The 2 types of Righteousness

[alaric]

Philippians 3:9

not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

There are 2 types of righteousness, man’s self-righteousness and the righteousness from God.

If a true Christian do not have consciousness or know but do not believe he/she is made righteous by the righteousness from Jesus, they should experience the following;

• Always feel that they are falling short of God’s standard
• Believe that God is punishing them when bad things happen
• Not close to God
• Lacking in faith
• Unstable Christian walk
• Always falling back into sin
• Always in the cycle of sinning and repentance
• Easy targets for Satan’s accusations and condemnation
• Feel stressful living as a Christian
• Always falling sick
• Always feeling depressed
• Feeling happy and expecting God to bless them when they do something right

If a true Christian knows and believe that he/she is made righteous by receiving Jesus’ righteousness as a free-gift, they should experience the following;

• No longer conscious of their failings but conscious of God’s constant provision
• Believe that God always lift them up whenever they fall
• God is always out to bless them
• God is always close to them even when they fail
• Strong faith in God for all things including weakness and failings
• Sin less frequently
• Satan’s accusations and condemnation no longer have any effect on them
• Always feeling blessed and joyful to be a Christian
• Stronger health leading to less frequent sickness
• Does not depend on good works to be right with God

Ultimately, both type of Christian are saved as long as they put their trust in Jesus and his finished work. But the quality of life and relationship with God differs. The fruits produced by both are different, one is of dead works and the other is of the spirit.

So which type of Christian are you?

 

[Mark Quayle]

Philippians 3:9

not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

There are 2 types of righteousness, man’s self-righteousness and the righteousness from God.

If a true Christian do not have consciousness or know but do not believe he/she is made righteous by the righteousness from Jesus, they should experience the following;

• Always feel that they are falling short of God’s standard
• Believe that God is punishing them when bad things happen
• Not close to God
• Lacking in faith
• Unstable Christian walk
• Always falling back into sin
• Always in the cycle of sinning and repentance
• Easy targets for Satan’s accusations and condemnation
• Feel stressful living as a Christian
• Always falling sick
• Always feeling depressed
• Feeling happy and expecting God to bless them when they do something right

You would do well to show scriptural support for the elements of this list, and the below.

If a true Christian knows and believe that he/she is made righteous by receiving Jesus’ righteousness as a free-gift, they should experience the following;

• No longer conscious of their failings but conscious of God’s constant provision

See that earlier post where you said the same. What do you mean by "no longer conscious of their failings"? Be specific concerning what you mean there. The point is good, but mistakenly stated.

• Believe that God always lift them up whenever they fall
• God is always out to bless them
• God is always close to them even when they fail
• Strong faith in God for all things including weakness and failings
• Sin less frequently
• Satan’s accusations and condemnation no longer have any effect on them
• Always feeling blessed and joyful to be a Christian
• Stronger health leading to less frequent sickness
• Does not depend on good works to be right with God

Ultimately, both type of Christian are saved as long as they put their trust in Jesus and his finished work. But the quality of life and relationship with God differs. The fruits produced by both are different, one is of dead works and the other is of the spirit.

So which type of Christian are you?

 

[Stephen3141]

Philippians 3:9

not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

There are 2 types of righteousness, man’s self-righteousness and the righteousness from God.

If a true Christian do not have consciousness or know but do not believe he/she is made righteous by the righteousness from Jesus, they should experience the following;

• Always feel that they are falling short of God’s standard
• Believe that God is punishing them when bad things happen
• Not close to God
• Lacking in faith
• Unstable Christian walk
• Always falling back into sin
• Always in the cycle of sinning and repentance
• Easy targets for Satan’s accusations and condemnation
• Feel stressful living as a Christian
• Always falling sick
• Always feeling depressed
• Feeling happy and expecting God to bless them when they do something right

If a true Christian knows and believe that he/she is made righteous by receiving Jesus’ righteousness as a free-gift, they should experience the following;

• No longer conscious of their failings but conscious of God’s constant provision
• Believe that God always lift them up whenever they fall
• God is always out to bless them
• God is always close to them even when they fail
• Strong faith in God for all things including weakness and failings
• Sin less frequently
• Satan’s accusations and condemnation no longer have any effect on them
• Always feeling blessed and joyful to be a Christian
• Stronger health leading to less frequent sickness
• Does not depend on good works to be right with God

Ultimately, both type of Christian are saved as long as they put their trust in Jesus and his finished work. But the quality of life and relationship with God differs. The fruits produced by both are different, one is of dead works and the other is of the spirit.

