The Christian Conservative Right Is A Sham.

[Sunshine Locket]

Well, we got the power turned back on. I found out about a law in my state that makes it illegal for them to turn the power off if you have a baby under 1 year old, so I brought the birth certificate to them and they agreed to turn it back on. Praise God!

That's a blessing. Were it not for your power being briefly off you would not have been able to deliver that information about the law in your state. I'd hope that protection for families with babies under 1 year of age and the elderly would exist in all states.

I can not post links as yet but there is a website, all one word, "need help paying bills" -dot-com.
There is an article page titled: Consumer protection laws and regulations on heating and utility disconnections.

Your experience with the $2 dollar preacher was a blessing too I think. He showed his own self-worth when he offered the father of a baby that paltry amount. When the offering plate that goes around in the building he occupies for his job is thought to contain his bounty. And not that which is given in the spirit of Christ and for those in need of the offering there.

Your experience at this site speaks for itself.
This is a message board not the church of our Lord. The church of our Lord is the community of individuals who's hearts are alive with the holy spirit. And who's eyes are turned toward God.

Catholic social services often helps people in need. They have a low income home energy assistance program available in every state. No, you do not have to be a Catholic in order to reach out.

My prayers are with you. I have saved your website to my favorites file.

I know God is with you and your family. Peace be upon you all.


{P.S Have you looked at zazzle -dot- com? They are a free on-line product creation website. You can open an account, it is all free and unlike cafe press that charges a monthly fee plus takes a huge portion of your profits, and create everything from bumper stickers to canvas art.

You get a percentage from every single item you sell. You can set your percentage and Zazzle computes the retail price after that. You start with a minimum price and at 10% commission. You can go up from there if you choose. Zazzle will adjust the retail price in conjunction with your commission percentage of choice.

Once you acquire $50.00 in earnings you can have them deposit it in your paypal account for free. Deposits of earnings under $50.00 cost something like $2.00.
They have all sorts of aids to help you advertise your store, which is what you create when you join to become a seller.

I suggest this because I think it would be a great addition to your website. And yet another means of spreading your mission. Zazzle is huge!

God bless you. ^j^

 

[Tammy]

I don't believe it is the churches place to give handouts. Yes, there are emergency situations when handouts are necessary, but for the most part, real HELP is given when you teach someone HOW to make their own living. Teaching people financial classes, how to cut corners, how to cook so that don't go out to eat saves a TON of money....I am a firm believer in the principle taught in the Bible, "If you don't work, you don't eat."

 

[Skybringr]

I don't believe it is the churches place to give handouts. Yes, there are emergency situations when handouts are necessary, but for the most part, real HELP is given when you teach someone HOW to make their own living. Teaching people financial classes, how to cut corners, how to cook so that don't go out to eat saves a TON of money....I am a firm believer in the principle taught in the Bible, "If you don't work, you don't eat."

~Give a man a fish and feed him for a day, or teach them to fish, and he'll eat for life~

Such is the way of the Word.

But

It doesn't justify leaving anyone out to hang and dry. The reason conservatives don't give handouts is political- one does not simply give government money and expect that it's going to keep it's distance. The government gives people all their needs, but it can and will destroy society with it's tyranny.

And that's really good observation. What is the purpose of churches giving out anything if the government is already doing it via their laity's wallet? At the same time however, republicanism is forgetting fundamental principles.

I don't agree with republicans on a good deal of things, but I am at heart very conservative at it's core meaning- very against a lot of liberal notions. It would be a revolution if modern conservatives recognized this, and stopped dealing in the greed of many republicans today.

 

[Sunshine Locket]

I don't believe it is the churches place to give handouts. Yes, there are emergency situations when handouts are necessary, but for the most part, real HELP is given when you teach someone HOW to make their own living. Teaching people financial classes, how to cut corners, how to cook so that don't go out to eat saves a TON of money....I am a firm believer in the principle taught in the Bible, "If you don't work, you don't eat."

Thank God Jesus didn't concur.

 

[Albion]

~Give a man a fish and feed him for a day, or teach them to fish, and he'll eat for life~

Such is the way of the Word.

