The Erroneous Christian Belliefs of Heaven and Hell

[xxxxxxtra]

that's what i think. it's really something for the unorthodox, but this is what i think now, after years of study on the matter.

You say years of study. But, it is clear that you have no idea of what is between the covers of the Holy Bible.. Don't get me wrong here.. I am merely stating an observation.. You are free to follow whatever false doctrine you choose.. It has no bearing on my salvation or that of God's elect.. I just think it's a shame..

 

[revrobor]

You are wrong again.. All of the saints that have gone before us are with the Lord.. Right up until Christ's resurrection they were in hades which is refered to the bossom of abraham.. Atleast the good side is.. Thecunsaved are still in haydes awaiting the great white throne judgment... Then they will be cast into hell.
Honestly, you do know that salvation has nothing to do with what ypu know.. Right? I mean i have read a few of your threads and wow are you misguided.. I recommend that you take everything you hear or have been told and review it in light of scripture.. If you review what i told you. You will find in scripture the words, "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord".. So where is the Lord? Sitting at the right hand of All Power..

YOU are mistaken. Hades is the holding place for the lost. Gehenna is Hell. Paradise is the holding place for the righteous. Both awaiting the judgments. Jesus is NOT just sitting at the right hand of All Power. He said "I go to prepare a place for you."

 

[Abana]

This may raise eyebrows but the truth must be told.

Do you know that no Christians or the heroes of faith are in heaven now? Even the ungodly are not yet in hell.This is not to say there is no heaven and hell.what I'm getting at is that it is after the resurrection of the dead will there be hell for those who are ungodly and the christian as well as heroes of faith inheriting the earth by reigning with Christ for a thousand years.

The often quoted story of Lazarus and the rich man is has for long be wrongly interpreted and explained.

Do you know Lazarus never went to heaven after he died neither did the rich man went to hell fire immediately?

I know many of you will take a swipe at my statement but I can't but tell you the truth as it is contained in the Bible.

No true christian will ever get to heaven but we will be changed if alive and the dead in Christ will rule with Christ in the kingdom of God starting in the Millennium.

Take time to click through the link in my signature Wisdom for Living and read after death, what next?

I read the information that you presented in your link. Thank you for filling in the gap for me with the Rich man and Lazarus. I had already come to the same understanding on the rest of it... Just hadn't put all the pieces together with that particular account in the Bible. Thank you for posting this. If it wasn't for anyone else, it was conformation for me.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Two questions:

Is Linear Time a factor after death?

And, where does Luke 23:43 fit into your belief?

Myself, I do not think we go someplace and wait 10's, hundreds, or in some cases 1000's of years for the return of Christ, once we die...

But I also believe that when we die, as Christians, we are with the Lord instantly...

I guess my questions above point to that...

What is the difference in time between someone who has been dead since 456AD and 1998AD? To the living it is a huge difference. To the dead there is no difference. Death is timeless. After death, you next instant moment is being with the Lord because death is timeless. You close your eyes, and instantly they open and you see the Lord coming. In reality it could have been 300yrs past but it would be instant to you.

The Christian's hope has never been in death but in the Resurrection. Paul states that if Christ has no risen, then we could not have been risen and we would have had no hope. If we do not need a resurrection to be with God then why is out hope based on the resurrection?

 

[Konyat]

This may raise eyebrows but the truth must be told.

Do you know that no Christians or the heroes of faith are in heaven now? Even the ungodly are not yet in hell.This is not to say there is no heaven and hell.what I'm getting at is that it is after the resurrection of the dead will there be hell for those who are ungodly and the christian as well as heroes of faith inheriting the earth by reigning with Christ for a thousand years.

The often quoted story of Lazarus and the rich man is has for long be wrongly interpreted and explained.

Do you know Lazarus never went to heaven after he died neither did the rich man went to hell fire immediately?

I know many of you will take a swipe at my statement but I can't but tell you the truth as it is contained in the Bible.

No true christian will ever get to heaven but we will be changed if alive and the dead in Christ will rule with Christ in the kingdom of God starting in the Millennium.

Take time to click through the link in my signature Wisdom for Living and read after death, what next?

Which part of the story of the Lord about The Rich Man and Lazarus told you that the Rich Man is not really in Hell.

 

[revrobor]

Which part of the story of the Lord about The Rich Man and Lazarus told you that the Rich Man is not really in Hell.

It was a vision. You should be able to understand that since no judgments have taken place no one is in Hell. There are some in Hades the "holding place for the lost" but no one has been sentenced to Hell yet.

