Test thread for YEC'ism.

[Nathan Poe]

That's a neat quote. I assume it is referring to the Christian religion?

What else could it be but the Christian religion?

In my Religion, we view all as being entwined with eachother.

Suzuki's too -- he was a famous author and Zen Buddhist priest.

 

[AV1611VET]

That's a neat quote. I assume it is referring to the Christian religion?

I didn't even know that quote existed, but it basically says what I've been saying all along --- God and nature are hostile to one another.

 

[GrayCat]

I didn't even know that quote existed, but it basically says what I've been saying all along --- God and nature are hostile to one another.

(Even Lucaspa agreed with me on that.)

I am sorry for not understanding, but it is far beyond my own comprehension how Divinity and Nature can even be seperate, let alone hostile.

I don't understand.. How does that view work?

 

[Nathan Poe]

I didn't even know that quote existed, but it basically says what I've been saying all along --- God and nature are hostile to one another.

Don't forget the best part -- how side-splitting hilarious it all is that God managed to lose His grip on not only his crowning achievement -- made in His own image, no less -- but his entire creation in the process.

How any celestial being can screw up so badly and expect -- nay, demand -- worship for it is a laugh a minute.

Now, AV, if you really want to "pretend" to be a YEC, this is the part where you mouth off some sort of half-veiled threat of eternal damnation -- something along the lines of "You won't be laughing when you stand before Him to be judged" will suffice.

 

[tcampen]

I didn't even know that quote existed, but it basically says what I've been saying all along --- God and nature are hostile to one another.

(Even Lucaspa agreed with me on that.)

No, Lucaspa's point has always been that where one's concept of god is scientifically shown to be incorrect, then it is that concept of God that is wrong. Nature's God is not incompatable with itself.

There is zero evidence of a young universe. None. Nada. Zilch. If you cling to such a concept only because of an archaic approach to the bible, then objective truth is irrelevant to you. You believe what you want to believe - what makes you feel good; hearing only those ideas that support what you want reality to be.

I'm usually not so harsh, but YECism is just nonsense.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yeah i was wondering why you weren't discussing embedded age theory like you usually do.

How come you started this Thread then if you're not YEC?

Just to see if I could defend that position --- and I'm doing it with my Embedded Age rhetoric --- and to be honest, I don't feel qualified.

My pastor, who has two doctorates, is YEC, but I'm not; and like I've said before, I'm glad no YEC has ever challenged my Embedded Age paradigm, or I'd have my work cut out for me.

Atheists and scientists are very easy to debate against --- but YEC's are, in my opinion, even a cut above me [us]; and I have a lot of respect for them.

 

[Nathan Poe]

I am sorry for not understanding, but it is far beyond my own comprehension how Divinity and Nature can even be seperate, let alone hostile.

Welcome to Fundamentalism 101

I don't understand.. How does that view work?

Not particularly well -- which is why it's important to be indoctrinated at a young age.

Consider that a God who is allegedly the source of perfect justice (Take off every Zig!) has perpetrated the greatest mockery of justice imaginable by holding all of creation responsible for the act of two of His own children who had no way of knowing that what they were doing was wrong in the first place.

 

[AV1611VET]

I am sorry for not understanding, but it is far beyond my own comprehension how Divinity and Nature can even be seperate, let alone hostile.

I don't understand.. How does that view work?

The best example I can think of is death --- which God says is His enemy.

[bible]1 Corinthians 15:26[/bible]

 

[Nathan Poe]

Just to see if I could defend that position --- and I'm doing it with my Embedded Age rhetoric --- and to be honest, I don't feel qualified.

Qualified to be a YEC? You may be overqualified.

My pastor, who has two doctorates, is YEC, but I'm not; and like I've said before, I'm glad no YEC has ever challenged my Embedded Age paradigm, or I'd have my work cut out for me.

I'm going to close the curtain of charity here and not ask what those two alleged doctorates are in.

Atheists and scientists are very easy to debate against --- but YEC's are, in my opinion, even a cut above me [us]; and I have a lot of respect for them.

Your position has always been ridiculously simple, and you've handwaved away any attempt to discuss it on any kind of rational level, until your opponents walk away in frustration and disgust with you, and you declare victory.

Perhaps you're not ready to debate true YECs -- you're only an apprentice; they're masters of the craft.

Although, AV, I would think that if you're so sure about your embedded-age theory, you'd be willing to put it to the test. If the YECs can punch holes in it, perhaps it's not as brilliant as you'd like to think --

[Bible]1 Peter 1:6-7[/Bible]

-- or are you afriad to put your idea to the test?

 

[Nathan Poe]

The best example I can think of is death --- which God says is His enemy.

[bible]1 Corinthians 15:26[/bible]

Actually, AV, PAUL, not God, said that. God doesn't need to write epistles, does He?

 

[GrayCat]

Atheists and scientists are very easy to debate against --- but YEC's are, in my opinion, even a cut above me [us]; and I have a lot of respect for them.