But

It doesn't justify leaving anyone out to hang and dry. The reason conservatives don't give handouts is political- one does not simply give government money and expect that it's going to keep it's distance. The government gives people all their needs, but it can and will destroy society with it's tyranny.

And that's really good observation. What is the purpose of churches giving out anything if the government is already doing it via their laity's wallet? At the same time however, republicanism is forgetting fundamental principles.

I don't agree with republicans on a good deal of things, but I am at heart very conservative at it's core meaning- very against a lot of liberal notions. It would be a revolution if modern conservatives recognized this, and stopped dealing in the greed of many republicans today.

That sounds more like a Democrat talking point than anything that can be shown to be true.

But more important perhaps, I don't follow the logic in this argument. You plainly state that buying votes with welfare leads to "tyranny," so it logically follows that those who try to slow or stop this process that threatens everyone's freedom are doing so in the national interest, so why slap a word like 'greed' upon them for it?

 

[Skybringr]

That sounds more like a Democrat talking point than anything that can be shown to be true.

But more important perhaps, I don't follow the logic in this argument. You plainly state that buying votes with welfare leads to "tyranny," so it logically follows that those who try to slow or stop this process that threatens everyone's freedom are doing so in the national interest, so why slap a word like 'greed' upon them for it?

A true conservative sees the real problem with government aid- most republicans just don't like because they are greedy. They are pompous with their wallets, and and tug at bread- two very bad things of people who otherwise bring up Christianity in just about everything else they do.

The issue with government is not just high government, it all trickles down to state, city and county as well.
I don't know if you've ever taken notice, but we're becoming a police state.

When a law abiding citizen can't even drive down the street without feeling paranoid when a cop goes by, or when one doesn't want to answer when police are knocking door to door- this is an evolving police state.

Or when people are being found guilty of assault and going to jail because they shrugged somebody's shoulder, or when a cop can basically make up a reason to arrest you- that all is telling altogether as well.

So what do you do? You lean off government, and stop giving them resources. America isn't even America anymore, it's absurd. One can't be a modern liberal and a true patriot of this country, society just labors under the notion that they are compatible- a century ago, they would have been seen as definitive dissidents of the country.


But I guess I'm getting a little off topic. The point is, church is supposed to be the moral crux of society, not political men and government, who ultimately will take all your money, babysit and control society.
If Christians are already having their wallets dug into by gov't to support the needy, then their churches are basically void from offering too much more help anyway.

 

[Albion]

A true conservative sees the real problem with government aid- most republicans just don't like because they are greedy.

I'm sorry, but that seems just silly, it's so simplistic and fanciful. What evidence is there that "most republicans just don't like (what?) because they are greedy?"

They are pompous with their wallets, and and tug at bread- two very bad things of people who otherwise bring up Christianity in just about everything else they do.

You realize that you're just giving voice to your biases, I hope. But I'm still left wondering why you would even entertain such a ridiculous thesis.

The issue with government is not just high government, it all trickles down to state, city and county as well.
I don't know if you've ever taken notice, but we're becoming a police state.

And if I notice that and vote against it, you'll be calling me 'greedy' for doing so???? That needs a lot more explanation, IMO.

When a law abiding citizen can't even drive down the street without feeling paranoid when a cop goes by, or when one doesn't want to answer when police are knocking door to door- this is an evolving police state.

Or when people are being found guilty of assault and going to jail because they shrugged somebody's shoulder, or when a cop can basically make up a reason to arrest you- that all is telling altogether as well.

So what do you do? You lean off government, and stop giving them resources.

And if you do that, some guy on the internet is going to brand you as just plain greedy.

But I guess I'm getting a little off topic. The point is, church is supposed to be the moral crux of society, not political men and government, who ultimately will take all your money, babysit and control society.
If Christians are already having their wallets dug into by gov't to support the needy, then their churches are basically void from offering too much more help anyway.

'
Yes, but where I checked in was with the startling claim that republicans are just greedy. What you seem to be saying is "This is the problem. If you do anything to stop it, you're greedy." Something's amiss in that proposition.

 

[Skybringr]

I'm sorry, but that seems just silly, it's so simplistic and fanciful. What evidence is there that "most republicans just don't like (what?) because they are greedy?"


You realize that you're just giving voice to your biases, I hope. But I'm still left wondering why you would even entertain such a ridiculous thesis.


