The death of the Virgin in RCC imagery

[LittleLambofJesus]

Jesus is God and Man, ofcourse He is going to be ok

the assumption of Mary is a sign that Jesus saves the Church

Could you explain how that would equates to a sign that Jesus saves the Church?

Signs, signs, everywhere a sign.....

Matthew 12:39 But He answered and said unto them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas ["MARY" ]"

http://www.christianforums.com/t7405089-4/#post53043894
What the sign?

Matt 24:3....and what? the Sign............
Mark 13:4........and what? the Sign...
Luke 21:7....and what? the Sign.....

 

[98cwitr]

Mary died, was raised from the dead and was assumed into Heaven.

chapter and verse please

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by PilgrimToChrist Mary died, was raised from the dead and was assumed into Heaven.

chapter and verse please

From the Bible or the Catechism

 

[98cwitr]

The one that was divinely inspired and thus we know is true.

 

[Dark_Lite]

The one that was divinely inspired and thus we know is true.

Why do you assume everything has to be in the Bible?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Why do you assume everything has to be in the Bible?

So that one Denomination won't be puffed up against another Denomination

1 Corinthians 4:6 These-things yet brethren! I after-figure into myself and Apollos thru/because-of ye.
That in us ye may be learning the no above that which hath been Written, *to think* that no one over the one ye may be being puffed up against the other/different.

 

[98cwitr]

Why do you assume everything has to be in the Bible?

Here's why:

Rev 22

18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

People try to put words into the mouth of God and then say they are holy and divine, yet they are nothing but venom. If it's about God, you'd better be able to back it up with scripture lest ye be like the devil. Man is fallible and corrupt, put down your trust for man and trust God and only God.

 

[AveMaria_45]

chapter and verse please

i know. its the same chapter with the word trinity. lol

you believe in the trinity?

 

[Dark_Lite]

Here's why:

Rev 22

18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

People try to put words into the mouth of God and then say they are holy and divine, yet they are nothing but venom. If it's about God, you'd better be able to back it up with scripture lest ye be like the devil. Man is fallible and corrupt, put down your trust for man and trust God and only God.

A prohibition against adding or removing words from the Bible does not mean everything has to be in the Bible. So, why does everything have to be in the Bible? It is historical fact that the Bible as we know it didn't even exist for the first four centuries of Christianity.

Edit: That's assuming that command even applies to the entire Bible and not just Revelation. Either way, it doesn't matter.

 

[DiligentlySeekingGod]

People try to put words into the mouth of God and then say they are holy and divine, yet they are nothing but venom. If it's about God, you'd better be able to back it up with scripture lest ye be like the devil. Man is fallible and corrupt, put down your trust for man and trust God and only God.

Well said.

 

[98cwitr]

i know. its the same chapter with the word trinity. lol

you believe in the trinity?

Try again, darlin'. Im not falling for it.

A prohibition against adding or removing words from the Bible does not mean everything has to be in the Bible. So, why does everything have to be in the Bible? It is historical fact that the Bible as we know it didn't even exist for the first four centuries of Christianity.

Edit: That's assuming that command even applies to the entire Bible and not just Revelation. Either way, it doesn't matter.

Believing anything outside of the Bible makes a lot of room for idolatry. If you want to make your own god, just remember what happened to those in the past that did...in that little "history" book you so eloquently shot down as the Holy Bible.

If that be the case why believe anything in the Bible?

Oh yeah, here's why: Psalm 12:6-7, Mark 13:31, Proverbs 30:5-6

I'd like to see you "historical facts" as well...just because the NT canon was formed doesn't mean the content of the 400 year old writings changed. For our sake I hope not.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by AveMaria_45 i know. its the same chapter with the word trinity. lol

you believe in the trinity?

Try again, darlin'. Im not falling for it.

I still don't see a relation between the RC's version of the PV/Assumption of Mary and the Trinity

http://www.christianforums.com/t7400512/
Did Jesus have brothers and sisters born of Mary

 

[AveMaria_45]

Try again, darlin'. Im not falling for it.

Why? if you use a messed up bible you might fall for anything.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Why? if you use a messed up bible you might fall for anything.

What bible does your Congregation use

 

[Dark_Lite]

Believing anything outside of the Bible makes a lot of room for idolatry.

On what reasoning do you base that? Do you believe in computers? If so, do you idolize computers?

