The Double Message of Eternal Security.

[Kenny'sID]

Deflect, deflect, deflect from answering.
I dunno why you joined this kind of website, I really don't.

Aww, too bad, you were almost there after you made it necessary to go through all that, you missed it by one post and still choose to not take responsibility and blame me. Now stop being contrary, take responsibility and point me to the post you are referring too, instead of using the confusion YOU created as a way out.

 

[corinth77777]

.m

How many serious sins does one have to commit before God considers it wrong?
How many sins does a person need to commit before they are justifying sin or immorality?

It only takes one sin.
Adam and Eve caused a separation of spiritual death between God and all of mankind. The remedy or solution was the Messiah, Jesus Christ.

As for Stuart:
Well, I will let you be the judge after I show you a few more of his statements.

Stuart said this here:

"If we are faithless he remains faithful for he cannot disown himself
2tim2:13" ~ Stuart Lawrence.​

This was in reply to whether or not what happens when he sins.

Post #560.

Stuart also said,

"...humans cannot be perfect. They cant, I wish they could, honestly I do. There's nothing I would like more than to be sinless in my flesh. But I'm not, and neither are you, we are all contaminated with the fact we cannot act perfectly." ~ Stuart Lawrence.​

Post #960.

As for the letter kills and the pink bunny example:

This is true for the unregenerate, but not for the regenerate.
Those who put on the Lord Jesus Christ will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh.
Also, the Holy Spirit had inspired men to wrote the New Testament.
So when you obey Scripture of the NT, you are walking after the Spirit.
Also, I am not under any kind of Pharisee religion that teaches works alone salvationism that leaves out God's grace (when Paul used to be Saul, he used to be a part of this false religion). I believe Jesus gave Himself (His grace) for the purpose so as to make us holy as Paul says in Ephesians 5:25-27 and Titus 2:14. Again, read these verses very carefully and very slowly. They tell us the purpose as to WHY Jesus died on the cross.


...

We do not keep the law by trying to keep the law.......DW would say we keep the law by becoming the type of person from the heart that naturally keeps it.....We first make the inside clean before any works on the outside can be of our pure heart. We do it by trusting Jesus for everything...seek ye first the kingdom and his righteousness and all things will be added unto you.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Aww, too bad, you were almost there after you made it necessary to go through all that, you missed it by one post and still choose to not take responsibility and blame me. Now stop being contrary, take responsibility and point me to the post you are referring too, instead of using the confusion YOU created as a way out.

Already gave you



it once. And I'm sure everyone who read it understood the question you were asked.
Now please excuse me, I joined this website to discuss scripture, you appear not to want to do that.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yep, I quoted scripture:
If we are faithless
He remains faithful
For he cannot disown himself

If you have a problem with scripture take it to the Lord.
Don't complain about people quoting it.

Yep, I am not perfect in the flesh/ sinless, and neither are you. So what is your point?
When you want to claim perfection/ sinlessness in the flesh, let me know

The letter that kills was stated in present tense. Paul is talking to believers, not the unregenerate.

Paul states
The power if sin IS the law to believers also.

As I keep telling you. You don't understand Pauls message

First, your definition of what you mean by perfect can differ from the next guy. To help us understand what you are talking about, I would like to ask you a question:
Do you believe that you can die in unrepentant sin (such as lying and or lusting after a woman) and still be saved? Yes or no?

Second, 2 Timothy 2:13 is not a license for you to sin on occasion or for you to mimimize the punishment of sin leading to spiritual death for the believer. This verse says God is merely faithful if we believe not. Verse 13 (by itself) does not say WHO or WHAT God is faithful to. However, it gives us a clue as to what or who God is faithful to because it says He cannot deny Himself. God's Word is the part of God that He cannot deny. God remains faithful to His Word even if you do not believe. John 3:18 says he that does not believe is condemned. Again, 2 Timothy 2:12 gives us the context of 2 Timothy 2:12. If you deny Him, he will deny you.

God is faithful to His Word.

"So God has given both his promise and his oath. These two things are unchangeable because it is impossible for God to lie. Therefore, we who have fled to him for refuge can have great confidence as we hold to the hope that lies before us." (Hebrews 6:18 NLT).

So again, 2 Timothy 2:13 does not say God is faithful to you if you believe not. The Scriptures say that, "without faith, it is impossible to please Him" [God] (Hebrews 11:6).

"Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:22).

"For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee." (Romans 11:21).

19 "...The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.
20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear" (Romans 11:19-20).

"Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God" (Hebrews 3:12).

"But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin." (Hebrews 3:13).




...

