Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
I say that your source is wrong because it is contradictory. It suggests that mankind was around 200 million years ago. That's not scientific at all.My resource is the ONLY game in town. You say I am wrong because I do not want to take the time to answer your questions. OH well, so be it, I have better things to do with my time.
You are quoting something that I said, that was just me thinking out loud. I will try not to make that mistake again. Clearly, you have not done your homework to read the source for yourself. Maybe you can get AI to give you a summary of what Schroder is saying. Although his web page is very condensed for those with a short attention span who do not want to read the book. If you want to tear him apart you have to read and study what he said.I say that your source is wrong because it is contradictory.
Ok, well when you figure out what it is that you're trying to say, I'll be here. Don't blame other people for your own mixed signals.You are quoting something that I said, that was just me thinking out loud. I will try not to make that mistake again.
I am not the one trying to say it. I always quote people and let them defend themselves. Again you have failed to come up with something better. Where did you get your degree in astro physics from? Actually Schroder got his degree from MIT which is considered the best. As well Harvard across the river from MIT is considered the best. People think these schools are difficult to get into. You have to be able to do the work and only one is 500 is able to do that.Ok, well when you figure out what it is that you're trying to say,
I am not blaming anyone. I am answering questions to the best of my ability. So the conversation has to do with what you are interested in and want to talk about. Even though I bring up a subject to talk about.Don't blame other people
"By faith we understand that the [d]world has been created by the word of God so that what is seen has not been made out of things that are visible." (Heb 11:3)Nope.
Genesis 1:1-3 NRSVUE
[1] When God began to create the heavens and the earth, [2] the earth was complete chaos, and darkness covered the face of the deep, while a wind from God swept over the face of the waters. [3] Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.
When God began, the earth was chaos. It doesn't say when it was that God began creating. Only that He did. And in 6 days, he created the tohu wa bohu earth into an earth that was no longer tohu wa bohu.
God didn't create chaos and then go back and say "oh wait, this is a problem, let me create it again in 6 days".
Oops! I didn't mean to create that, let me take six more days to go back and clean it up.
The Church age is the Kingdom age, because the Church is the Kingdom of God.I come up with 5995 from when Adam was born or created. 1995 years from the beginning of the Church Age. The church age is ending and the Kingdom age is beginning.
There would be God. Outside of everything that is, there is nothing, or else it would be a part of all that is, no?So the universe is expanding into nothing? What if the universe would shrink? Would nothing return?
"By faith we understand that the [d]world has been created by the word of God so that what is seen has not been made out of things that are visible." (Heb 11:3)
Yes, it is very clear when God began creating. He created the heavens and the Earth "in the beginning". That is when He began; "in the beginning". And it is confirmed in Heb 11:3 that He made everything that exists out of things that cannot be seen, His own power.
And no, there was not an "oops". God made things exactly as He chose, in His timing, and always completely in His control.
It does say how long it was formless: one day. Because "in the beginning" (when time began and God started creating everything from nothing), God made the heavens and the Earth right then. There was nothing before the beginning, or that would not have been the beginning.The "beginning" is when God began creating. The text says nothing about how long the earth was formless before God began.
All of those say the same thing: "When God began to create/in the beginning God created".... This means that when God made from nothing everything that is, He started as one point, and that point is "the beginning". Nothing existed before that point. And the Earth He created at that point was without form or shape, and it was dark.That's why some translations simply translate the passage as follows:
Genesis 1:1-3 NRSVUE
[1] When God began to create the heavens and the earth, [2] the earth was complete chaos, and darkness covered the face of the deep, while a wind from God swept over the face of the waters. [3] Then God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.
Or
Genesis 1:1-3 CEB
[1] When God began to create the heavens and the earth— [2] the earth was without shape or form, it was dark over the deep sea, and God’s wind swept over the waters— [3] God said, “Let there be light.” And so light appeared.
Any story about what man does with things that God made cannot compare with the story of how God created everything from nothing. Man cannot create anything from nothing. Only God is capable of that. God made the Earth and all the heavens (space) from nothing beyond His own imagination. And then He shaped those things into what we have today. But there was nothing there before the beginning.It's similar to saying "When George began to create the cookies, the cookies were without form. So George said, let there be a cookie cutter".
The story is about George creating and when he began to do so. It's not about the age of the cookie dough.
One small problem with this whole theory: There was only one morning and one evening between "the beginning" of Creation and the end of "day one". Eight billion (8,000,000,000) years would include at least two trillion, nine hundred twenty billion (2,920,000,000,000) mornings and evenings. Since we all accept God as being correct and accurate (no contradictions or errors in Scripture), we cannot accept two trillion plus days in just one morning and evening.I do a lot with rock art. Every rock has a story to tell. I like to balance them. It is amazing how easy they are to balance.
The events line in the Bible line up with science, but the time is clearly not consistent. Gerald Schroeder's PhD resolves that issue with Einstein's theory of relativity. Each day in Genesis is half the length of the day before. I struggled with that for 20 years until Schroeder provided the solution. I do not do a lot of fancy math. Each day is half the day before. Schroeder does the exact math on his website. For me day one is 8 billion years. Very simple math. The earth is 4.5 billion years, the universe is 12.5, so that means the first day when God made the Heavens and the Earth is 8 billion years.
The second day is 4 billion. What happened? The earth cooled enough so that water became just that water a liquid. Water can be solid, a liquid or gas - vaper depending on the temperature. We are MOSTLY made up of water. Individual humans can be considered drops of water in the sea of humanity. And so on. No water, no humans.
