The Laws of the Universe

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
Parallax.

Bingo! At last! You revealed your imagined ace up your same state sleeve. A losing hand, however.

Space. Unless it is earth style space with just out laws and 3D, physical only, and time as we know it, then parallax is impossible in any real sense of the word.

Do you know that our space extends to infinity and beyond, Buzz? No. Hec no.

And what's a first rate one? Expelled?

Now you want me to show a better movie, or you think you are clever?? Childish, much?

Boy are you hooped!

Davian · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
Watch it and refute ONE point from it, then I'll gladly comply by showing you how wrong you are.

No dodging, no word games, just refute one thing in that doco.

Or at the very least, show me that you've watched it by explaining something from it. Just a brief summary, I'm not asking for a whole transcript.

I'd bet my left ball that you can't.

Davian said:
It appears that your family jewels will be safe.

dad said:
But not potent enough to make a point. Why pretend your story video has any when you can't get it together here and now before us all, to talk details? When I offered distances to stars and the basis science uses as a point, you come back with family jewel nonsense. If the distance to stars is off red or blue shifts lose their meaning. Star composition and size lose their meaning. The big bang loses it's family jewels...dark matter becomes an unneeded fantasy, and etc etc etc. Your video starts to look more than ridiculous....

Does this make sense to anyone else? It's not my video. And how did the big bang get family jewels?

You do know that family jewels is a euphemism for mens' private parts?

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
VehementiDominus said:

Para

Yeah, we look at a star when the Earth is one side of its orbit around the Sun, and we look at the same star when it's the other side of the orbit.

Click to expand...

You do the same thing your brain does every time it opens both eyes and determines how far away everything is.

Our brains are generally on or near earth! Stars are not.

We use the same method your brain uses for depth perception to work out how far away the nearest stars are.

No! You only thought you did. You have actually just imagined stuff. -- Projected linear dimensionally challenged fishbowl concepts you though had to translate into distances into the unknown!!

Admittedly, the doco doesn't explain that parallax is how your eyes achieve depth perception, but it's not hard to recognise.

Our earth eyes are not relative to deep space when they merely superimpose present state earth laws and forces and time and space far far beyond where anyone knows they apply.

It's basically the same principle. Just imagine the Earth on the left of the Sun is your left eye and the Earth on the Right of the Sun is your right eye.

Foolishness. Our system is not relevant when discussing deep space.

Of course, I could explain how E=MC^2 wouldn't work in a "different state", but I'm too drunk to do that right now. Lemme sober up and I will.

Earth energy and light are energy and light that exists in this temporal present state near earth. It isn't even relative far far away that man knows.

dad · Jun 11, 2011

Davian said:
Does this make sense to anyone else? It's not my video. And how did the big bang get family jewels?

Then do you renounce it as foolish fables? Or will you dare defend it in detail?

You do know that family jewels is a euphemism for mens' private parts?

I was trying to say that your point and video were impotent in sensitive terms.

VehementiDominus · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Bingo! At last! You revealed your imagined ace up your same state sleeve. A losing hand, however.

Space. Unless it is earth style space with just out laws and 3D, physical only, and time as we know it, then parallax is impossible in any real sense of the word.

Um, except that it does work. If it didn't then you have to either admit that humans don't have depth perception or that the Earth doesn't orbit around the Sun.

Do you know that our space extends to infinity and beyond, Buzz? No. Hec no.

What makes you think that space extends for infinity?

Now you want me to show a better movie, or you think you are clever?? Childish, much?

I'd quite like you to show me a better "movie" and I'm pretty certain I'm cleverererer than you could ever hope to be (But then so are molluscs.).

dad · Jun 11, 2011

Davian said:
Very true. Obviously.

OK

Agreed - remember that 'burden of evidence' concept you were struggling with?

No. I don't struggle with other men's burdens. A same state past is not my claim.

Just because you cannot falsify a scientific theory, it does not follow that it is not falsifiable.

Then show how it can be?

Your phrasing of that statement suggests that you do not understand what 'falsifiable' means in terms of scientific theory. It's up to you to falsify it. Not just throw mud.

Define "it"?

I think that thread where you were positing that astronomical observations of relative velocities of galaxies could be falsified through comparisons to ghosts traveling at similar speeds can be found here.