So which type of Christian are you?

I think that your categories of "righteousness" are not quite what Paul is
talking about.

Righteousness, according to the law (I assert) is the righteousness of
keeping God's moral-ethical law. There is nothing wrong with this. It is
not some sort of secondary lesser righteousness.

BUT, when we break God's ME law, THEN there is no recourse to righteousness
according to the law. We need to be FORGIVEN. And keeping God's law, can never
"earn" forgiveness for when we have broken God's law.

We need BOTH to be forgiven for our trespasses, AND to live out the fruit of
righteousness.

 

[ralliann]

I think that your categories of "righteousness" are not quite what Paul is
talking about.

Righteousness, according to the law (I assert) is the righteousness of
keeping God's moral-ethical law. There is nothing wrong with this. It is
not some sort of secondary lesser righteousness.

BUT, when we break God's ME law, THEN there is no recourse to righteousness
according to the law. We need to be FORGIVEN. And keeping God's law, can never
"earn" forgiveness for when we have broken God's law.

We need BOTH to be forgiven for our trespasses, AND to live out the fruit of
righteousness.

There is sin against God vs sin against men. The same is true of righteousness.

 

[Mark Quayle]

There is sin against God vs sin against men. The same is true of righteousness.

Sin against man IS sin against God. ALL sin is sin against God, and that, PRIMARILY against God. (King David said, after being convicted of his sin with Bathsheba, "against you only have I sinned", though, rather obviously, he had sinned against many people, and very badly so, betraying and murdering Bathsheba's husband, coercing his loyal followers into doing the murder, betraying the trust of his people, seducing Bathsheba (or maybe even, in modern lingo, compelling Bathsheba by his position of extreme authority), and putting an awful mark against the history of God's people.

(Further, sin against God works out to being also sin against man, but that's a long discussion unnecessary here.)

Righteousness is quite another thing. We have none of our own.

 

[ralliann]

Sin against man IS sin against God. ALL sin is sin against God, and that, PRIMARILY against God.

Sin against your fellow man is like unto it .
First and second....Two commands.

Mth 22: 36 Master which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

(King David said, after being convicted of his sin with Bathsheba, "against you only have I sinned", though, rather obviously, he had sinned against many people, and very badly so, betraying and murdering Bathsheba's husband, coercing his loyal followers into doing the murder, betraying the trust of his people, seducing Bathsheba (or maybe even, in modern lingo, compelling Bathsheba by his position of extreme authority), and putting an awful mark against the history of God's people.

(Further, sin against God works out to being also sin against man, but that's a long discussion unnecessary here.)

Righteousness is quite another thing. We have none of our own.

There is natural law, which is righteousness before and in the eyes of men. They have no "cause" against you. this is not speaking about in the eyes of God.....

Joh 15:25 But this cometh to pass, that the word might be fulfilled that is written in their law, They hated me without a cause.

Also Israel in sinning against their fellow man blasphemes God because of their call as a people of God.
Ex. 32:10 Now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation.
11 And Moses besought the LORD his God, and said, LORD, why doth thy wrath wax hot against thy people, which thou hast brought forth out of the land of Egypt with great power, and with a mighty hand? {the LORD: Heb. the face of the LORD }
12 Wherefore should the Egyptians speak, and say, For mischief did he bring them out, to slay them in the mountains, and to consume them from the face of the earth? Turn from thy fierce wrath, and repent of this evil against thy people.

 

[ViaCrucis]

As a Lutheran, I saw the phrase "two types of righteousness" and expected this thread to be about something very different.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Soyeong]

Philippians 3:9

not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

There are 2 types of righteousness, man’s self-righteousness and the righteousness from God.

If a true Christian do not have consciousness or know but do not believe he/she is made righteous by the righteousness from Jesus, they should experience the following;

• Always feel that they are falling short of God’s standard
• Believe that God is punishing them when bad things happen
• Not close to God
• Lacking in faith
• Unstable Christian walk
• Always falling back into sin
• Always in the cycle of sinning and repentance
• Easy targets for Satan’s accusations and condemnation
• Feel stressful living as a Christian
• Always falling sick
• Always feeling depressed
• Feeling happy and expecting God to bless them when they do something right

If a true Christian knows and believe that he/she is made righteous by receiving Jesus’ righteousness as a free-gift, they should experience the following;

• No longer conscious of their failings but conscious of God’s constant provision
• Believe that God always lift them up whenever they fall
• God is always out to bless them
• God is always close to them even when they fail
• Strong faith in God for all things including weakness and failings
• Sin less frequently
• Satan’s accusations and condemnation no longer have any effect on them
• Always feeling blessed and joyful to be a Christian
• Stronger health leading to less frequent sickness
• Does not depend on good works to be right with God

Ultimately, both type of Christian are saved as long as they put their trust in Jesus and his finished work. But the quality of life and relationship with God differs. The fruits produced by both are different, one is of dead works and the other is of the spirit.