Day three is 2 billion years ago. What happened? The great oxygen event. As a geologiest you would know a lot about day three because we can see the red in the rocks at that layer. The bible makes second hand referance to this. The clay God used to make Adam was red. God beathed life into Adam, that in part involves oxygen.
Day four is 1 billion years. Mesoproterozoic Era That has to do with light. Where does oxygen come from? Light. What does google say? "Around one billion years ago, a significant event in Earth's history was the evolution of multicellular life, marking a shift from primarily single-celled organisms to more complex life forms, often referred to as a "slow revolution" in the evolution of life on Earth; this period also saw the development of more diverse microbial organisms."
Day five - 500 million years ago Cambrian explosion.
Day six 250 million years ago. God created male and female in His image.
Day 7 125 million when God was resting we had the break up of pangea.
Day 8 75 million years ago was the Cretaceous Period and the extinction of most dinosaurs and other species.
No, it's not formless for 1 day. Creation occurs over 6 days. In fact, the earth is given form on day 3.It does say how long it was formless: one day. Because "in the beginning" (when time began and God started creating everything from nothing), God made the heavens and the Earth right then. There was nothing before the beginning, or that would not have been the beginning.
Any story about what man does with things that God made cannot compare with the story of how God created everything from nothing. Man cannot create anything from nothing. Only God is capable of that. God made the Earth and all the heavens (space) from nothing beyond His own imagination. And then He shaped those things into what we have today. But there was nothing there before the beginning.
Point taken. My point is that it was not formless for 8 billion years. It was formless for only a number of days, because it was given form within days of being made from nothing.No, it's not formless for 1 day. Creation occurs over 6 days. In fact, the earth is given form on day 3.
Genesis 1:9-10 CEB
[9] God said, “Let the waters under the sky come together into one place so that the dry land can appear.” And that’s what happened. [10] God named the dry land Earth, and he named the gathered waters Seas. God saw how good it was.
In some places (and in every place where it is associated with mankind), maybe it does, but in Gen 1:1 it means that God made everything from nothing, as Heb 11:3 confirms.It's not a matter of comparing God with man. It's a matter of observing how the term bara is used. And as noted already, when God bara'd in the Bible, he did this for Jerusalem, he did it for a blacksmith. He did it for the Ammonites, he did it for a signpost etc.
The term involves the giving form to things, or appointment of things, assigning things etc. Not the materialistic appearance of things. And this is just a fact of the terms. That's why Jeremiah refers to Jerusalem as tohu wa bohu. Jeremiah wasn't saying that Jerusalem disappeared out of thin air. Rather he is describing how the land was a barren empty void or wasteland.
Hebrews 11:3 is identifying God as creator of all, but it is not a retelling of Genesis. And that's an important distinction. Recognizing that Genesis speaks of creation over 6 days is not in contradiction with the understanding that God made everything (in a grander sense).In some places (and in every place where it is associated with mankind), maybe it does, but in Gen 1:1 it means that God made everything from nothing, as Heb 11:3 confirms.
The text just doesn't say how long it was formless. Be it 10 minutes, be it a fraction of a second, or be it billions of years. It's just not something that the text speaks into.Point taken. My point is that it was not formless for 8 billion years. It was formless for only a number of days, because it was given form within days of being made from nothing.
A good analogy for this would be something like a play.The text just doesn't say how long it was formless. Be it 10 minutes, be it a fraction of a second, or be it billions of years. It's just not something that the text speaks into.
And trust me, I fully understand how old earth creationists try to force it to say that Genesis describes billions of years of time (it doesn't say any such thing). But likewise, the text also doesn't say, at least not in Genesis, that the earth didn't exist at all before God began creating.
There is a third option here that many people overlook for various reasons. And that third option is that, Genesis is describing God's creative acts. That's what's important. Not so much the question of how short or long before God began, that the earth was present.
The clarification in Heb 11:3 is that He made everything from what cannot be seen (His own Power). And the key is that He made everything from nothing in those 6 days. He did not start with stuff already existing before "the Beginning". At the beginning He made everything from nothing.Hebrews 11:3 is identifying God as creator of all, but it is not a retelling of Genesis. And that's an important distinction. Recognizing that Genesis speaks of creation over 6 days is not in contradiction with the understanding that God made everything (in a grander sense).
It does. It says that He made everything "in the beginning" and from the Beginning to the end of the first day was only one morning and one evening.The text just doesn't say how long it was formless. Be it 10 minutes, be it a fraction of a second, or be it billions of years. It's just not something that the text speaks into.
Adam was created on the 6th day of the existence of the Earth, and he lived 950 years. He wasn't billions of years old, and he wasn't created billions of years after the heavens and Earth were created. When Adam died, the Earth and the heavens were only 950 years old also.And trust me, I fully understand how old earth creationists try to force it to say that Genesis describes billions of years of time (it doesn't say any such thing). But likewise, the text also doesn't say, at least not in Genesis, that the earth didn't exist at all before God began creating.
There is a third option here that many people overlook for various reasons. And that third option is that, Genesis is describing God's creative acts. That's what's important. Not so much the question of how short or long before God began, that the earth was present.
The clarification in Heb 11:3 is that He made everything from what cannot be seen (His own Power). And the key is that He made everything from nothing in those 6 days. He did not start with stuff already existing before "the Beginning". At the beginning He made everything from nothing.
It does. It says that He made everything "in the beginning" and from the Beginning to the end of the first day was only one morning and one evening.
It does. It says that He made everything "in the beginning" and from the Beginning to the end of the first day was only one morning and one evening.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?