts and weekends at many times in my life. Fortunately, those days are mostly behind me now; but when you work in the utility industry, the customers have an annoying need for power and water on Sunday just like the rest of the week. So, if the choice is a Wednesday Sabbath or no Sabbath, I choose Wednesday.
     
  3. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    I'm with Ignatius on this one:

    If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s Day. (Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians, Chap 9)

    Therefore, having become His disciples, let us learn to live according to the principles of Christianity. For whosoever is called by any other name besides this, is not of God. Lay aside, therefore, the evil, the old, the sour leaven, and be changed into the new leaven, which is Jesus Christ. Be salted in Him, lest any one among you should be corrupted, since by your savour you shall be convicted. It is absurd to profess Christ Jesus, and to Judaize. For Christianity did not embrace Judaism, but Judaism Christianity, that so every tongue which believes might be gathered together to God. (Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians, Chap 10)

    Christ is the fulfillment of the whole Law, not just the ceremonial part and then we are still obligated to uphold the moral Law in some way.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2014
  4. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    And Paul:

    When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

    Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ
    (Col 3:13-17).
     
  5. JM

    JM Particular Baptist Supporter

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    Hebrews 4 King James Version (KJV)
    4 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
    2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
    3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
    4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
    5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
    6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
    7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
    8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
    9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
    10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
    11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
    12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
    13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
    14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
    15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
    16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

    I know many Reformed folks would say this passage teaches that we should keep a sabbath but I don't believe it does. The rest mentioned is by faith in Christ and not a physical day of rest...

    jm
     
  6. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    Is there any tradition of the Church for its first 500 years that in any way resembles modern sabbatarianism? Is it a hold over from later Popery?

    Tertullian was rather clear that the Christian was under no obligation to uphold any sort of sabbath or circumcision:

    Therefore, since God originated Adam uncircumcised, and inobservant of the Sabbath, consequently his offspring also, Abel, offering Him sacrifices, uncircumcised and inobservant of the Sabbath, was by Him commended; while He accepted what he was offering in simplicity of heart, and reprobated the sacrifice of his brother Cain, who was not rightly dividing what he was offering. Noah also, uncircumcised— yes, and inobservant of the Sabbath— God freed from thedeluge. For Enoch, too, most righteous man, uncircumcised and inobservant of the Sabbath, He translated from this world; who did not first taste death, in order that, being a candidate for eternal life, he might by this timeshow us that we also may, without the burden of the law of Moses, please God. Melchizedek also, the priest of the most high God, uncircumcised and inobservant of the Sabbath, was chosen to the priesthood of God. Lot, withal, the brother of Abraham, proves that it was for the merits of righteousness, without observance of the law, that he was freed from the conflagration of the Sodomites (Chapter 2, An Answer to the Jews).

    Likewise, in Chapter 4, Tertullian argues that the Sabbath was fulfilled in Christ:

    the observance of the Sabbath is demonstrated to have been temporary....Whence we discern that the temporal sabbath is human, and the eternal sabbath is accounted divine; concerning which He predicts through Isaiah: And there shall be, He says, month after month, and day after day, andsabbath after sabbath; and all flesh shall come to adore in Jerusalem, says the Lord; which we understand to have been fulfilled in the times of Christ, when all flesh— that is, every nation— came to adore in Jerusalem God the Father, through Jesus Christ His Son, as was predicted through the prophet: Behold, proselytes through me shall go unto You. Thus, therefore, before this temporal sabbath, there was withal an eternal sabbath foreshown and foretold (Chapter 4).

    The Synod of Laodicea clearly differentiated between the Sabbath and the Lord's Day, and even permitted work on the Lord's Day. This shows that the modern, legalistic view of the Lord's Day as the new Sabbath, with identical obligations, is clearly a later innovation:

    Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ. (Canon 29)

    Here Cyprian, when defending the practice of not delaying baptism to the eighth day after birth so that it may directly follow the pattern of circumcision, clearly differentiates between the Lord's Day and the Sabbath. Further, he not view baptism as a replacement for circumcision as the Covenant Theology types argue, but rather in effect a shadow of the spiritual circumcision that is made possible by Christ being resurrected on the "eighth day."

    For in respect of the observance of the eighth day in the Jewish circumcision of the flesh, a sacrament was given beforehand in shadow and in usage; but when Christ came, it was fulfilled in truth. For because the eighth day, that is, the first day after the Sabbath, was to be that on which the Lord should rise again, and should quicken us, and give us circumcision of the spirit, the eighth day, that is, the first day after the Sabbath, and the Lord's day, went before in the figure; which figure ceased when by and by the truth came, and spiritual circumcision was given to us (To Fidus, on the Baptism of Infants, Chapter 4).