So which type of Christian are you?

To say that God is righteous is not just to say that He is a doer of righteous works, but that every work testifies about His righteousness. If God's law were His instructions for how to become self-righteous and God does not want us to become self-righteous, then it would follow that God therefore wants to be disobeyed, which is absurd, rather God's law was given to teach us how to be doers of His righteousness. For example, by being doers of charity we are being doers of God's righteousness, not establishing a different type of righteousness. Likewise, God did not give His law as instructions for how to establish our own goodness apart from Him, but rather our good works bring glory to Him because they are testifying about His goodness (Matthew 5:16).

While the only way for someone to attain a character trait is through faith, but it means for them to attain a character trait is for them to become a doer of that trait. For example, the only way for someone to become courageous is through faith apart from being required to have first done enough courageous works in order to earn it as the result, but it would be contradictory for someone to become courageous apart from becoming a doer of courageous works, and the same is true for righteousness and every other character trait. This is why the same faith by which we are declared righteous apart from works does not abolish our need to be a doer of righteous works in obedience to God's law, but rather our faith upholds it (Romans 3:28-31). In other words, everyone who has faith will be declared righteous and everyone who has faith is a doer of God's law, which is how Paul can deny in Romans 4:1-5 that we can earn our righteousness as the result of our works while also affirming in Romans 2:13 that only the doers of the law will be declared righteous. The way to believe in God is by being in His likeness by being a doer of His character traits, which is the only way to attain the character traits of God.

 

[fhansen]

Philippians 3:9

not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

There are 2 types of righteousness, man’s self-righteousness and the righteousness from God.

If a true Christian do not have consciousness or know but do not believe he/she is made righteous by the righteousness from Jesus, they should experience the following

A true Christian, knowing that his righteousness comes from God alone, will act upon that knowledge, understanding that he now can and must reciprocate, responding to and with that grace:

“Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live. For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.” Rom 8:12-14

“For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!” Rom 5:17

Only God, apart from the law, can accomplish in us the righteousness that the law and the prophets can only testify to, but cannot accomplish (Rom 3:21-22). As believers, we have all the grace necessary now to live as children of God should; we just need to act on it:

“Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.” Heb 12:14

“To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.” Rom 2:7

“For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.” Matt 6:14-15

 

[ralliann]

To say that God is righteous is not just to say that He is a doer of righteous works, but that every work testifies about His righteousness. If God's law were His instructions for how to become self-righteous and God does not want us to become self-righteous,

He gave it for their righteousness. So why would assume he did not want it? It was righteousness in the eyes of the nations round about them. I think this can be understood in the Jurisprudence of God, especially when prevailing over an enemy by the power of God. He does right in judgement.

Judah could have had Tamar burned in judgment...
But she was more righteous than he was...

Gen 38:24 And it came to pass about three months after, that it was told Judah, saying, Tamar thy daughter in law hath played the harlot; and also, behold, she is with child by whoredom. And Judah said, Bring her forth, and let her be burnt.
25 When she was brought forth, she sent to her father in law, saying, By the man, whose these are, am I with child: and she said, Discern, I pray thee, whose are these, the signet, and bracelets, and staff.
26 And Judah acknowledged them, and said, She hath been more righteous than I; because that I gave her not to Shelah my son. And he knew her again no more.

Ge 18:25 That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?

Prevailing in judgement in a cause between men vs men.

Rom 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

then it would follow that God therefore wants to be disobeyed, which is absurd, rather God's law was given to teach us how to be doers of His righteousness. For example, by being doers of charity we are being doers of God's righteousness, not establishing a different type of righteousness. Likewise, God did not give His law as instructions for how to establish our own goodness apart from Him, but rather our good works bring glory to Him because they are testifying about His goodness (Matthew 5:16).

