The Flood

[JohnR7]

Soooooooo, you're a Hebrew scholar, huh? Nice try, the Bible says that the whole face of the earth was flooded and that the tallest mountain was 15 cubits (I believe) was under water. Yeah, local flood....whatever

The 15 cubits was a referance to the foothills being covered.

Moses we are told ended up at Mt Ararat. The water would have had to be at least 5000 feet above sea level in order for him to do that. If there was a global flood, that would have required the whole earth to be covered with 5000 feet of water. A global flood is not the best explaination of what the Bible says and the scientific evidence that we have does not support it. But you can believe that if you want, your only hindering yourself, not me.

 

[ptgd1st]

Psalm 90:4
For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.

2 Peter 3:8
But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

The Bible clearly tells us that a day to God is a thousand years to us.

These verses are merely an exageration meant to show that time means nothing to God. Not that it took a thousand years for each day. Besides what are you trying to prove?

 

[ptgd1st]

First of all the Lord says in Genesis 7:4 that he was going to wipe the earth clean of every living thing. I don't think that is possible with a localized flood.

In Genesis 7:19 They rose greatly on the earth and all the high mountains under the entire(not part of)heavans were covered.
What part of all the mountains and the entire earth does not work for you?

 

[California Tim]

The 15 cubits was a referance to the foothills being covered.

Moses we are told ended up at Mt Ararat. The water would have had to be at least 5000 feet above sea level in order for him to do that. If there was a global flood, that would have required the whole earth to be covered with 5000 feet of water. A global flood is not the best explaination of what the Bible says and the scientific evidence that we have does not support it. But you can believe that if you want, your only hindering yourself, not me.

I believe careful attention to the passage reveals that the waters 1st covered the mountains and THEN prevailed another 15 cubits above that.

 

[JohnR7]

How does this prove anything? Yeah TO GOD a thousand years is as a day and a day as a thousand years so what?

\

So, Genesis ch 1 covers a literal period of 7000 years. That would take us back about 12975 years ago. If you study science you will find some very interesting things happening at that time. First of all the earth was covered with water. Mostly ice from the ice age that was melting and flooding the rest of the earth. There was a major extinction that took place at that time. There was also a bottleneck in the DNA that took place right about then. As the ice melted the ocean level went up 300 to 400 feet. This is the area we find our coral reefs in as well as our off shore oil deposits. The oil companys spend lots of money on research looking for oil. They are not out to prove or disprove anything, they are just out to find oil and make money.

The earth looked pretty much like what the Bible says it looked like. Also this would explain the use of the word: replenish:

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Genesis 9:1-2
And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth. [2] And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered.

 

[JohnR7]

I believe careful attention to the passage reveals that the waters 1st covered the mountains and THEN prevailed another 15 cubits above that.

Genesis 7:19-20
And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered. [20] Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.

If you look it up in your Stong's Hills & Mountains is the same Hebrew word:
har, har; a shorter form of Hebrew 2042 (harar); a mountain or range of hills (sometimes used figurative) :- hill (country), mount (-ain), × promotion.

 

[ptgd1st]

I have to agree with tim.

Genesis 7:19-20
And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered. [20] Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.

If you look it up in your Stong's Hills & Mountains is the same Hebrew word:
har, har; a shorter form of Hebrew 2042 (harar); a mountain or range of hills (sometimes used figurative) :- hill (country), mount (-ain), × promotion.

What are you trying to say

 

[grmorton]

\

So, Genesis ch 1 covers a literal period of 7000 years. That would take us back about 12975 years ago. If you study science you will find some very interesting things happening at that time. First of all the earth was covered with water. Mostly ice from the ice age that was melting and flooding the rest of the earth. There was a major extinction that took place at that time. There was also a bottleneck in the DNA that took place right about then. As the ice melted the ocean level went up 300 to 400 feet. This is the area we find our coral reefs in as well as our off shore oil deposits. The oil companys spend lots of money on research looking for oil. They are not out to prove or disprove anything, they are just out to find oil and make money.

EVerything you just said is 100% false. AFrica was not glaciated and had no glacial waters on it at all at that time. There was no major extinction in the Old World (there was a small one in the New World but mostly due to the Native Americans coming in and killing off all the big animals. There is no genetic bottleneck from that time. We don't find corals generally deeper than 200 feet because the waters begin to get a wee bit dark, not because of some rise in the oceans. If the oceans had been lower we should find lots of reefs in greater than 600 feet of water but we don't. We are finding oil in up to 10,000 feet of water. I have personally been involved in that exploration effort and most of the 33 fields I have been involved with during their discovery have been in waters deeper than 600 feet. And you don't know diddly about the oil industry. I have worked as a geophysicist for 32 years.