You failed to provide robust falsifiable definitions to work with.

What would you like defined? Science uses earth forces and laws for the past to work with. That is pretty clearly defined.

You failed to substantiate even the existence of something spiritual.

No need. That is a known quantity. Science is not able to comment on that at all.

I don't believe in wishing. Do you?

I have no need.

VehementiDominus · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Our brains are generally on or near earth! Stars are not.

No! You only thought you did. You have actually just imagined stuff. -- Projected linear dimensionally challenged fishbowl concepts you though had to translate into distances into the unknown!!

Our earth eyes are not relative to deep space when they merely superimpose present state earth laws and forces and time and space far far beyond where anyone knows they apply.

Foolishness. Our system is not relevant when discussing deep space.

Earth energy and light are energy and light that exists in this temporal present state near earth. It isn't even relative far far away that man knows.

Ok, the point clearly flew so far over your big head that it might as well've been in orbit.

Let me try again.

Imagine the Earth in Winter Solstice is your right eye.

Imagine the Earth in Summer Solstice is your left eye.

When you look at something, your brain makes the calculations it takes to work out how far say... your keyboard is, yes?

Now imagine the other star is the keyboard in our right eye/left eye analogy.

We can use this to work out how far the other star is mathematically.

Either you're deliberately misunderstanding me and being dishonest or you're stupid. The choice is yours.

The eye/brain thing is an analogy, because the principle is the exact same.

If anyone else thinks they can describe this better, or understands what I'm on about, please let both of us know, just so we can laugh at Dad more than we already are.

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
Um, except that it does work. If it didn't then you have to either admit that humans don't have depth perception or that the Earth doesn't orbit around the Sun.

Let's be clear here. Our solar system is not an issue for earth zone laws...get it?? You need it to work far far away.

What makes you think that space extends for infinity?

Nothing. But science bandies about the questions on expansion lasting forever or not.

I'd quite like you to show me a better "movie" and I'm pretty certain I'm cleverererer than you could ever hope to be (But then so are molluscs.).

So even you tire of your evo flicks. OK.

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
Ok, the point clearly flew so far over your big head that it might as well've been in orbit.

Let me try again.

http://spaceshipearth1.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/the-earths-orbit-1.jpg[/quote]

Imagine the Earth in Winter Solstice is your right eye.

Imagine the Earth in Summer Solstice is your left eye.

When you look at something, your brain makes the calculations it takes to work out how far say... your keyboard is, yes?[/QUOTE] No. Not when I look at the spiritual also far away universe. The lines man thinks he draws to God can't actually leave the fishbowl.

[QUOTE]
We can use this to work out how far the other star is mathematically.[/QUOTE] No. NOT unless the far away universe space is like our earth space. You do not know. Be honest.

You really are hooped. Come over to the winning side. Be happy.

Davian · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Then do you renounce it as foolish fables? Or will you dare defend it in detail?
I was trying to say that your point and video were impotent in sensitive terms.

And I am trying to tell you that you are getting mixed up with whom you are responding to.

You are making even less sense when you do that.

Slow down. Take a deep breath. There, that's better. No post in haste.

VehementiDominus · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
No. Not when I look at the spiritual also far away universe. The lines man thinks he draws to God can't actually leave the fishbowl.

Ok, prove God exists.

Prove the spirit exists.

Prove that what you think is outside the "fishbowl is what you're saying is outside the "fishbowl.".

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
Ok, prove God exists.

Prove the spirit exists.

Prove that what you think is outside the "fishbowl is what you're saying is outside the "fishbowl.".

Easy. Replace 'God' with far away universe state. You can't draw a line there through 3D space unless you know that our space and laws and physical only nature extend there!

The 'fishbowl' is just a way to refer to the limits of what science knows. How could you get by that??

dad · Jun 11, 2011

Davian said:
And I am trying to tell you that you are getting mixed up with whom you are responding to.

You are making even less sense when you do that.

Slow down. Take a deep breath. There, that's better. No post in haste.

So make your point clearly...avoid confusion. Be brave.

VehementiDominus · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Easy. Replace 'God' with far away universe state. You can't draw a line there through 3D space unless you know that our space and laws and physical only nature extend there!