 

[shturt678]

i thought heaven = paradise ... just my opinion ... nobody really dies, dies as all awake somewhere ... we are formed everlasting forward to eternity ... just my view ... open for correction of course

 

[revrobor]

One of the biggest mistakes many Christians make. Heaven and Paradise are not the same place.

 

[shturt678]

I absolutely agree with you revrobor ...I like IICor.12:4 for some reason to explain, In place of "the third heaven" we have "into Paradise." It's the word that Jesus used on the cross of course. Grabbing our Lexicons and Interlinears, in the Greek, all Greek to me, lol with you, (Koine) it has the meaning of a beautiful park, and it came to be used for "heaven" as a description that was taken from the Garden of Eden of course ... sorry I know you know but have to explain for those that do not ... The prophets at times pictured heaven in colors that were drawn from Eden and made heaven "Paradise Regained." I'm an Amil. hence need to put in a plug for us, lol, just joking ... Premils. regard these lovely passages of the prophets as reference to their "Millennial" concept.

 

[Konyat]

It was a vision. You should be able to understand that since no judgments have taken place no one is in Hell. There are some in Hades the "holding place for the lost" but no one has been sentenced to Hell yet.

The rich man was in hell in that story. I believed there are people in hell being punished. If you read the story carefully you will notice that the rich man had still "living" brothers, so this could not be the future judgement since the future judgement requires "all" to be present.
If the rich man is only dreaming on that story, how is it that the story said that the rich man can not go to his brothers to warn them when if he is only having this vision in a dream he can wake up and go to his brothers to warn them?

 

[shturt678]

Absolutely perfect Konyat, not that i'm the teacher, just refreshing to hear words of truth this morning ... just a little help to revrobor ... Lk.16:19, etc is not a Biblical vision, but a Parable and needs to be undressed ... no correction intended, just working with u ... in fact this is a great parable as it is tied into the Parable before it, "Parable of the Unjust Steward" ... the two parables are a pair and must be undressed as such ...
My point, the rich man went to hell and is still there now and if he could, he would like to warn his brothers ... he was even in "torments" without any pain meds. for eternity in the English sense from when he was in the womb forward as no annihilation ... not a happy camper to say the least .... NO STORY HERE.

 

[revrobor]

The rich man was in hell in that story. I believed there are people in hell being punished. If you read the story carefully you will notice that the rich man had still "living" brothers, so this could not be the future judgement since the future judgement requires "all" to be present.
If the rich man is only dreaming on that story, how is it that the story said that the rich man can not go to his brothers to warn them when if he is only having this vision in a dream he can wake up and go to his brothers to warn them?

No one is in Hell as no judgments have taken place. If it makes you feel better to think someone in in Hell that's fine but it's just not true.

 

[shturt678]

To revrobor ... hell is so packed now that I don't think there is anymore room for me ... hope so anyway ... remove Jn.3:18 just for starters "...he that believes not on him, has already been JUDGED, because he has not believed..." Their refusal to believe already judges them., being Amil., no soul sleep, upon passing, awake in either Hell or heaven awaiting the Parousia ... I think even the God-man Lord Jesus went to hell to let them know why they are there, etc.
Will then there not be a grand final judgment taking place at the last day? Not in the strict sense of the word. Then all men will already have received their judgment even as Jesus tells Nicodemus at this moment ... immediately after raised, on the right or the left, this could not happen unless they were already judged ... maybe I should be a Premil. and not be judged?? No sarcasm, but seriously ... doesn't look to good even for me ... just an opinion and refutable, IITim.3:16

 

[jasonsloss]

This may raise eyebrows but the truth must be told.

Do you know that no Christians or the heroes of faith are in heaven now? Even the ungodly are not yet in hell.This is not to say there is no heaven and hell.what I'm getting at is that it is after the resurrection of the dead will there be hell for those who are ungodly and the christian as well as heroes of faith inheriting the earth by reigning with Christ for a thousand years.

The often quoted story of Lazarus and the rich man is has for long be wrongly interpreted and explained.

Do you know Lazarus never went to heaven after he died neither did the rich man went to hell fire immediately?

I know many of you will take a swipe at my statement but I can't but tell you the truth as it is contained in the Bible.

No true christian will ever get to heaven but we will be changed if alive and the dead in Christ will rule with Christ in the kingdom of God starting in the Millennium.

Take time to click through the link in my signature Wisdom for Living and read after death, what next?

okay why are you not trusting in God's written word for answers???

