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Jesus left us with two commandments that fulfill all of the law when obeyed.You believe there is no Law or Commands given to believers in the New Covenant?
Or are you saying there is no penalty to disobeying God's Commands in the New Testament?
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I've never, ever, ever said that I through out the moral law. I said that I am in a different relationship to it.
While you may say that you do not throw out the Moral Law, the end result is still the same when you say there is no consequences to your soul in the after-life if you do break God's Laws. By teaching such a thing, you are going to lead people into breaking God's Laws (Whether you want that to happen or not). It is a doctrine of immorality that gives people a license to sin.
It would be nice if you stopped jumping to conclusions about what people believe and actually ask them and then follow through with a conversation.While you may say that you do not throw out the Moral Law, the end result is still the same when you say there is no consequences to your soul in the after-life if you do break God's Laws. By teaching such a thing, you are going to lead people into breaking God's Laws (Whether you want that to happen or not). It is a doctrine of immorality that gives people a license to sin.
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Jesus left us with two commandments that fulfill all of the law when obeyed.
That is a very interesting answer.The power of sin is the law. (1 Cor. 15:56)
It is you who are providing the license to sin and encouraging immorality.
And you jumped right off the ledge with what I said. Not reading it and understanding it, because it is EXACTLY what Jesus said.And you need to keep reading the New Testament.
There are 1,050 + Commands given to us in the New Testament.
https://www.cai.org/bible-studies/1050-new-testament-commands
The only commands that I did not see on their list is the following:
- Believe & confess that Jesus is God Almighty in the flesh (John 8:24 cf. John 8:57, 58, 59) (1 John 4:3).
- Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. (Mark 16:15)
- Visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction (James 1:27).
- Feed and clothe the poor, welcome the stranger, visit the sick, and those in prison (Matthew 25:35, 36).
- "If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor" (Matthew 19:21)
- Thank God without ceasing. (1 Thessalonians 2:13)
- Receive the word of God not as the words of men, but as the very words of God (1 Thessalonians 2:13).
- Give to the poor needy brother; Especially if you wish them well (James 2:15)
- Pray the Lord's prayer (As an outline) (Matthew 6:9-13)
- Pray without ceasing (1 Thessalonians 5:17)
- Bear with them that preach another Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:4)
- Reprove the unfruitful works of darkness (Ephesians 5:11)
- Correct and train others in the Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16).
- Walk in the Spirit: This will result in the 9 fruits of the Spirit (Galatians 5)
- How to love according to 1 Corinthians 13.
- Keep the words of the prophecy of Revelation (Revelation 1:3).
- Live by speaking the Word of God (Which is our daily bread) (Matthew 4:4)
- Study to show yourself approved unto God (2 Timothy 2:15)
- Put on the whole armor of God (Ephesians 6:11-17)
- Be ye Holy as God is Holy (1 Peter 1:16)
- Do not add or take away from God's Word (Revelation 22:18, 19)
- If we as believers sin, we are to confess our sins (1 John 2:1) (1 John 1:9)
I am sure there are more.
- Do all things thru Christ (Philippians 4:13)
As for the Old Testament Law of Moses:
I believe Jesus Christ has nailed that to the Old Law to the cross and implemented the New Covenant Law of Christ or rules under the New Testament; For Jesus said sometime before cross that the Old was about to vanish away (Hebrews 8:13).
Oh, and just so that there is no confusion. We are not saved by any Law keeping, but we are saved by Jesus Christ when we repent of our sins and accept Him as our Savior. Keeping the New Testament Law of Christ is merely the proof that God lives within you. For a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. For salvation is not a super power but it is a person named Jesus Christ (1 John 5:12). Holiness and fruitful works is just evidence that you have been saved.
Hope this helps.
And may God bless you.
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It would be nice if you stopped jumping to conclusions about what people believe and actually ask them and then follow through with a conversation.
You put people in a position where they need to defend their beliefs after wrongly accused. It does not make for a conversation or teaching anyone can or wants to follow.
More questions, less conclusions.
I don't know exactly what he believes and neither do you. Why not ask others what they believe instead of assigning labels to people. He is right here, ask him.So you are saying he doesn't believe he is not under the penalty of God's Law?
I disagree.
He has given me no indication in our many conversations that this is so.
He believes in Eternal Security or a form of it - Which basically teaches that.
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And you jumped right off the ledge with what I said. Not reading it and understanding it, because it is EXACTLY what Jesus said.
So if you do not like that response, if you pray, ask Jesus about it.
And you need to keep reading the New Testament.
There are 1,050 + Commands given to us in the New Testament.
https://www.cai.org/bible-studies/1050-new-testament-commands
The only commands that I did not see on their list is the following:
- Believe & confess that Jesus is God Almighty in the flesh (John 8:24 cf. John 8:57, 58, 59) (1 John 4:3).
- Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. (Mark 16:15)
- Visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction (James 1:27).
- Feed and clothe the poor, welcome the stranger, visit the sick, and those in prison (Matthew 25:35, 36).
- "If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor" (Matthew 19:21)
- Thank God without ceasing. (1 Thessalonians 2:13)
- Receive the word of God not as the words of men, but as the very words of God (1 Thessalonians 2:13).
- Give to the poor needy brother; Especially if you wish them well (James 2:15)
- Pray the Lord's prayer (As an outline) (Matthew 6:9-13)
- Pray without ceasing (1 Thessalonians 5:17)
- Bear with them that preach another Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:4)
- Reprove the unfruitful works of darkness (Ephesians 5:11)
- Correct and train others in the Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16).
- Walk in the Spirit: This will result in the 9 fruits of the Spirit (Galatians 5)
- How to love according to 1 Corinthians 13.
- Keep the words of the prophecy of Revelation (Revelation 1:3).
- Live by speaking the Word of God (Which is our daily bread) (Matthew 4:4)
- Study to show yourself approved unto God (2 Timothy 2:15)
- Put on the whole armor of God (Ephesians 6:11-17)
- Be ye Holy as God is Holy (1 Peter 1:16)
- Do not add or take away from God's Word (Revelation 22:18, 19)
- If we as believers sin, we are to confess our sins (1 John 2:1) (1 John 1:9)
I am sure there are more.
- Do all things thru Christ (Philippians 4:13)
As for the Old Testament Law of Moses:
I believe Jesus Christ has nailed that to the Old Law to the cross and implemented the New Covenant Law of Christ or rules under the New Testament; For Jesus said sometime before cross that the Old was about to vanish away (Hebrews 8:13).
Oh, and just so that there is no confusion. We are not saved by any Law keeping, but we are saved by Jesus Christ when we repent of our sins and accept Him as our Savior. Keeping the New Testament Law of Christ is merely the proof that God lives within you. For a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. For salvation is not a super power but it is a person named Jesus Christ (1 John 5:12). Holiness and fruitful works is just evidence that you have been saved.
Hope this helps.
And may God bless you.
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I said EXACTLY what Jesus said.You said that we fulfill all law by obeying just the two commands of Jesus. That is not true. There are many other Commands or laws in the New Testament for us to obey that would be under the umbrella of Jesus's two commands. Please be a little more clear in the way you communicate so I do not misunderstand you. Thank you.
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Jason, is a special, self taught believer who has many 'interesting' theologies. Very like Saul, before he became Paul.Dang, I had a better deal before I came to Christ........
You don't know what he believes. But I do. I know he believes in a form of Eternal Security (like you) which is a denial that there are no dire consequences to one's soul if one disobeys God's Laws. For you both believe Jesus paid the price for all your sins: Past, present, and future. This gives you both a license to sin (if you so choose to do so). Even more of a problem is that it leads others into sin by such a teaching (Even children). And what does Jesus say will happen to a person if they lead a child into sin?I don't know exactly what he believes and neither do you. Why not ask others what they believe instead of assigning labels to people. He is right here, ask him.
I said EXACTLY what Jesus said.
Go find out what Jesus said in the Bible and come back
Many, if not most, reformed use Eph 1:4 as a proof text that God chooses who will believe. The verse does not say that. It says He chooses believers.No, that is patently obvious. This is what is news to me:
"The reformed don't like that much."
I don't see any question here. At least, provide the post # where you asked a question that you'd like me to answer.I will give you one more chance to answer my question, and one chance to substantiate your assertion that:
"The point is this: Eph 1:4 isn't about God choosing or electing anyone to salvation.
I don't have the patience for such confusion mixed with casual disregard.
Think about it Jason. Why do you not go get Jesus exact words and refute it.You said, I quote:
"Jesus left us with two commandments that fulfill all of the law when obeyed." ~ said by: To Be Loved.
However, this statement is not true. There are many other Commands or laws in the New Testament for us to obey that would be under the umbrella of Jesus's two commands. Please be a little more clear in the way you communicate so I do not misunderstand you. Thank you.
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The power of sin IS the law. (1 Cor. 15:56)
It is you who are providing the license to sin and encouraging immorality.
Why did you not quote Jesus exactly and provide a verse number reference instead of using your own words or spin on what he said?Think about it Jason. Why do you not go get Jesus exact words and refute it.
If commandments are so encompassing they include the others, than it is not refuting the others. Think about it deeply. It makes perfect sense.
The verse you quote is totally taken out of context of the rest of Scripture.
Paul says the grace of God teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously in this present world.
11 "For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live sensibly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;"
(Titus 2:11-12).
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