The 'fishbowl' is just a way to refer to the limits of what science knows. How could you get by that??

So you're saying space is 1 dimensional?

you can't be saying the universe is more than 1d because if it was 2d, 3d, 4d, 5d, 6d, 7d, etc, 2 dimensions would still exist and 2 dimensions is all that's needed for parallax to work. It's basic trigonometry.

Either parallax works or the universe is 1 dimensional. You're claiming the latter.

Mikecpking · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Yes, and any of their ideas you are welcome to present. Baseless, bogus, assumed, believed, unsupported..I am fairly sure you have heard of at least 4 of those names.

It is up to you to present a point or points from your story show. When I looked at it, skipping forward, I saw the same thing all the time...story telling, without support. If you claim otherwise, let's see it?

Decay in the past? Distance of stars? Show the proof, don't wave and poof.

Sorry to tell you, but they are all supported with evidence even in GPS as time and gravity are related as Einstein predicted.

Its upto you to demonstrate the view their discoveries are 'unsupported' with all the evidence was laid bare in the documentary!

dad · Jun 11, 2011

Mikecpking said:
Sorry to tell you, but they are all supported with evidence even in GPS as time and gravity are related as Einstein predicted.

Lie. Gps goes how far out? Can we get past kindergarten here please?

Its upto you to demonstrate the view their discoveries are 'unsupported' with all the evidence was laid bare in the documentary!

Easy to do. Just name one supposed discovery! --And we'll see what gets laid bare fast!

VehementiDominus · Jun 11, 2011

I think I've worked out Dad's MO.

Other person: *States a fact that disagrees with his blind religious faith*

Dad: IT'S A LIE! IT'S BASELESS! IT'S NOT TRUE! IT'S A FAIRY TALE! BELIEVED UNSUPPORTED! IT'S ASSUMED! BECAUSE THE UNIVERSE WAS DIFFERENT BACK THEN! YOU WOULDN'T KNOW! YOU WEREN'T THERE, MAN, YOU JUST WEREN'T THERE!

Other person:

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
So you're saying space is 1 dimensional?

No

But neither is deep space known to contain just physical 3D objects and earth laws and space and time.

you can't be saying the universe is more than 1d because if it was 2d, 3d, 4d, 5d, 6d, 7d, etc, 2 dimensions would still exist and 2 dimensions is all that's needed for parallax to work. It's basic trigonometry.

Right. I can't. But trig does not apply out of our space. That should be obvious. The question then becomes...how far is that!?

Either parallax works or the universe is 1 dimensional. You're claiming the latter.

Absurd.

Please inform us how we can draw a line through another dimension? What is spiritual material does not require the time to exist that physical only stuff does? What if physical concepts are limited regarding spacial realities of space that contains more than earth state space can contain?

When the bible uses measures for man, of a spiritual as well as physical eternal object, it refers to the measures as

Re 21:17 -And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, ... This seems to indicate that there is a difference.

dad · Jun 11, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
I think I've worked out Dad's MO.

Other person: *States a fact that disagrees with his blind religious faith*

If it was a fact it would be easy to support. What you offer is not...why is that!?

Dad: IT'S A LIE! IT'S BASELESS! IT'S NOT TRUE! IT'S A FAIRY TALE! BELIEVED UNSUPPORTED! IT'S ASSUMED! BECAUSE THE UNIVERSE WAS DIFFERENT BACK THEN! YOU WOULDN'T KNOW! YOU WEREN'T THERE, MAN, YOU JUST WEREN'T THERE!

Why, were you??

Mikecpking · Jun 11, 2011

dad said:
Lie. Gps goes how far out? Can we get past kindergarten here please?
Easy to do. Just name one supposed discovery! --And we'll see what gets laid bare fast!

Einstein predicted that gravity distorts space time and they found that the GPS satelites orbiting the earth had time running faster than here on earth. The consequences of that would mean that gps would not work.

We can also observe moons orbiting planets, we can see stars orbiting eachpther in binary systems so the same laws apply 'much further out' because gravity exists everywhere in the universe.

The onus is on you to disprove Einstein, the observations made by Hubble.

So I name 2 related discoveries for you to 'pull apart', gravity and relativity.

Go on then!

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