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The common thread in Trump's defenders

DaisyDay

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That involved Russia gate...
Yes, but it also involved any and every other crime as well.
He was looking for a position in the white house. He was upset he was left behind.
Yeah, he was angry that Donald threw him under the bus.
A non disclosure agreement was made into a federal crime. Michael Cohen plead guilty in exchange for no prosecution....
No prosecution? He spent years in the federal pen for it. Don't you ever check your facts?
 
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Eternally Grateful

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They were considered campaign contributions because they were made to prevent damage to his status as a candidate. Think of it like an advertising expense: you buy ads to make your guy look good and you buy ads to make the other guy look bad. Your opponent does the same thing in reverse. Advertising/messaging is a big part of a campaign's expenditures and I don't think it's unreasonable to consider as campaign expenses those costs incurred during a campaign to protect a candidate's image . John Edwards was prosecuted for more-or-less the same thing in 2011 for hiding his affair during the 2008 campaign.
And you can prove this is why it was done?

It had nothing to do with him not wanting his wife or family to find out?
 
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ralliann

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You can prove he cooked the books?

I have seen no evidence. all I saw is SOMEONE (we do nto even know who) put the cost down as legal expenses by using a drop down menu/

Have you used these things before. I have. and I sometimes do not know what to use, so I pick one that closely resembles what it is.

which is what this person most likely did

hardly a crime (unless your trump)
Well yeah, what do you class, having your lawyer draw up a legal non disclosure agreement? Have it legally signed and binding ? A legal expense....LOL they turned it into a federal election crime.
Yes there was tax issues involved, to cover up the payment for a non disclosure agreement.
It defeats the purpose to show money going to a non disclosure agreement. May as well not have one in that case.
 
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Eternally Grateful

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Trump and his followers, by explicitly appropriating the Christian Gospel have made it less credible.

And this is a bigger issue for me than any political policy. They embrace and support this scoundrel in the name of the God they claim to believe in and worship. We cannot ignore the character, virtue and vices of this empty spirituality. Sure, perhaps Biden is not to much better. But people do not worship Biden. Even within the democratic party there is plenty of expressed displeasure.

Those of you who claim to be Christian and yet think he can do no wrong, please try to re-evaluate your position.
can you name someone who claims trump can do no wrong?
 
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Hans Blaster

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Yes, more than that. Any thing anyone does if running for office can fall under that category. Hillary's campaign bought and paid for the steel dossier, money funneled through fusion GPS. Sories are bought and paid for all the time to "kill" them. This is something never done before.
It isn't quite what you say.

The Clinton campaign hired a business intelligence firm to assemble the book on Trump (background, skeletons, etc.) and the firm that they hired (Fusion GPS) noticed a pattern of activity relating to Russia and hired Steele to look into the Russia part for them. At some point during that investigation by Steele (where he was contacting his old sources in Russia), Russian intelligence noticed and started to pump false information into the stream. The raw reports from Steele are what are referred to as his "dossier".

This doesn't relate to any sort of catch and kill scheme by the Clinton campaign.
 
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ralliann

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Yes, but it also involved any and every other crime as well.

Yeah, he was angry that Donald threw him under the bus.

No prosecution? He spent years in the federal pen for it. Don't you ever check your facts?
Oh, I really did not see Cohen facing any federal election charges? Please do educate me. I never seen it.
 
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DaisyDay

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Yes, more than that. Any thing anyone does if running for office can fall under that category. Hillary's campaign bought and paid for the steel dossier, money funneled through fusion GPS. Stories are bought and paid for all the time to "kill" them. This is something never done before.
Trump and his pretty not-so-smart lawyer, Alina Habba, were sanctioned a million dollars for suing Clinton and others over all that.
 
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Eternally Grateful

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I know CNN, The most anti trump news organization around, On the day the court went to trial. Asked again, What charges were there?

I am sorry, Falsifying business records is nonsense.

If this is a crime, I guarantee you can charge almost every politician with this crime.. But even then, i was not proven

Trump paid his lawyer for services his lawyer did for him

He (or more than likely his secretary or someone else who manages his finances) put in his business records legal expense.

if that is a crime, then we are in serious trouble. our legal system is broken severely
 
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iluvatar5150

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ralliann

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Trump and his pretty not-so-smart lawyer, Alina Habba, were sanctioned a million dollars for suing Clinton and others over all that.
Where are the charges for Cohen for federal election violations?
 
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Eternally Grateful

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Well yeah, what do you class, having your lawyer draw up a legal non disclosure agreement? Have it legally signed and binding ? A legal expense....LOL they turned it into a federal election crime.
Yes there was tax issues involved, to cover up the payment for a non disclosure agreement.
It defeats the purpose to show money going to a non disclosure agreement. May as well not have one in that case.
its interesting. Clinton paid alot of hush money (Millions? I can not remember) to shut someone up who was going to charge him with sexual harassment. , but he is ok. Trump paid a small amount to keep a woman who made accusations against him he denied, and he is the worse criminal ever.
 