And if I notice that and vote against it, you'll be calling me 'greedy' for doing so???? That needs a lot more explanation, IMO.


And if you do that, some guy on the internet is going to brand you as just plain greedy.

'
Yes, but where I checked in was with the startling claim that republicans are just greedy. What you seem to be saying is "This is the problem. If you do anything to stop it, you're greedy." Something's amiss in that proposition.

You just don't get it. It's pointless arguing with you.

And as far the 'broad paintbrush' thing you seem to be forming, I don't really care much for such. It is used to dodge any observation of a societal aspect, thereby making any observation exhaustive and needlessly complicated.

The fact is that yes, a great great deal of republicans are stingy and hypocritical, who only know the true nature of conservative values insofar as what benefits them. If you want evidence all you have to do is observe, it's not some secret tucked away in a shell at the center of some distant nebula beyond the reaches of man.

 

[Almighty's humble servant]

I was just thinking about this. Conservatives don't believe in "handouts" so they want to do away with things like welfare and emergency funds etc. and have people rely on the church to help them. Problem is, the church is made up of conservatives who don't believe in "handouts". It's hypocritical. The people saying "the church should help, not government." are the same people who say "I won't help."

I wouldnt pit them all together.

When I first joined my SBC, ALL CONSERVATIVES who regularly urge the body to vote against gambling initiative, abortion bills, and marriage bills, and vote for politicians who would see our agenda pursued.......these same ppl saw I was at a low point, earnings-wise, and 3 brothers came to my home a week or so before Christmas and gave me 5 crisp 100 bills.

I told them I couldnt accept it as I had all I needed, but they said it was to help us have a more blessed Christmas. I reminded them the gift of God was the greatest Christmas gift I could share with my children, but they refused to take it back.
I ended up giving 300 to a small Church in which the Pastor almost wholly supports his church with his own earnings as a small time contractor. I gave 100 to my parents who survive on 1K/mo SSI so they could have a better Christmas, and I put the final 100 back into the collection plate, where God can use the money to further His goals in our community.

As recently as a month ago, I got laid off. First time in 25 yrs of working Ive had to rely on unemployment insurance and how slowly it moves. IN a month, Ive gotten 1 check, TODAY, for 390. Wow, I thought it would be for at least 3 wks since it took a month to get the first check.

Anyways, when I got laid off, I aksed the Pastor to include my family in the prayer requests that I might have patience to endure this tightening of the belt. First thing he did was ask if he could give me a few hundred dollars to help with my bills.

I figured the Food Stamp office would jump right in and give us a food stamp card thru this drought i'm in.....whooooaaaaa......it's been 34 days since I applied, and still, their processing the paperwork.

 

[Albion]

You just don't get it. It's pointless arguing with you.

Hmmm. I asked you the same simple question three times in the same post...and I'm supposed to be the one who "doesn't get it?"

The fact is that yes, a great great deal of republicans are stingy and hypocritical

Any evidence of that?

Studies have shown that conservatives give more to charity than liberals, which fact, when mentioned here in an earlier thread, went undisputed. Al Gore, Biden, and other rich Dem luminaries give nothing or next to nothing...and that's a matter of record.

 

[woodpecker]

I am not a political person, nor do I succumb to the terms, conservative or liberal.

Many polls and research has shown conservative people give much more to charity than dems or liberals.

As far as the church business, they are more concerned with their building and comfort than helping the sick, the poor, widows and orphans.

We should worship together in homes or if we are following a denomination or preacher, the building and amenities should be minimal, so the members giving monies will know most of their giving would go to such people in need....not for carpet, coffee and donuts, soft pews, a great surround sound for the big screen TVs and rock worship band and lighting.

Finally I have found a church that gives to the needy, and could give a $&@? If my tushy was comfortable on Sunday morn.

 

[Albion]

I am not a political person, nor do I succumb to the terms, conservative or liberal.

Many polls and research has shown conservative people give much more to charity than dems or liberals.

As far as the church business, they are more concerned with their building and comfort than helping the sick, the poor, widows and orphans.

We should worship together in homes or if we are following a denomination or preacher, the building and amenities should be minimal, so the members giving monies will know most of their giving would go to such people in need....not for carpet, coffee and donuts, soft pews, a great surround sound for the big screen TVs and rock worship band and lighting.

