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Is faith an act of will my friend? No, it is a gift from God. The faith OF Christ is what saves us. We are invited to step into that faith, and drink of the cup that never runs out.
And ultimately, ALL SHALL DO SO, as it is His will, and grace abounds over sin.
No, it doesn't mean that.They may word it however they want---bottom line is---those in the lake of fire will come out and live forever with Christ---boils down to Christ is not even needed---everyone comes out of the fire anyway---repentant or not.
James 2:14-20 / Matthew 3:8Is faith an act of will my friend? No, it is a gift from God. The faith OF Christ is what saves us. We are invited to step into that faith, and drink of the cup that never runs out.
And ultimately, ALL SHALL DO SO, as it is His will, and grace abounds over sin.
Why do you seek to build arguments no one is arguing about? Your words are true to those who believe and follow them. Are they true to those who do not believe and do not follow?
James 2:14-20 / Matthew 3:8
Better to start from agreement. Had you told me even 15 years ago I would be a Christian you'd have been scorned.
Do you believe it's not possible for God? What does the total victory of Christ look like to you?
It could, as He wills. It could not, as He wills.UR is Catholic-friendly. It is Catholic by definition. A universal church of universal salvation. Could it be?
Ezekiel 47:10
Dear F.L., how could I have been so remiss to have overlooked this thread. You've been left to hold the high line against a multitude. Like many bulls of bashan.
God is not willing that anyone should perish but that all should hear his Voice (the Word) and be saved. Sadly many harden their hearts, and close their eyes and ears to hearing the Word of God and JESUS stand on the outside standing at the door and knocking on the heart waiting for those who close their door to open it. If they open it he will come inside and sup and they will sup with him and he with them. All things are possible with God for those who have opened the door and believe and follow the true Shepard. For all those who do not open the door JESUS will say depart from me you who work iniquity I never knew you. Do you know these scriptures dear friend? If you do what do you think they mean?
It could, as He wills. It could not, as He wills.
Only God can restore the dead. Maybe I’ll trust him to do as he wills and spend my time ministering to the living.
How come the door in the story of the ten virgins was never
reopened?
Death, yeah. As in death. Not eternal life in hell. Eternal life anywhere other than as a gift of God is contrary to Scripture.Don't the scriptures teach the wages of sin is death to those who reject the gift of God's dear son?
Your failed to answer my simple questions either because you will not or cannot answer them. Yet you persist in discussing. And to top it off, you were the one who proudly boasted that no one could point out to you any passage that references persons getting out of the lake of fire. I did just that but you declined to answer. You can't have it both ways, thus I have no interest in your monologue.As you, yourself, pointed out---Jesus can not forgive those who do not repent. There is no reconciliation for the unrepentant. God does not force the will. That is something that you guys can not seem to acknowledge. God doesn't send anyone to the lake of fire to torture them into submission. They are in the lake of fire for the simple reason that they refuse to be covered by the blood of Christ and can not be protected from the Holy fire that is coming from God.
Isa 33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Isa 33:15 He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
Isa 33:16 He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.
Isa 33:17 Thine eyes shall see the king in his beauty: they shall behold the land that is very far off.
God isn't going to force anyone into submission. His fire is destruction to those not covered by the blood of Jesus--there is no coming out of the lake of fire unto eternal life with Jesus. Not one verse states that. It always consumes the wicked.
Isa_30:27 Behold, the name of the LORD cometh from far, burning with his anger, and the burden thereof is heavy: his lips are full of indignation, and his tongue as a devouring fire:
Isa_30:30 And the LORD shall cause his glorious voice to be heard, and shall shew the lighting down of his arm, with the indignation of his anger, and with the flame of a devouring fire, with scattering, and tempest, and hailstones.
2Ki_1:10 And Elijah answered and said to the captain of fifty, If I be a man of God, then let fire come down from heaven, and consume thee and thy fifty. And there came down fire from heaven, and consumed him and his fifty.
2Ki_1:12 And Elijah answered and said unto them, If I be a man of God, let fire come down from heaven, and consume thee and thy fifty. And the fire of God came down from heaven, and consumed him and his fifty.
Job_1:16 While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The fire of God is fallen from heaven, and hath burned up the sheep, and the servants, and consumed them; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
Eze_20:47 And say to the forest of the south, Hear the word of the LORD; Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will kindle a fire in thee, and it shall devour every green tree in thee, and every dry tree: the flaming flame shall not be quenched, and all faces from the south to the north shall be burned therein.
Eze_28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
Rev_20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Thjere is no reconciliation for these. The reconcilation is available to all---not all will accept it. We do not tell God what to do---He tells us.
Good nite.
You have the very bad habit of taking scripture out of context. The verses cited above state that God will not forgive them because they keep practicing sin. The consequence of that is that they end up in the LOF. However, you have not proffered any verse that demonstrates those in the LOF stay there forever or are annihilated. Care to take a swing at it?I believe it is your interpretation of these scriptures I disagreed with and you were shown that the context says that the blood of JESUS reconciles all sin and JESUS has made provision for the whole World. The scriptures do not say all the world will choose to be reconciled now do they. This is shown through many other scriptures already shared with you. For example *MATTHEW 25:31-41; HEBREWS 10:26-31; MATTHEW 7:13-27; MATTHEW 24:14.