This seems to be an unfounded assumption to justify Sola Scriptura. You haven't really justified your stance beyond a "the Bible says it's true so the Bible must be true" kind of thing. There is just as much room for "idolatry" if you believe in the Bible alone as there is if you accept that Christianity is bigger than the Bible.

If you want to make your own god, just remember what happened to those in the past that did...in that little "history" book you so eloquently shot down as the Holy Bible.

What are you talking about? Are you referring to the development of the canon? It is historical fact, i.e. not up for debate, that the canon was not fully formed for 4 centuries. There were different canon lists, all having discrepancies and disagreements, floating around for several centuries. It took two regional Councils (that is, Tradition) to settle the canon. That is why Sola Scriptura is logically circular and paradoxical. It is a rejection of Tradition while at the same time relying on a book that is the product of Tradition.

 

[DiligentlySeekingGod]

i know. its the same chapter with the word trinity. lol

you believe in the trinity?

To say that the Trinity isn't true because the word isn't in the Bible is an invalid argument. The word Bible isn't in the Bible either, but the word is used anyway. The words omniscience, omnipresence, and omnipotence aren't found in the Bible either. However, we know, from the Scriptures, that God is indeed omniscient (which means all knowing), omnipresent (which means present everywhere), and omnipotent (which means all powerful). Here are some specific verses which validate the truth of the Trinity within the Bible:

Matthew 28:19 - "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,"

1 Corinthians 12:4-6 - "Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. And there are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons."

2 Corinthians 13:14 - "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."

Ephesians 4:4-7 - "There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all. But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift."

1 Peter 1:2 - "according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, that you may obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood: May grace and peace be yours in fullest measure."

Jude 20-21 - "But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith; praying in the Holy Spirit; keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting anxiously for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to eternal life."

As we can all see, the Trinity, although the word Trinity is not specifically used, is indeed taught in the Bible. Therefore, the argument about the word Trinity not being in the Bible is moot. The same cannot be said about the Catholic beliefs concerning Mary. Nowhere in Scripture are we told to put our eyes upon anyone other than the Lord Himself. Jesus said, "...You shall worship the Lord your God, and serve Him only," (Matthew 4:10). He alone is worthy of our praise and worship.

 

[98cwitr]

On what reasoning do you base that? Do you believe in computers? If so, do you idolize computers?

This seems to be an unfounded assumption to justify Sola Scriptura. You haven't really justified your stance beyond a "the Bible says it's true so the Bible must be true" kind of thing. There is just as much room for "idolatry" if you believe in the Bible alone as there is if you accept that Christianity is bigger than the Bible.



What are you talking about? Are you referring to the development of the canon? It is historical fact, i.e. not up for debate, that the canon was not fully formed for 4 centuries. There were different canon lists, all having discrepancies and disagreements, floating around for several centuries. It took two regional Councils (that is, Tradition) to settle the canon. That is why Sola Scriptura is logically circular and paradoxical. It is a rejection of Tradition while at the same time relying on a book that is the product of Tradition.

Did the process of canonization change the actual content of the original writings?

Do we not have the writings at our disposal today?

Your point is moot.

Hey, while your at it...grab a sharpie and mark through the word 'Holy' on your Bible...since you obviously don't consider it to be. Will you consider carnal men to be holy while rejecting the truth written?

Or am I wrong, do you consider the Bible to be true? Is it infallible and inerrant?

 

[AveMaria_45]

What bible does your Congregation use

the bible readings are printed in a booklet. thats better than flopping around through a ton a bibles and making a bunch of noise.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

the bible readings are printed in a booklet. thats better than flopping around through a ton a bibles and making a bunch of noise.

What booklet
There are plenty of those in the bookstores

Kindgdom Bible Studies Lambs Book of Life Part 1

*SNIP*
.......... Now, what is meant by this term – THE BOOK OF THE LIFE OF THE LAMB? The wise man said, "...of the making of many books there is no end..." (Eccl. 12:12).

The book stores are filled to overflowing today with all types of books dealing with every aspect of earthly life.

Even in the church world there are books setting forth every kind of viewpoint relating to God, the Bible, doctrine, Christian experience, and church order. However the subject material of most of these books largely contains a message of religious tradition and spiritual death.

 

[98cwitr]

the bible readings are printed in a booklet. thats better than flopping around through a ton a bibles and making a bunch of noise.

So what you are telling us is that you don't read a Bible at all?