The kind of righteousness we have by the law of faith is a righteousness in the eyes of God...Not just that which is in the eyes of Men. Inward vs outward. Men do not see the heart, God does.

 

[com7fy8]

There is self-righteousness which can have me being conceited looking down on others in comparison with myself. This can be so deceptive that I do not even know I am being fake.

So, I need to constantly depend on God to make sure I am the way He desires and make sure He is the One guiding me always. Because at any moment I can fool my own self and not even know it if God is not guiding me personally.

 

[com7fy8]

And there is the imputed righteousness. This means being right with God because we have trusted in Jesus. But it does not mean we are right the way Jesus is righteous. We need major correction so we are like Jesus is right.

Imputed righteousness is kind of like how a water boy becomes a champion just by joining the champion football team. The water boy took on the reputation of the champion team, just by joining. Like this, when we trusted in Jesus, we took on His background of all He accomplished by His death and burial and resurrection. Just by joining Jesus, we now share His righteous record and we now are with God's own Son so pleasing to our Father.

But there is more, not only righteous standing; with God, we gain righteous character which prepares us to spend eternity with Jesus > > >

 

[com7fy8]

Hebrews 12:4-14 >

By means of God's correction and curing of our character, we have and we grow in "the peaceable fruit of righteousness". And this new character of Jesus in us makes us able to personally submit to our Father and to please Him like Jesus in us makes us pleasing to God Himself, plus we can relate as family in God's love and be all-loving with His creativity being shared with us for loving any evil and impossible person.

So, then, there is character righteousness which has to do with how only God's love is right. And the almighty power of God's love cures us to so share with Him >

"Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world." (1 John 4:17)

This has us ready for "the day of judgment", according to what I see in this scripture. And it makes sense to me, how we need Jesus in us to cure our character so we are like Him and love like Him; and so we are so personally sharing with Jesus so we are ready to do this with Him for eternity.

And so God does not want to be distant. But "God is love" (1 John 4:8&16) who is about intimacy with His children and sharing and caring as His family. And this takes how He alone is able to change our character. And this shows how much we need to submit to and depend on God.

 

[ralliann]

There is self-righteousness which can have me being conceited looking down on others in comparison with myself. This can be so deceptive that I do not even know I am being fake.

So, I need to constantly depend on God to make sure I am the way He desires and make sure He is the One guiding me always. Because at any moment I can fool my own self and not even know it if God is not guiding me personally.

The bible speaks of a righteousness as a nation. Being "legally" blameless. Like this...

Mt 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
Lu 1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

Giving no occasion for anyone to have a cause against you...

What you describe as saelf righteous would be more along the line of being Haughty, proud.

Ro 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

[Mark Quayle]

There is natural law, which is righteousness before and in the eyes of men. They have no "cause" against you. this is not speaking about in the eyes of God.....

If it is wrong, it is wrong against God. This life is about God.

 

[Avaree]

"Ultimately, both types of Christian are saved as long as they put their trust in Jesus and his finished work. But the quality of life and relationship with God differs. The fruits produced by both are different, one is of dead works and the other is of the spirit."

It all comes down to how we interpret Scripture. In Matthew, when CHRIST JESUS refers to believers being the "salt of the earth," He is specifically speaking about helping others and being a good neighbor. These actions can be classified as "works," but they are certainly not "dead works." They are essential to what being a Christian means. Throughout the Scriptures, there is a consistent message to be fair, to act justly, and to show kindness to everyone.

Faith is something that is expressed through actions and true faith will naturally produce good works.

 

[ralliann]

If it is wrong, it is wrong against God. This life is about God.

The scripture supports a distinction. Why a problem?
Mt 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: {by: or, to }
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

 

[Mark Quayle]

The scripture supports a distinction. Why a problem?
Mt 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: {by: or, to }
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

I'm not saying there's no distinction between man's law, natural law and God's law. I'm saying that if something is morally wrong, it is wrong against God, whether it transgresses natural law or not, man's law or not.

 

[ralliann]

I'm not saying there's no distinction between man's law, natural law and God's law. I'm saying that if something is morally wrong, it is wrong against God, whether it transgresses natural law or not, man's law or not.

So what? I don't understand your point! I simply put forth the righteousness men have before men, (scripturally) is judicial. It is not the righteousness before God for eternal life.

 

[Mark Quayle]

So what? I don't understand your point! I simply put forth the righteousness men have before men, (scripturally) is judicial. It is not the righteousness before God for eternal life.

Ok.. sorry, I've lost the thread at this point.