When God destroys, what does he destroy? What don't you ask yourself that simple question and get back to me.The WIDE GATE leads to DESTRUCTION ἀπώλεια; apōleia (MATTHEW 7:13) dear friend and that is where we are told the many will be going. Destruction (G684) means ruin or loss physical, spiritual or eternal: - damnable (-nation), destruction, die, perdition, perish, pernicious ways, waste.
Like the ones above that I just refuted? Like Matt 7:14 which I refuted?Nonsense. I have addressed your scripture in detail showing the context and application and why it disagrees with your interpretation of it. You are simply ignoring all the scriptures that disagree with with you in order to cling to your doctrine.
The context is ALL THINGS which includes all believers because all will eventually believe, even if they have to go through the LOF to do so. All things means just that - no conditions, no caveats, no exceptions! I guess you glossed over those parts which state "Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is LORD, to the glory of God the Father" (Phil 2:9-11).Nonsense, I have done no such thing I have demonstrated both context, purpose and application of the scriptures to subject matter and reference to other scriptures all you have done is hand waive this as if it was not there. This demonstrated why your interpretation is in error. The scriptures teach no where that all men will be reconcilled to God it teaches that the blood of JESUS has made provision for all men to be reconcilled through his blood. Context is to all "BELIEVERS" that accepted God's gift. The scripture do not teach all people will be saved. Your reading this into the scriptures which in turn contradict other scripture like MATTHEW 25:31-41; HEBREWS 10:26-31; MATTHEW 7:13-27; MATTHEW 24:14 that show those who reject God's gift receive God's judgements and are destroyed.
The same applies to you doesn't it?I would suggest that it is people in your view that cling to their unbiblical teachings that will never give them up no matter how many scriptures are provided or contextual application to interpretation and subject matter are provided because there not really here for a discussion and have no thoughts to considering that perhaps there interpretation of the scriptures are in error no matter what is shared with them. Well you know what they say you can always lead a horse to water...
Your ignorance of Koine Greek is telling. I suggest you start studying it lest you continue to draw uninformed conclusions. Few are finding the narrow way when Jesus spoke those words. It can even be concluded that few are finding it in this present church age, however this fact does not preclude the possibility that all will find it in the ages to come which includes the LOF as the present tense participle make no reference whatsoever to the future. You have committed a logical fallacy simply known as overgeneralizing.Yep and this changes the contextual meanings of the WIDE and narrow Gate how? - Yep it doesn't. Everyone reading is in the present tense participle. Is God's Word for the dead or the living? The living are always present tense participle.
I just did. Care to correct your overgeneralization?Oh what nonsense. WE are in the present tense partical. God is not the God of the dead but of the living. Next thing you will start claiming that when JESUS speaks things to JEWS he does it is not mean't to applied to Christians when the scriptures teach all scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable.... 2 TIMOTHY 3:16.
Ok wanna try again?
I personally believe that if this were the case, baptism would not be emphasized 30 times in the New Testament.THE FALSE TEACHINGS OF UNIVERSALISM?
Hi all I have noticed in this forum that there is a handful of people going around and consistently promoting a dangerous false teaching called “Universalism” which is based on twisting and cherry picking the scriptures out of context to try and teach that God does not hold anyone accountable for sin and that all people will be eventually saved. I will post why I believe this to be a false teaching that is not biblical shortly.
Let’s first start with a definition of what the concept of Christian Universalism is.
Christian universalism refers to the idea that every human will be saved in a religious or spiritual sense. This specific idea being called universal reconciliation. (Source: wiki)
WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS? IF UNIVERSALISM IS TRUE DOES THAT MEAN GOD IS LYING WHEN HE SAYS NOT EVERYONE WILL BE SAVED WHO CALL ME LORD LORD AND MANY ARE CALLED BUT FEW WILL BE CHOSEN? I believe the answer to this is simple. Of course not.
What do the teachings of universalism (everyone will be saved no matter what they do) means to you? For me I do not believe in the Catholic teaching of eternal burning Hell this is not biblical but neither is the false teaching that all people will be saved regardless of sin.
For me this is a false teaching that is not biblical based on twisted scripture and a sign of the last days before JESUS returns. We are already seeing plagues and pestilence, wars and rumours of wars, famine like never before in quick succession. Today there are over 40,000 different form of Christianity most representing false teachings and false messengers (prophets) which are another sign of the end times *MATTHEW 24:24.
I believe it is time to get our houses in order and seek the Lord while he may be found.
For me Universalism is a false teaching as God’s salvation is conditional which we will look at shortly and a fulfillment of the scriptures…
2 TIMOTHY 4:3-4 [3] For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears. [4], And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned to fables.
1 THESSALONIANS 5:2-3 [2], For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. [3], For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction comes on them, as travail on a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
I will show why I believe the scrpitures do not teach everyone will be saved regardless of sin (Universalism) in the coming posts from the scriptures alone adding as little comments as possible and let the scriptures do the talking.
Friendly discussion please
May God bless you as you seek him through his Word
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