The incompatibility of faith and doubt

[topcare]

I have and do

 

[Jared R]

I don't really think so. I never doubt Christ, just Churches. I want the truth even if it makes me or others uncomfortable. I don't equate Christ with the Catholic Church

And yet Christ and the Church are one, just as the head and the body are one. The Catholic Church has no life and existence apart from Christ... our faith in Christ and in the Church is one faith.

 

[topcare]

And yet Christ and the Church are one, just as the head and the body are one. The Catholic Church has no life and existence apart from Christ... our faith in Christ and in the Church is one faith.

I agree but what Church? There is also the Orthodox and that is what it comes down to, what Church is the real true Church or does it even exist anymore.

 

[benedictaoo]

The one with the pope. Its how we know...

 

[benedictaoo]

And yet Christ and the Church are one, just as the head and the body are one. The Catholic Church has no life and existence apart from Christ... our faith in Christ and in the Church is one faith.

And the fact that all came from her... She is the tree, the rest are branches. Historically this is true. The EO, that's a little different because the EO are also true Churches with legitimate, licit dioceses.

 

[topcare]

The one with the pope. Its how we know...

How? Is it not that simple and I must evaluate what the Orthodox say about the situation. You see you all say Pope the Orthodox say not in the way Catholics think. It is confusing either one is right, the other is wrong or they both are wrong.

 

[MoonlessNight]

I agree but what Church? There is also the Orthodox and that is what it comes down to, what Church is the real true Church or does it even exist anymore.

Since the Church is an institution, historical continuity is a good way to start to find which Church is the Church established by Jesus. That eliminates the vast majority of Christian denominations, though distinguishing the Catholic Church from the Orthodox churches, and proving that the Church that Christ founded is still here require a finer analysis.

 

[benedictaoo]

How? Is it not that simple and I must evaluate what the Orthodox say about the situation. You see you all say Pope the Orthodox say not in the way Catholics think. It is confusing either one is right, the other is wrong or they both are wrong.

To me, the bible is very clear about it.As were the ECF

 

[topcare]

To me, the bible is very clear about it. As were the ECF

And to me not clear at all. It depends on what premise one starts from, if one starts from the premise that the Papacy is everything it says of itself then you will find evidence for it everywhere; However, if one starts from the premise of objectivity than the idea that the Papacy gives itself is not evident in Scripture or ECF and if it were the Orthodox would surely agree that the idea is there. It further gives me pause to know that a lot of the things of the Papacy was defined after the split.

 

[topcare]

Since the Church is an institution, historical continuity is a good way to start to find which Church is the Church established by Jesus. That eliminates the vast majority of Christian denominations, though distinguishing the Catholic Church from the Orthodox churches, and proving that the Church that Christ founded is still here require a finer analysis.

Agreed

 

[benedictaoo]

I know its difficult because the EO are true churches. Was it Augustine?? Who said with all these that have the succession, have sacraments, ect, how do we know? The pope. Jesus gave us the pope.

 

[topcare]

That I must disagree with, I believe all the Apostles have equal authority

 

[Virgil the Roman]

I've struggled with doubt and not being able to personally recognise the truth. I'd left the Church. However, in spite of or despite my own feelings of doubt, I put those aside, and obeyed the penances and instructions of my traditional Catholic confessor and his fatherly counsel. Being Catholic's very difficult, but it's True. And at times, we have to, as The Spiritual Combat admonishes us to do "have a distrust of self" and obey our confessor, the Church, and Christ. I had to reject my emotions' fleeting feelings and embrace dispassion and obedience even despite my own conscience's confusion and disorientation.