    Later Church Tradition, evidenced by the Apostolic Constitutions (380 AD?), started contriving days of necessary fasting and such. Interestingly enough, the idea that the Christian was duty-bound to do this on a Sunday did not enter anyone's minds. Rather, good Friday was the only Sabbath:

    But there is one only Sabbath to be observed by you in the whole year, which is that of our Lord's burial, on which men ought to keep a fast, but not a festival (Apostolic Constitutions, Book VII, Chapter XXIII).

    In fact, I cannot find anywhere a single "mention that the Sabbath day rest was changed into Sunday day rest."
     
  7. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    Let's pile on some more against the Popish practice of Sabbatarianism.

    One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind (Rom 14:5).

    How does a man-made Confession that puts one day above another abrogate:
    -The clear teaching of the word of God
    -The clear teaching of all the early interpreters of the Scripture for the first 500 years of the Church
    -The teaching of Reformed thinkers such as Calvin (at least in his own interpretation fo Hebrews 4), Luther (who condemned Sabbatarianism), and those who devised the Second Helvetic Confession.

    I simply do not see the justification.
     
  8. tulipbee

    tulipbee Worker of the Hive

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    I go to church every other Sunday. Can I have a feed back on this?
     
  9. BryanW92

    BryanW92 Hey look, it's a squirrel!

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    That's better than once every third Sunday.
     
  10. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    The Scripture says not to forsake the assembling of the saints. So, this does not mean there is a weekly, biweekly, monthly, biweekly, or etc requirement. However, it does mean that worship in a church setting is a priority for the Christian.
     
  11. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    Do you want to be there and cannot or can you be there and don't want to?

    There is no requirement that we attend every time the doors are open but it might say something about our spiritual state if we habitually absent ourselves from it.

    The public assembly for worship is the one place the Lord Jesus has promised to be. What if He makes Himself known in the preaching of the Gospel and you weren't there?

    Having said that I am aware that most of what passes as worship today is nothing but a show and hypocrisy. It can easily be said that you are better off not attending.
     
  12. BryanW92

    BryanW92 Hey look, it's a squirrel!

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    People say that a lot here on CF. I think that the real hypocrisy comes from thinking that the "show" can keep such a devout Christian from worshiping. Those who are such great Christians need to be where the "show" is happening to demonstrate what worship really is.
     
  13. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    So would you say that a believer can actually worship God in a place where man is worshipped instead of God? Can a believer worship God in a place where a false gospel is preached? Can a sheep be comfortable in a goat barn?

    We demonstrate what worship really is by gathering with other believers and really worshipping not by gathering with the religious who know nothing of the Gospel or of the Christ of the Gospel.

    BTW worship isn't about a demonstration to others it is about falling on our faces (speaking figuratively) before the throne of the Most High God with thanksgiving and praise in the heart. It is to be like the cherubim who cover their eyes with two wings and their feet with two wing and with two they fly crying Holy Holy Holy is the Lord of Hosts. It is to approach His throne of grace with boldness, awe and humility laying hold of His promises and resting in an accomplished and eternal salvation in Christ.

    We are never to do anything to be seen of men. Take that as far as you can.
     
  14. abacabb3

    abacabb3 Newbie

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    This is getting of topic guys.
     
  15. BryanW92

    BryanW92 Hey look, it's a squirrel!

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    Yes. I say that with God, all things are possible.

    But I am not talking about a place where "man is worshipped". I'm talking about churches where God is worshipped, but done poorly. I've never been to a man-worship church. I know they exist in the form of Joel Osteen and Joyce Meyers and such, but let's just admit that they aren't a church. A lot of people consider any church with an electric guitar to be man worship. That is simply not true.
     
  16. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    I am talking about where the service is focused on man and his will. The message is about you and you feeling or doing something.
     
  17. JM

    JM Particular Baptist Supporter

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    I think I'm changing positions. Too much time spent with the Presbyterians! haha

    My family returned to keeping the Lord's Day and the blessing is evident. I'm not a convinced Sabbatarian but maby, just maybe, moving that way.

    What should I read?

    How do you understand Hebrews 4?

    Thank you,

    j
     
  18. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    Oh no! Perhaps when I get home in a week or so I will explain how the word translated Sabbath in Hen. 4 is a different word which helps explain much.
     
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