Finally I have found a church that gives to the needy, and could give a $&@? If my tushy was comfortable on Sunday morn.

You put the matter in good perspective. When it comes to churches, there isn't much of a difference between the liberal and conservative ones--at least so far as the tendency to spend on the building, etc. rather than on the poor is concerned.

But, of course, the thread itself took a turn earlier when someone introduced a different presumption, a totally false one, which was that socially and politically conservative people are less inclined to give to charity than anyone else.

 

[parousia70]

When a law abiding citizen can't even drive down the street without feeling paranoid when a cop goes by,

Are you some kind of socialist?

You abide by "socialist" laws of the state?

You drive down a "socialist" PUBLIC street? and stop at those "socialist" stoplights?

You benefit from such socialist institutions as Courts of Law, Public Roads, Communication rights of way, municipalities, Fire Dept, Police Dept.. etc....

You don't process your own waste do you? You flush your toilet and expect government to whisk it away and take care of it, right?

When you turn on your faucet do you expect clean potable water to come out by magic?

I have a high tolerance for a lot of things, but rank Hypocrisy isn't one of them.

 

[parousia70]

Joe gets up at 6 a.m. and fills his coffeepot with water to prepare his morning coffee. The water is clean and good because some tree-hugging liberal fought for minimum water-quality standards. With his first swallow of water, he takes his daily medication. His medications are safe to take because some stupid commie liberal fought to ensure their safety and that they work as advertised.

All but $10 of his medications are paid for by his employer's medical plan because some whining liberal union workers fought their employers for paid medical insurance -- now Joe gets it, too.

He prepares his morning breakfast: bacon and eggs. Joe's bacon is safe to eat because some girly-man liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat packing industry.

In the morning shower, Joe reaches for his shampoo. His bottle is properly labeled with each ingredient and its amount in the total contents because some crybaby liberal fought for his right to know what he was putting on his body and how much it contained.

Joe dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air he breathes is clean because some environmentalist wacko liberal fought for the laws to stop industries from polluting our air.

He walks on the government-provided sidewalk to the subway station for his government-subsidized ride to work. It saves him considerable money in parking and transportation fees because some fancy-pants liberal fought for affordable public transportation, which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.

Joe begins his work day. He has a good job with excellent pay, medical benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some lazy liberal union members fought and died for these working standards. Joe's employer pays these standards because Joe's employer doesn't want his employees to call the union.

If Joe is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed, he'll get a worker compensation or unemployment checks because some stupid liberal didn't think he should lose his home because of his temporary misfortune.

It is noontime and Joe needs to make a bank deposit so he can pay some bills. Joe's deposit is federally insured by the FSLIC because some godless liberal wanted to protect Joe's money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined the banking system before the Great Depression.

Joe has to pay his Fannie Mae-underwritten mortgage and his below-market federal student loan because some elitist liberal decided that Joe and the government would be better off if he was educated and earned more money over his lifetime. Joe also forgets that in addition to his federally subsidized student loans, he attended a state funded university.

Joe is home from work. He plans to visit his father this evening at his farm home in the country. He gets in his car for the drive. His car is among the safest in the world because some America-hating liberal fought for car safety standards to go along with the taxpayer funded roads.

He arrives at his boyhood home. His was the third generation to live in the house financed by Farmers' Home Administration because bankers didn't want to make rural loans.

The house didn't have electricity until some big-government liberal stuck his nose where it didn't belong and demanded rural electrification.

He is happy to see his father, who is now retired. His father lives on Social Security and a union pension because some wine-drinking, cheese-eating liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Joe wouldn't have to.

Joe gets back in his car for the ride home, and turns on a radio talk show. The radio host keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives are good. He doesn't mention that the beloved conservatives have fought against every protection and benefit Joe enjoys throughout his day. Joe agrees: "We don't need those big-government liberals ruining our lives! After all, I'm a self-made man who believes everyone should take care of themselves, just like I have."

 

[parousia70]

Joe wakes up in the morning and goes to the bathroom. He flushes his toilet and brushes his teeth, mindful that each flush & brush costs him about 43 cents to his privatized water provider. His wacky, liberal neighbor keeps badgering the company to disclose how clean and safe their water is, but no one ever finds out. Just to be safe, Joe Conservative boils his drinking water.