Oh, so you don't respect atheists and scientists? How nice. LOL

Do you respect Pagans?

 

[AV1611VET]

No...

You're right --- he didn't --- I'll go back and edit that.

 

[GrayCat]

Welcome to Fundamentalism 101



Not particularly well -- which is why it's important to be indoctrinated at a young age.

Consider that a God who is allegedly the source of perfect justice (Take off every Zig!) has perpetrated the greatest mockery of justice imaginable by holding all of creation responsible for the act of two of His own children who had no way of knowing that what they were doing was wrong in the first place.

So in Fundamentalism, the worldview is that everything is seperate, divided, and against each other?

I feel as though i have stepped into an utterly alien world...

 

[GrayCat]

The best example I can think of is death --- which God says is His enemy.

[bible]1 Corinthians 15:26[/bible]

Doesn't really help.. this is still very foreign to me.


How is Death not natural? How would it ever possibly be 'defeated'? How is it not just another pattern in the fabric of existence?

 

[BrainHertz]

Just to see if I could defend that position --- and I'm doing it with my Embedded Age rhetoric --- and to be honest, I don't feel qualified.

My pastor, who has two doctorates, is YEC, but I'm not; and like I've said before, I'm glad no YEC has ever challenged my Embedded Age paradigm, or I'd have my work cut out for me.

Atheists and scientists are very easy to debate against --- but YEC's are, in my opinion, even a cut above me [us]; and I have a lot of respect for them.

So, if I'm following correctly, you're saying that what you believe is based on a process of selecting a conclusion, and then training yourself to construct a kind of meta-logic which allows you to successfully defend that position rhetorically. If you can't, it means that your powers of meta-logic are not yet sufficiently advanced, not that your pre-selected conclusion might be in error.

Did I get that about right?

 

[AV1611VET]

I'm going to close the curtain of charity here and not ask what those two alleged doctorates are in.

Doctor of Theology

• Andersonville Theological Seminary --- Carmilla, Georgia

Doctor of Divinity

• Caroline Baptist College --- Reidsville, North Carolina

Although, AV, I would think that if you're so sure about your embedded-age theory, you'd be willing to put it to the test. If the YECs can punch holes in it, perhaps it's not as brilliant as you'd like to think --

[bible]1 Peter 1:6-7[/bible]

-- or are you afriad to put your idea to the test?

There's one aspect of it that I suppose you could call a weakness that YECs could exploit. The fact that I have to take science's word for the date of the earth or universe.

Once they challenge me on the validity of radiometric dating - I'm DOA.

 

[Nathan Poe]

So in Fundamentalism, the worldview is that everything is seperate, divided, and against each other?

I feel as though i have stepped into an utterly alien world...

When I deconverted from Christianity (not that I was ever a fundie) I felt like I had just stepped out of one.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Doctor of Theology

• Andersonville Theological Seminary --- Carmilla, Georgia

Doctor of Divinity

• Caroline Baptist College --- Reidsville, North Carolina

Ah -- more or less what I expected.

There's one aspect of it that I suppose you could call a weakness that YECs could exploit. The fact that I have to take science's word for the date of the earth or universe.

And YECs wouldn't accept a non-YEC's word on anything whatsoever.

Once they challenge me on the validity of radiometric dating - I'm DOA.

So, why not bone up on your knowledge of radiometric dating and be ready to defend it?

Seems a shame to keep your precious idea hidden just because it might run afoul of people smarter than yourself.

 

[AV1611VET]

Actually, AV, PAUL, not God, said that. God doesn't need to write epistles, does He?

[bible]1 Thessalonians 2:13[/bible]

See also ---

[bible]1 Corinthians 7:10[/bible]

 

[AintNoMonkey]

Just to see if I could defend that position

I've never seen you defend ANY position with logic or viable, available data.

and I'm doing it with my Embedded Age rhetoric --- and to be honest, I don't feel qualified.

You're not. You're just spouting a theory that is unbacked by either theology or science. Seeing as those are your two options, you fail.

My pastor, who has two doctorates,

Always stated, never elaborated.
Edit: Now they've been stated. Knock me over with a feather; they're both degrees in GOD--- a free pass! Show me a scientist, a REAL scientist with peer-reviewed work who's a YEC and we'll talk.

is YEC, but I'm not; and like I've said before, I'm glad no YEC has ever challenged my Embedded Age paradigm, or I'd have my work cut out for me.

Yes, defending unevidenced claims against unevidenced claims is quite difficult from what I hear. I wouldn't know; I generally try to stick to the real and rational.

Atheists and scientists are very easy to debate against

Translation: Atheists and scientists are very easy to dismiss because their theories go right over my head, and their written evidence always evokes a TL;DR reaction in my brain, sending me into fits of random scripture quoting.

but YEC's are, in my opinion, even a cut above me [us]; and I have a lot of respect for them.

I'm glad there's one thing we can agree on: Respect for those who can bury their heads, nay, their entire bodies up the the ankles in the sand in such an efficient manner. It's mind boggling.