 

[stuart lawrence]

First, do you believe that you can die in unrepentant sin (such as lying and or lusting after a woman) and still be saved? Yes or no?

Second, 2 Timothy 2:13 is not a license for you to sin on occasion or for you to mimimize the punishment of sin leading to spiritual death for the believer. This verse says God is merely faithful if we believe not. Verse 13 (by itself) does not say WHO or WHAT God is faithful to. However, it gives us a clue as to what or who God is faithful to because it says He cannot deny Himself. God's Word is the part of God that He cannot deny. God remains faithful to His Word even if you do not believe. John 3:18 says he that does not believe is condemned. Again, 2 Timothy 2:12 gives us the context of 2 Timothy 2:12. If you deny Him, he will deny you.

God is faithful to His Word.

"So God has given both his promise and his oath. These two things are unchangeable because it is impossible for God to lie. Therefore, we who have fled to him for refuge can have great confidence as we hold to the hope that lies before us." (Hebrews 6:18 NLT).

Notice again here the verse does not say God is faithful to you if you believe not. The Scriptures say that, "without faith, it is impossible to please Him" [God] (Hebrews 11:6).

"Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:22).

"For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee." (Romans 11:21).

19 "...The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.
20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear" (Romans 11:19-20).

"Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God" (Hebrews 3:12).

"But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin." (Hebrews 3:13).




...

Don't ask me questions anymore Jason. You refuse to honestly answer mine, and go all round the houses to avoid answering the simplest
of questions also.
When you start directly and honestly answering my questions, only then will I reciprocate

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Don't ask me questions anymore Jason. You refuse to honestly answer mine, and go all round the houses to avoid answering the si.plest if questions also

Well, I answered your question using different words. I am willing to answer your question (using the words that you prefer) if you are willing to bring up the exact post # I stated in relation to your question. But please do not act like I did not answer your question and or I was not willing to cooperate with you. That would be deceitful. I also asked you questions prior to the question you asked me, and I did not harp on you about it like you are doing so with me now. I merely keep asking the same questions again, hoping to get an answer.


...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Stuart, what is your idea of not being perfect?
Is it commiting sins every day or every week on a habitual basis?
What kind of sins are we talking about here?



...

 

[stuart lawrence]

Well, I answered your question using different words. I am willing to answer your question (using the words that you prefer) if you are willing to bring up the exact post I stated in relation to your question. But please do not act like I did not answer your question and or I was not willing to cooperate with you. That would be deceitful. I also asked you questions prior to the question you asked me, and I did not harp on you about it like you are doing so with me. I merely keep asking the same questions again, hoping to get an answer.


...

Answer this yes or no.

Was Paul including thou shalt not covet in rom7:4-6

Answer truthfully
Have you many times stated the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands

 

[stuart lawrence]

Stuart, what is your idea of not being perfect?
Is it commiting sins every day or every week on a habitual basis?
What kind of sins are we talking about here?



...

I refer you to my previous answer concerning asking questions.

As for committing sin Jason. The second greatest commandment is:
Love thy neighbour.
There is no love for your neighbour in demanding of him what you do not demand of yourself
So it seems you are quite happy to continually break the second most important commandment
doesn't it.

 

[Kenny'sID]

it once. And I'm sure everyone who read it understood the question you were asked.
Now please excuse me, I joined this website to discuss scripture, you appear not to want to do that.

Excuse you? you seem to e doing a pretty good job of that yourself.

Actually, nothing but that.

 

[stuart lawrence]

The Christian is acutely aware of all their shortcomings for the law is in their mind and placed on their heart. They cannot hide from it. They will sink unless they look to Christ. So many Christians live their lives suffering from feelings of guilt and condemnation, due to their imperfections they are all too painfully aware of.
Why are they often like this? Because people reel off the partial letter of scripture to them from their heads, demanding of them what they do not demand of themselves. They do not practice what they preach
Christ reserved his harshest words for such religiouspeople

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Answer this yes or no.

Was Paul including thou shalt not covet in rom7:4-6

Answer truthfully
Have you many times stated the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands

Again, I said I do not have a photographic memory to remember the exact post you have in question. I have written several times in regards to the 1,050 + commands as mentioned by a particular website. By no means am I affiiliated with this website that refers to these commands. Nor am I saying that the number of commands they come up is accurate, either. The point of my bringing up the list was to show that there are lots of commands in the New Testament and not just two as many assume. But as for the exact wording I used, I cannot remember. You are going to have to go hunt down the post # and then show it to me and then ask your question as to what you think I was saying.