 

[delaola]

Hell is not eternal. Hell is not burning today. When you die, you're dead until Christ comes again. Your soul does not live on to move around after you die. You don't go to heaven instantly, you don't go to hell instantly. Any questions? And I'm happy to explain for those who will listen. No disrespect, but the truth needs to be spread.

 

[revrobor]

To revrobor ... hell is so packed now that I don't think there is anymore room for me ... hope so anyway ... remove Jn.3:18 just for starters "...he that believes not on him, has already been JUDGED, because he has not believed..." Their refusal to believe already judges them., being Amil., no soul sleep, upon passing, awake in either Hell or heaven awaiting the Parousia ... I think even the God-man Lord Jesus went to hell to let them know why they are there, etc.
Will then there not be a grand final judgment taking place at the last day? Not in the strict sense of the word. Then all men will already have received their judgment even as Jesus tells Nicodemus at this moment ... immediately after raised, on the right or the left, this could not happen unless they were already judged ... maybe I should be a Premil. and not be judged?? No sarcasm, but seriously ... doesn't look to good even for me ... just an opinion and refutable, IITim.3:16

There is no one suffering in Hell at this time. While their lack of faith may have judged them they are not being punished yet. The final judgments (where sentenced is passed and rewards given) have not taken place yet.

 

[jasonsloss]

Hell is not eternal. Hell is not burning today. When you die, you're dead until Christ comes again. Your soul does not live on to move around after you die. You don't go to heaven instantly, you don't go to hell instantly. Any questions? And I'm happy to explain for those who will listen. No disrespect, but the truth needs to be spread.

there is no such thing as souls sleep and if we do not go to be with the Lord after we die then why did Paul state what he stated...

2 Corinthians 5:8...
8 [Yes] we have confident and hopeful courage and are pleased rather to be away from home out of the body and be at home with the Lord.

Philippians 1:16-26 (New King James Version)
16 The former preach Christ from selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my chains; 17 but the latter out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel. 18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is preached; and in this I rejoice, yes, and will rejoice. 19 For I know that this will turn out for my deliverance through your prayer and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ, 20 according to my earnest expectation and hope that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ will be magnified in my body, whether by life or by death. 21 For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22 But if I live on in the flesh, this will mean fruit from my labor; yet what I shall choose I cannot tell. 23 For I am hard pressed between the two, having a desire to depart and be with Christ, which is far better. 24 Nevertheless to remain in the flesh is more needful for you. 25 And being confident of this, I know that I shall remain and continue with you all for your progress and joy of faith, 26 that your rejoicing for me may be more abundant in Jesus Christ by my coming to you again.

 

[revrobor]

Hell is not eternal. Hell is not burning today. When you die, you're dead until Christ comes again. Your soul does not live on to move around after you die. You don't go to heaven instantly, you don't go to hell instantly. Any questions? And I'm happy to explain for those who will listen. No disrespect, but the truth needs to be spread.

You might want to see Rev. 20:10. The truth needs to be spread but you are not spreading it. You have picked up some false teaching from the SDA church. When a Believer dies today they go to Paradise (which is NOT Heaven) to await the judgments (remember the thief on the cross?). Non-believers go to Hades (not Hell) when they die to await the judgments.

 

[COG2013]

This may raise eyebrows but the truth must be told.

Do you know that no Christians or the heroes of faith are in heaven now? Even the ungodly are not yet in hell.This is not to say there is no heaven and hell.what I'm getting at is that it is after the resurrection of the dead will there be hell for those who are ungodly and the christian as well as heroes of faith inheriting the earth by reigning with Christ for a thousand years.

The often quoted story of Lazarus and the rich man is has for long be wrongly interpreted and explained.

Do you know Lazarus never went to heaven after he died neither did the rich man went to hell fire immediately?

I know many of you will take a swipe at my statement but I can't but tell you the truth as it is contained in the Bible.

No true christian will ever get to heaven but we will be changed if alive and the dead in Christ will rule with Christ in the kingdom of God starting in the Millennium.

Take time to click through the link in my signature Wisdom for Living and read after death, what next?

So you are telling that our souls, our LIVING souls remain in our dead bodies when we are burried? What about those who are blown up?
TOO MUCH THEOLOGY IS A BAD THING!

 

[horrace99]

what about this scripture

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Now if I am to go on living in the body, 33 this will mean productive work 34 for me, yet I don’t know which I prefer: 35 1:23 I feel torn between the two, 36 because I have a desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far,