The Bishop's plea

[notyourenemy]

Here is the text of Bishop Mariann Budde's recent homily, which has been called radical, political and "nasty in tone".

Can someone point out to me, among the calls for mercy on those in fear and a universal recognition of human dignity, which parts are radical, political or nasty?

A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

I pray for people to be saved. Not for worldly politics. Or to stick my nose people's private business.

 

[notyourenemy]

I pray for people to be saved. Not for worldly politics. Or to stick my nose people's private business.

The Bishop was praying for people to be saved from fear and want. That goes beyond politics.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

The first foundation for unity is honoring the inherent dignity of every human being, which is, as all faiths represented here affirm, the birthright of all people as children of the One God.

Overall, I thought the message was good until she started calling out Trump give illegal immigrants a pass and to continue to normalize gender ideology. Illegal means illegal...period. If people are here illegally, they committed a crime and are therefore, criminals and should take responsibility for their crimes. Second, people who call themselves "transgender" are mentally ill and need psychological treatment, not hormone therapy. After all "So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." Genesis 1:28 NIV.

Third, I have theological objections to the quote provided above. The Bible is clear that all people are God’s creation (Colossians 1:16), and that God loves the entire world (John 3:16), but only those who are born again are children of God (John 1:12; 11:52; Romans 8:16; 1 John 3:1-10).

In Scripture, the lost are never referred to as God’s children. Ephesians 2:3 tells us that before we were saved we were “by nature objects of wrath” (Ephesians 2:1-3). Romans 9:8 says that “it is not the natural children who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.” Instead of being born as God’s children, we are born in sin, which separates us from God and aligns us with Satan as God’s enemy (James 4:4; 1 John 3:8). Jesus said, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and now am here. I have not come on my own; but he sent me” (John 8:42). Then a few verses later in John 8:44, Jesus told the Pharisees that they “belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire.” The fact that those who are not saved are not children of God is also seen in 1 John 3:10: “This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.”

We become God’s children when we are saved because we are adopted into God’s family through our relationship with Jesus Christ (Galatians 4:5-6; Ephesians 1:5). This can be clearly seen in verses like Romans 8:14-17: “…because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, ‘Abba, Father.’ The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.” Those who are saved are children “of God through faith in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:26) because God has “predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will” (Ephesians 1:5).

 

[notyourenemy]

Overall, I thought the message was good until she started calling out Trump give illegal immigrants a pass and to continue to normalize gender ideology. Illegal means illegal...period. If people are here illegally, they committed a crime and are therefore, criminals and should take responsibility for their crimes. Second, people who call themselves "transgender" are mentally ill and need psychological treatment, not hormone therapy. After all "So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." Genesis 1:28 NIV.

Third, I have theological objections to the quote provided above. The Bible is clear that all people are God’s creation (Colossians 1:16), and that God loves the entire world (John 3:16), but only those who are born again are children of God (John 1:12; 11:52; Romans 8:16; 1 John 3:1-10).

In Scripture, the lost are never referred to as God’s children. Ephesians 2:3 tells us that before we were saved we were “by nature objects of wrath” (Ephesians 2:1-3). Romans 9:8 says that “it is not the natural children who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.” Instead of being born as God’s children, we are born in sin, which separates us from God and aligns us with Satan as God’s enemy (James 4:4; 1 John 3:8). Jesus said, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and now am here. I have not come on my own; but he sent me” (John 8:42). Then a few verses later in John 8:44, Jesus told the Pharisees that they “belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire.” The fact that those who are not saved are not children of God is also seen in 1 John 3:10: “This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.”

We become God’s children when we are saved because we are adopted into God’s family through our relationship with Jesus Christ (Galatians 4:5-6; Ephesians 1:5). This can be clearly seen in verses like Romans 8:14-17: “…because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, ‘Abba, Father.’ The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.” Those who are saved are children “of God through faith in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:26) because God has “predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will” (Ephesians 1:5).

She wasn't calling him out to give illegal immigrants "a pass"; she was calling on him to show them *mercy*, which I believe Jesus identified as one of the weightier measures of the law. And even lawbreakers are supposed to be given due process; that's in the Constitution and it applies even to those who aren't citizens.

And while I don't agree with transgenderism myself, here again the Bishop was pointing out that there are such people who are AFRAID. Common human decency shouldn't be reserved only for those of whom you approve. Didn't Jesus also say something about there being no reward in loving only those who love you?

Yes, there are immigration laws.....but here again comes Jesus, and what did he say about bowing before the letter of the law while violating the *spirit* of the law? Does your neighbor have to have documentation for you to love him as yourself?

And who qualifies as a child of God would be best left for God to determine, I would think.

The Bishop's bottom line is that all are made in the image of God, and to mistreat the image of God is to mistreat God.

 

[BCP1928]

Crossing the border illegally is certainly a crime, But I always have been curious about the emphasis which is put in it, even when discussing asylum seekers who have regularized their status. Legally, it is a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct. I don't understand why it is seen as so heinous.

s

 

[JSRG]

She wasn't calling him out to give illegal immigrants "a pass"; she was calling on him to show them *mercy*, which I believe Jesus identified as one of the weightier measures of the law. And even lawbreakers are supposed to be given due process; that's in the Constitution and it applies even to those who aren't citizens.

Oompa Loompa said:

"Overall, I thought the message was good until she started calling out Trump give illegal immigrants a pass and to continue to normalize gender ideology. Illegal means illegal...period. If people are here illegally, they committed a crime and are therefore, criminals and should take responsibility for their crimes."