Joe steps outside and coughs–the pollution is especially bad today, but the smokiest cars are the cheapest ones, so everyone buys ‘em. Joe Conservative checks to make sure he has enough toll money for the 3 different private roads he must drive to work. There is no public transportation, so traffic is backed up and his 10 mile commute takes an hour.

On the way, he drops his 12 year old daughter off at the clothing factory she works at. Paying for kids to go to private school until they’re 18 is a luxury, and Joe needs the extra income coming in. Times are hard and there’re no social safety nets.

He gets to work 5 minutes late and misses the call for Christian prayer, and is immediately docked by his employer. He is not feeling well today, but has no health insurance, since neither his employer nor his government provide it, and paying for it himself is really expensive, since he has a precondition. He just hopes for the best.

Joe’s workday is 12 hours long, because there is no regulation over working hours, and Joe will lose his job if he complains or unionizes. Today is an especially bad day. Joe’s manager demands that he work until midnight, a 16 hour day. Joe does, knowing that he’ll lose his job if he does not.

Finally, after midnight, Joe gets to pick up his daughter and go home. His daughter shows him the deep cut she got on the industrial sewing machine today. Joe is outraged and asks why she doesn’t have metal mesh gloves or other protection. She says the company will not provide it and she’ll have to pay for it out of her own pocket. Joe looks at the wound and decides they’ll use an over the counter disinfectant and bandages until it heals. She’ll have a scar, but getting stitches at the emergency room is expensive.

His daughter also complains that the manager made suggestive overtures towards her. Joe counsels her to be a “good girl” and not rock the boat, or she’ll get fired and they’ll be out the income.

His daughter says she can’t wait until she’s 18 so she can vote for change or go to the Iraq War.
They get home and there’s a message from his elderly father who can’t afford to pay his medical or heating bills. Joe can hear him coughing and shivering.

Joe turns on the radio and the top story is a proposal in Congress to raise the voting age to 25. A rare liberal opinionator states that it’s an attempt to keep power out of the hands of working class Americans. The conservative host immediately quashes him, calling him “a utopian idealist,” and agreeing that people aren’t mature enough to make good choices until they’re at least 25.

Joe chuckles at the wine-swilling, cheese eating liberal egghead and thinks, “Thank God I live in America where I have freedom!”

 

[Skybringr]

Are you some kind of socialist?

You abide by "socialist" laws of the state?

You drive down a "socialist" PUBLIC street? and stop at those "socialist" stoplights?

You benefit from such socialist institutions as Courts of Law, Public Roads, Communication rights of way, municipalities, Fire Dept, Police Dept.. etc....

You don't process your own waste do you? You flush your toilet and expect government to whisk it away and take care of it, right?

When you turn on your faucet do you expect clean potable water to come out by magic?

I have a high tolerance for a lot of things, but rank Hypocrisy isn't one of them.

Yeah, when the government puts it's boot to your teeth, you can demonstrate your low tolerance for hypocrisy all you want.

Those like yourself are the cause of why we are becoming a police state. When a law abiding citizen is treated like a criminal, which happens everyday and which I'm sure you deny to the burger to maintain your delusions about this country's progression, there is a problem.
Nobody benefits from gestapo cops- except government. So I suppose if you support government, then you are perfectly fine with gestapo cops.

And as far as fire departments and public streets, I never asked for them. They steal my money and besides paved streets, do everything I don't want them to do- and I owe them gratitude? Lol, spoken like a true sheep.

 

[Albion]

I wonder what Joe Libertarian's day would look like at the Concentration Camp?

Joe wakes up in the morning and goes to the bathroom. He flushes his toilet and brushes his teeth, mindful that each flush & brush costs him about 43 cents to his privatized water provider. His wacky, liberal neighbor keeps badgering the company to disclose how clean and safe their water is, but no one ever finds out. Just to be safe, Joe Conservative boils his drinking water.

Joe steps outside and coughs–the pollution is especially bad today, but the smokiest cars are the cheapest ones, so everyone buys ‘em. Joe Conservative checks to make sure he has enough toll money for the 3 different private roads he must drive to work. There is no public transportation, so traffic is backed up and his 10 mile commute takes an hour.