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DaisyDay

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You can prove he cooked the books?
Yes, it was proven in a court of law. He signed checks and recorded the expense as part of payment for a retainer that did not exist. The Trump Organization filed false records at his behest.
I have seen no evidence. all I saw is SOMEONE (we do nto even know who) put the cost down as legal expenses by using a drop down menu/
To see, you would have to look. Your story is that this business whiz, this graduate of Wharton School of Finance uses antiquated software that cannot accurately track expenses?
Have you used these things before. I have. and I sometimes do not know what to use, so I pick one that closely resembles what it is.

which is what this person most likely did

hardly a crime (unless your trump)
Too bad there were handwritten notations on the invoices and a pity there was a recording discussing the structure of the repayments....
 
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Zaha Torte

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That's half of it. The payment itself was considered a campaign contribution because the perceived intent behind the payment was to protect his image for political purposes. That contribution was a crime because it violated the rules for campaign contributions.
That is bizarre to me. I always thought that a campaign contribution was someone giving you money - not you paying someone else.

So, was the Steele Dossier a contribution to Hilary's campaign?
I don't know. It was a while ago and I didn't follow it closely at the time.
I think it was thrown out because the jury was unable to come to an agreement.

Didn't the judge in the Trump case give some instruction claiming that the jury didn't need to come to an agreement in order to convict him?

I remember it being something confusing.
 
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Hans Blaster

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I know CNN, The most anti trump news organization around, On the day the court went to trial. Asked again, What charges were there?
I didn't mention CNN. I posted the actual indictment from the NY county DA office. The charges are listed with legal specificity.
I am sorry, Falsifying business records is nonsense.
It is a crime in NY.
If this is a crime, I guarantee you can charge almost every politician with this crime.. But even then, i was not proven
Do they all run businesses? If they do, do they all falsify the records of their businesses? And finally, do their states have criminal statutes like this one that require them to have done the falsification in pursuit of another crime?
Trump paid his lawyer for services his lawyer did for him
They lawyer testified that he performed none (or almost no) services for Trump after the payments began. Trump provided no invoices for those services from the lawyer.
He (or more than likely his secretary or someone else who manages his finances) put in his business records legal expense.

if that is a crime, then we are in serious trouble. our legal system is broken severely
Donnie broke the law. The law caught Donnie. A jury found him guilty at trial. That is not broken legal system, it is a properly working one.
 
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Eternally Grateful

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Yes, it was proven in a court of law. He signed checks and recorded the expense as part of payment for a retainer that did not exist. The Trump Organization filed false records at his behest.
No, He paid his lawyer back for something his lawyer paid to stormy daniels. Things like that happens all the time
To see, you would have to look. Your story is that this business whiz, this graduate of Wharton School of Finance uses antiquated software that cannot accurately track expenses?

Too bad there were handwritten notations on the invoices and a pity there was a recording discussing the structure of the repayments....
Yawn.

Again, This does not prove he committed a crime..
 
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DaisyDay

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That is bizarre to me. I always thought that a campaign contribution was someone giving you money - not you paying someone else.
No, a campaign contribution can also be something in kind - say, donation of a venue space.
So, was the Steele Dossier a contribution to Hilary's campaign?
No, her campaign paid for it with campaign money.
I think it was thrown out because the jury was unable to come to an agreement.

Didn't the judge in the Trump case give some instruction claiming that the jury didn't need to come to an agreement in order to convict him?

I remember it being something confusing.
Once again, read them yourself: Jury instructions.

For each of the 34 counts, the jury did have to agree and they did agree unanimously. They did not have to agree on which of the underlying charges applied as long as at least one of them did; all of them might have.
 
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Eternally Grateful

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I didn't mention CNN. I posted the actual indictment from the NY county DA office. The charges are listed with legal specificity.

It is a crime in NY.

Do they all run businesses? If they do, do they all falsify the records of their businesses? And finally, do their states have criminal statutes like this one that require them to have done the falsification in pursuit of another crime?

They lawyer testified that he performed none (or almost no) services for Trump after the payments began. Trump provided no invoices for those services from the lawyer.

Donnie broke the law. The law caught Donnie. A jury found him guilty at trial. That is not broken legal system, it is a properly working one.
lol. Ok

If Biden, Or clinton, or any other left leaning person did this, I do not think anyone in this room thinks he would have even been tried, let alone convicted.

We are in a communist state.
 
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Hans Blaster

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That is bizarre to me. I always thought that a campaign contribution was someone giving you money - not you paying someone else.
In kind payments are also contributions. Michael Cohen paying Stormy Daniels for the purpose of supporting the campaign is a campaign contribution and an illegal one because it is far to large. Donald Trump *can* pay her off for campaign reasons, but must report it on the FEC filings like any candidate must report large cash contributions (or loans) to their own campaign. Trump didn't want this one on the FEC books, so he had someone else do it. Pecker and his publications were unwilling to do anymore (fearing the same campaign contribution laws), so it fell to the even more morally void Mr. Cohen to break the law for Trump.

So, was the Steele Dossier a contribution to Hilary's campaign?
The Steel Dossier was *paid for* (indirectly) by her campaign. It was an expense. It was a part of contract to the business intel firm Fusion GPS to research Trump. (It was Fusion GPS that chose to hire Steele. The Campaign had no idea until they started getting reports.) Clinton's campaign paid for the Fusion GPS work through their law firm and did falsely report it on the FEC filing as "legal expenses", for which they later admitted guilt and paid a fine.
 
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