 

[JohnR7]

What are you trying to say

From my study of science and my study of the Bible, I believe Noah's Flood was what they call a local flood. Most likely covering what is now modern day Turkey and Armenia. It is believed that there was a natural land damn holding back the water from when the ice melted at the end of the last ice age flooding the part of the world that Noah was in at the time. The land of Eden or Adamia.

The flood and the ark still have symbolic meaning for us today. The ark is said to represent Jesus and only those who are safely in Jesus will survive the destruction that is about to come on the world. Only the world will not be destroyed by water, this time it will be destroyed by fire.

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.

Matthew 3:11
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

 

[JohnR7]

If the oceans had been lower we should find lots of reefs in greater than 600 feet of water but we don't.

If the oceans had been lower? "When the ice sheets were at their peak in the most recent phase of glacial growth (15,000 to 20,000 years ago), sea level was 120 meters (400 feet) lower than it is today." http://www.fieldmuseum.org/vanishing_treasures/Origins_2.htm

 

[ptgd1st]

First of all the Lord says in Genesis 7:4 that he was going to wipe the earth clean of every living thing. I don't think that is possible with a localized flood.

In Genesis 7:19 They rose greatly on the earth and all the high mountains under the entire(not part of)heavans were covered.
What part of all the mountains and the entire earth does not work for you?

For the Local flood idea i refer to my previous post

 

[Remus]

First of all the Lord says in Genesis 7:4 that he was going to wipe the earth clean of every living thing. I don't think that is possible with a localized flood.

In Genesis 7:19 They rose greatly on the earth and all the high mountains under the entire(not part of)heavans were covered.
What part of all the mountains and the entire earth does not work for you?
...
For the Local flood idea i refer to my previous post

I think you've hit the nail on the head.

Any theories on a local flood that killed everything according to what Genesis says?

 

[JohnR7]

First of all the Lord says in Genesis 7:4 that he was going to wipe the earth clean of every living thing. I don't think that is possible with a localized flood.

Genesis 7:23
So He destroyed all living things which were on the face of the ground: both man and cattle, creeping thing and bird of the air. They were destroyed from the earth. Only Noah and those who were with him in the ark remained alive.

The word "ground" here is the word "Adamia" in the Hebrew. All that was in Adamia or the land of Eden was destroyed. All that was not on the ark. It is symbolic for the entire earth. If there was a world wide flood, it was not in Noah's day. Noah's flood would have to have been symbolic of a greater flood that took place at a different point in time.

The flood took place soon after Noah's father died (Lemech). Adam was still alive at the beginning of Lemech's life. His father could have known Adam, but he heard of him for sure.

 

[ptgd1st]

Is it me or did the meaning of earth change?

 

[ptgd1st]

what version are you using?

 

[ptgd1st]

Genesis 7:23 was a further clarification of what was said in Genesis 7:4. He was going to(genesis 7:4) and he did(genesis 7:23). That is what i see.

 

[JohnR7]

what version are you using?

I use the KJV and the NKJV. The strongs concordance is linked to the KJV.

 

[JohnR7]

Is it me or did the meaning of earth change?

There are two words that are translated "earth" One is "Adamia" and the other is
"erets">

'adamah, ad-aw-maw'; from Hebrew 119 ('adam); soil (from its general redness) :- country, earth, ground, husband [-man] (-ry), land.

'erets, Hebrew 776, Strong’s

'erets, eh'-rets; from an unused root probably meaning to be firm; the earth (at large, or partitively a land) :- × common, country, earth, field, ground, land, × nations, way, + wilderness, world.

 

[ptgd1st]

Ok i understand that but we are talking about Genesis 7:4, it still says every living substance of the face of the earth. and in Genesis 7:19 it says all the high hills that were under the whole heaven, were covered. How do you account for that

 

[Remus]

For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth.

And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:

All in whose nostrils [was] the breath of life, of all that [was] in the dry [land], died.

And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained [alive], and they that [were] with him in the ark.

Four times it is stated in four different ways. I think that's enough to satisfy any judge that everything except what was on the ark died.