But I did answer what I believe your question was getting at before. I essentially said before that not all of God's commands in the New Testament relate to our salvation if we disobey them. Is your question an attempt to assume that is not what I was saying? I do not recall ever believing that the keeping of all of the NT Commands relate to our salvation. I have believed for a long time that 1 John 5:16-17 teaches that there are sins that lead unto spiritual death and there are sins that do not lead unto spiritual death.

I mean, it's like you are getting all bent out of shape because I cannot remember what I had for breakfast on February 7th.


...

 

[stuart lawrence]

Again, I said I do not have a photographic memory to remember the exact post you have in question. I have written several times in regards to the 1,050 + commands as mentioned by a particular website. By no means am I affiiliated with this website that refers to these commands. Nor am I saying that the number of commands they come up is accurate, either. The point of my bringing up the list was to show that there are lots of commands in the New Testament and not just two as many assume. But as for the exact wording I used, I cannot remember. You are going to have to go hunt down the post # and then show it to me and then ask your question as to what you think I was saying.


...

You are lying Jason, and I would not say that if i did not know of a certainty it was true

 

[corinth77777]

Who here is saying it's ok to live in the flesh?

You asked me to be specific...

This is about eternal security, and all some of us, including myself, are saying is, if we live in the flesh, and continue in sin without repentance, we have no eternal security. While others say we can live in the flesh and still be saved. Are we still on the same subject. Or are we actually in agreement?
Corinth 77777
That post you reponded to was a response to someone asking what the gospel was. It was never intended for you. I did not have to respond at all.
And if I knew of your demeanor I might not have. I responded in the way that I thought. And if that was not good enough for you then it's best we ignore each other.
How does one speak of living like Christ if it doesn't even come across that way in their tone. Accept people how they are. Or choose to ignore them. Don't give your demand because you didn't get answer like you wanted.
In this setting and especially this thread we should even the more express the image of Christ.
Enjoy....Its better you be ignored so we do not have confrontation.

Again God doesn't rule us in this age, he allows us free will and lets us rule ourselves and we choose to put ourselves under his rule or not. He makes the rules and watches to see if we accept and apply them to our lives. Maybe we can agree he lays down the rules but doesn't force them upon us.

And you didn't answer either of my two questions...the ones you actually quoted. Please understand, direct answers would be what I needed to make my points.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Excuse you? you seem to e doing a pretty good job of that yourself.

Actually, nothing but that.

Why not try something novel. Have a chat with someone about scripture

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You are lying Jason, and I would not say that if i did not know of a certainty it was true

Well, people can read the entire thread for themselves and see that such is not the case. But if you feel you are right, please prove that I am lying so as to enlighten the rest of us.



...

 

[stuart lawrence]

Well, people can read the entire thread for themselves and see that such is not the case. But if you feel you are right, please prove that I am lying so as to enlighten the rest of us.



...

I'm not going to trawl through past threads. I have no need. Anyone who partook of them knows what you many times stated, as you do also of course.
Here's another question.
You have many
times stated the Christian is only released from a righteousness of observing law not applicable under the NC. Therefore they are righteous in your view by obeying the TC and certain( you say now) NT commands.

So which NT commands do you not have to obey to be righteous before God?

It's ok, I know you won't answer the question, you never do

 

[1stcenturylady]

How many times have I stated the born again believer in their heart wants to obey God for that is where his laws have been placed. Jason has many, many times read that

yes, you have.

 

[1stcenturylady]

And for the record. I don't excuse sins as : little sins.
I don't think I will be ok because I only commit little sins as Jason puts it.
The people who most excuse their sin, are those who most earnestly live under a righteousness of observing the law

I excuse the sins we commit WHILE walking in the Spirit, not willfully walking in the flesh. If we are continually walking in the Spirit why would John say the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin? So it isn't that we don't sin, but just as the OT says there are sins we commit UNINTENTIONALY. That goes to motive. We don't even realize we are sinning to even repent. That is how I understand what Jason is saying, but I refuse to speak for either of you again, and only speak for myself. It is clear you both want to remain in the flesh toward each other. Maybe it is a man thing.

 

[stuart lawrence]

I excuse the sins we commit WHILE walking in the Spirit, not willfully walking in the flesh. If we are continually walking in the Spirit why would John say the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin? So it isn't that we don't sin, but just as the OT says there are sins we commit UNINTENTIONALY. That goes to motive. We don't even realize we are sinning to even repent. That is how I understand what Jason is saying, but I refuse to speak for either of you again, and only speak for myself. It is clear you both want to remain in the flesh toward each other. Maybe it is a man thing.

It's not being in the flesh. I have an aversion to the message of people who do not practice what they preach/ demand of others, for I feel so much for those who have become crushed and walked away because of them.
And I am in good company to feel that way