I am not sure how this contradicts with the idea of lawbreakers being given due process? If someone breaks the law, the due process is that they have to be proven to have broken it. In the case of illegal immigrants, the due process is the government proving you're not here legally. I don't see anything in Oompa Loompa's post arguing that the government should be able to deport people without first demonstrating that they are in fact illegal immigrants.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

And who qualifies as a child of God would be best left for God to determine, I would think.

Which God has clearly determined and explained in His Holy scripture. Which explicitly says are not people who are not saved. So I assuredly can tell you with absolute certainty that those who have not accepted Chist have not been adopted as sons or daughters of God, and therefore not children of God.

This is a very basic theological principle that is expected from anyone in a leadership position in the Church. But ironically, when you have a female priest who supports gay marriage, transgender ideology, and abortion, it isn't surprising that other aspects of her theology is so flawed that some would see her as a heretic.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

Oompa Loompa said:

"Overall, I thought the message was good until she started calling out Trump give illegal immigrants a pass and to continue to normalize gender ideology. Illegal means illegal...period. If people are here illegally, they committed a crime and are therefore, criminals and should take responsibility for their crimes."

I am not sure how this contradicts with the idea of lawbreakers being given due process? If someone breaks the law, the due process is that they have to be proven to have broken it. In the case of illegal immigrants, the due process is the government proving you're not here legally. I don't see anything in Oompa Loompa's post arguing that the government should be able to deport people without first demonstrating that they are in fact illegal immigrants.

Well, that is obvious. They are obviously not deporting U.S. citizens. So I fail to see your point.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

Legally, it is a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct.

Used to be a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct. But then Trump was elected and signed a bunch of executive orders.

 

[BCP1928]

Used to be a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct. But then Trump was elected and signed a bunch of executive orders.

To what?

 

[Oompa Loompa]

To what?

A felony worthy of deportation.

 

[Pommer]

Used to be a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct. But then Trump was elected and signed a bunch of executive orders.

He’s still only President.
He can’t change a misdemeanor to a felony with an executive order.

 

[Valletta]

Here is the text of Bishop Mariann Budde's recent homily, which has been called radical, political and "nasty in tone".

Can someone point out to me, among the calls for mercy on those in fear and a universal recognition of human dignity, which parts are radical, political or nasty?

A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily

Ah, the "bishop" who supported not using a gender specific pronoun for God. The speech was quite hypocritical, especially in asking Trump to "have mercy" on people. Trump is trying to save the lives of victims and potential victims of the horrible criminals who entered our country due to Democrat Party policies, find out what happened to the hundreds of thousands of children that the Biden administration lost track of, free all of the trafficked children, teens, and adults, and halt the drugs pouring into our country that kill a hundred thousand Americans each year. Would that the bishop would have spoken out against the violation of border laws by the Biden administration that caused this human disaster.

 

[Nithavela]

Oompa Loompa said:

"Overall, I thought the message was good until she started calling out Trump give illegal immigrants a pass and to continue to normalize gender ideology. Illegal means illegal...period. If people are here illegally, they committed a crime and are therefore, criminals and should take responsibility for their crimes."

I am not sure how this contradicts with the idea of lawbreakers being given due process? If someone breaks the law, the due process is that they have to be proven to have broken it. In the case of illegal immigrants, the due process is the government proving you're not here legally. I don't see anything in Oompa Loompa's post arguing that the government should be able to deport people without first demonstrating that they are in fact illegal immigrants.

Please use the proper quote function when you quote people.

 

[The IbanezerScrooge]

They are obviously not deporting U.S. citizens.

There's another thread in this forum about El Salvador taking in deported U.S. citizens.
Rep Brandon Gill called for Rep. Ilhan Omar, a U.S. Citizen and elected Congressperson to be deported.
Actual Native Americans, who were here before all of us, are being detained by ICE and threatened with deportation.

And can we just all appreciate the fantastical, insanely absurd irony of a President and his staff talking about deporting "criminals" when he himself is a 34 times convicted felon who hasn't served a single appreciable moment of a sentence for his crimes?

Just soak that in. Deep breaths.

 

[rambot]

I think as opposed to a certain action I think she was simply more hoping for a heart that shows mercy. A heart that is merciful doesn't will show mercy; a beautiful feature of our faith.

Unfortunately that lesson will fall on deaf ears with Trump. He is, at his heart, unmerciful.

Which I think is a powerful feature for some of his supporters who feel done with showing mercy and kindness.

 

[BCP1928]

A felony worthy of deportation.

It was already worthy of deportation.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Here is the text of Bishop Mariann Budde's recent homily, which has been called radical, political and "nasty in tone".

Can someone point out to me, among the calls for mercy on those in fear and a universal recognition of human dignity, which parts are radical, political or nasty?

A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily A Service of Prayer for the Nation Homily

Those are our President's words of discomfort. Someone who lacks empathy will lash out when called out. Our Father delivered His message through her directly to him. It was miraclelous to say the least. How often does someone get to direct a message like this to the President of the United States and for the entire world to hear as well? Many are missing the Bigger" picture here, it is the Gospel.
Blessings

 

[DaisyDay]

it isn't surprising that other aspects of her theology is so flawed that some would see her as a heretic.

Is there an extant bishop anywhere that is not considered a heretic by some group of Christians somewhere?

Used to be a misdemeanor more or less equivalent to disorderly conduct. But then Trump was elected and signed a bunch of executive orders.

Yeah, about that - Congress makes the laws and the Executive is tasked with carrying them out. The president is supposed to keep the laws Congress makes, not flout them.