On the way, he drops his 12 year old daughter off at the clothing factory she works at. Paying for kids to go to private school until they’re 18 is a luxury, and Joe needs the extra income coming in. Times are hard and there’re no social safety nets.

He gets to work 5 minutes late and misses the call for Christian prayer, and is immediately docked by his employer. He is not feeling well today, but has no health insurance, since neither his employer nor his government provide it, and paying for it himself is really expensive, since he has a precondition. He just hopes for the best.

Joe’s workday is 12 hours long, because there is no regulation over working hours, and Joe will lose his job if he complains or unionizes. Today is an especially bad day. Joe’s manager demands that he work until midnight, a 16 hour day. Joe does, knowing that he’ll lose his job if he does not.

Finally, after midnight, Joe gets to pick up his daughter and go home. His daughter shows him the deep cut she got on the industrial sewing machine today. Joe is outraged and asks why she doesn’t have metal mesh gloves or other protection. She says the company will not provide it and she’ll have to pay for it out of her own pocket. Joe looks at the wound and decides they’ll use an over the counter disinfectant and bandages until it heals. She’ll have a scar, but getting stitches at the emergency room is expensive.

His daughter also complains that the manager made suggestive overtures towards her. Joe counsels her to be a “good girl” and not rock the boat, or she’ll get fired and they’ll be out the income.

His daughter says she can’t wait until she’s 18 so she can vote for change or go to the Iraq War.
They get home and there’s a message from his elderly father who can’t afford to pay his medical or heating bills. Joe can hear him coughing and shivering.

Joe turns on the radio and the top story is a proposal in Congress to raise the voting age to 25. A rare liberal opinionator states that it’s an attempt to keep power out of the hands of working class Americans. The conservative host immediately quashes him, calling him “a utopian idealist,” and agreeing that people aren’t mature enough to make good choices until they’re at least 25.

Joe chuckles at the wine-swilling, cheese eating liberal egghead and thinks, “Thank God I live in America where I have freedom!”

 

[OGM]

I really like this thread

 

[Archivist]

Yeah, when the government puts it's boot to your teeth, you can demonstrate your low tolerance for hypocrisy all you want.

Those like yourself are the cause of why we are becoming a police state. When a law abiding citizen is treated like a criminal, which happens everyday and which I'm sure you deny to the burger to maintain your delusions about this country's progression, there is a problem.
Nobody benefits from gestapo cops- except government. So I suppose if you support government, then you are perfectly fine with gestapo cops.

And as far as fire departments and public streets, I never asked for them. They steal my money and besides paved streets, do everything I don't want them to do- and I owe them gratitude? Lol, spoken like a true sheep.

Perhaps you would like to provide examples of these "gestapo cops." Since you claim that law abiding citizens are being treated like criminals everyday it certainly shouldn't be hard to provide examples.

My experience is that there are police officers who do abuse their powers. They are a tiny minority of police officers.

BTW, if you study history you know that there have always been certain public officials and police officers who have abuised their offices. It isn't anything new.

 

[Skybringr]

Perhaps you would like to provide examples of these "gestapo cops." Since you claim that law abiding citizens are being treated like criminals everyday it certainly shouldn't be hard to provide examples.

My experience is that there are police officers who do abuse their powers. They are a tiny minority of police officers.

BTW, if you study history you know that there have always been certain public officials and police officers who have abuised their offices. It isn't anything new.

How many times have you been pulled over or harassed by them? You take that number and put it to everybody.
It makes me wonder sometimes, the kind of world a person must live in to not be able to acknowledge that police treat people like criminals everyday.

And a small minority are abusive? No, the police in this country, collectively, have become much more aggressive and infringe on people's constitutional rights.

They don't even like people filming them because they know what they do is not in line with what they are allowed to do.
But those like yourself, I'm sure, go and give them that extra mile because you suppose there's no way giving people that much freedom isn't going to result in a nationwide pandemic. But the truth is that it already has begun, and while people sit there and twiddle their thumbs and deny it, it just continues to grow.

POLICE BRUTALITY - Recording The Police is Dangerous, but Necessary! - YouTube

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