Ten commandments valid or not. (2)

[holo]

So we must sin to produce grace? Isn't that exaxctly what Paul warns against?

Sin was around before the law came, but when the law came, sin became exceedingly sinful - the commandment, however good, is the power of sin. Therefore, being under law is always a curse. The only way the law can NOT be a curse, is if you keep it.

Grace is so incredibly much more than forgiveness. But we're blind to that, because we go to the LAW, of all things, for power and to figure out how to live. And the law breaks us every time.

Get rid of the bondage of the law while you can. Realize that you are free, that the very Spirit of the Lord himself dwells IN YOU. You don't need a set of rules like an OT burglar or whoremonger, you need to sit down and get to know the Spirit who lives in you. You're on the road of life and the best driving instructor in the world is living inside you. But you're trying to drive while reading books on traffic law. No wonder you fail. No wonder you constantly struggle with sin. No wonder you're tired. Get your eyes on the road, look forward, look at HIM who IS your righteousness and your holiness and your sanctification and your beginning and your end.

He has already finished it. You're supposed to be a human being, not a human doing.

 

[gratefulgrace]

Just had to post these scriptures again they are so great and we all need to meditate on this truth.
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility,
Eph 2:15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace,

Phl 3:8 What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ
Phl 3:9and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ–the righteousness that comes from God and is by faith.

 

[kw5kw]

So we must sin to produce grace? Isn't that exaxctly what Paul warns against?

The thing is we all sin, for not one is righteous. The quotation found in Rom iii:10-12, is from Psa xiv:1-3; and from Psa liii:1-3 with Psa liii:1-6 being the same as Psa xiv:1-7, with a few slight variations.

Sin was around before the law came, but when the law came, sin became exceedingly sinful - the commandment, however good, is the power of sin. Therefore, being under law is always a curse. The only way the law can NOT be a curse, is if you keep it.

I guess if you want to call it that, but Romans vii:7 teaches us that we had no idea that sin existed until the law came to tell us that (doing something sinful, you fill in the blank) was indeed against the Law of God and therefore a sin.

You say sin was around before the law. I say that before the law came there was no sin, only the law made it sin.

You're on the road of life and the best driving instructor in the world is living inside you. But you're trying to drive while reading books on traffic law. No wonder you fail.

Lets take your example of driving and follow it a bit further.
For example: Before the automobile was invented there were no speed limits. There were no need for them, so there was no law.
Then the automobile was invented, and after a period of time we found out that man liked to drive them fast and reckless.
This presented a problem, so we made a law stating a maxium speed that one can drive an automobile in/on a certain area or road.
Before the speed limit law there was no transgression of the law because it didn't exist, but after the law went into effect then you could break the law, and if you got caught then you got a ticket.

Before God said: "do not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil" there was absolutely no law. There was absolutely no sin at that time.

The eating of the forbiden fruit, which woman then man broke, that introduced the concept of sin, but even then that the only sin that existed until God gave the next law. What was that?

"In that case,
whoever kills Cain
will suffer vengeance
seven times over."
(Gen iv:15)​

So, if anyone would have killed Cain they would have broken a law of God. The Bible does not record any such transgression, so we must assume that no one ever killed Cain; i.e.: he died of natural causes.

The next commandment of God was to Noah, for him to build the arc. After that came the edict that we all have different languages at Babel. Then came the covenent with Abraham and the circumcision. Before that it was not against the Law of God for a Hebrew to be un-circumcised, therefore not a sin.

Grace is so incredibly much more than forgiveness. But we're blind to that, because we go to the LAW, of all things, for power and to figure out how to live. And the law breaks us every time.
Get rid of the bondage of the law while you can. Realize that you are free, that the very Spirit of the Lord himself dwells IN YOU. You don't need a set of rules like an OT burglar or whoremonger, you need to sit down and get to know the Spirit who lives in you.

Yes, but the law gives us guidelines. You don't think that God would be very happy with us if we went around (while claiming to be one of His) lying, cheating, stealing, raping and murdering, do you? I don't think that is what God had in mind for His children. So, we are given the Holy Spirit to live in us, to guide us and to give us direction in our lives. He's with us, but at times Satan sits on our shoulders and whispers to us... he infulences us just like he influenced Eve, and we, being weak human beings, we falter and we commit adultry, we lie, we covet -- we do ungodly things.

Thanks to the LORD above, He has forgiven us of those sins. Why? Because we've become His children and He loves us. Those humans who don't accept Christ as their saviour, however aren't saved because their sins aren't forgiven and they're judged and thrown into the lake of fire. (Rev. xx)
We simply can't ignore the wonderful guidelines that Jehovah has given to us in the form of the Law.
Now, Will we be judged against the law? The Bible says no, that we will be judged differently because the law is not held over our heads.(Romans v) But should we ignore the law? No, Romans vi:1, 2 teach that we should not ignore the law and live anyway that we wish. The book of James teaches that we should live in faith with good works because by good works is our faith perfected.

No wonder you constantly struggle with sin. No wonder you're tired. Get your eyes on the road, look forward, look at HIM who IS your righteousness and your holiness and your sanctification and your beginning and your end..

Oh, I agree, and I no longer have struggles with sin for the LORD hath provided for me.

He has already finished it. You're supposed to be a human being, not a human doing.

 

[holo]

I guess if you want to call it that, but Romans vii:7 teaches us that we had no idea that sin existed until the law came to tell us that (doing something sinful, you fill in the blank) was indeed against the Law of God and therefore a sin.

You say sin was around before the law. I say that before the law came there was no sin, only the law made it sin.

Yes, there was sin before the law. Cain murdered Abel, and it was sin, and he knew it was wrong even if God hadn't specifically said so.

Lets take your example of driving and follow it a bit further.For example: Before the automobile was invented there were no speed limits. There were no need for them, so there was no law.
Then the automobile was invented, and after a period of time we found out that man liked to drive them fast and reckless. This presented a problem, so we made a law stating a maxium speed that one can drive an automobile in/on a certain area or road.
Before the speed limit law there was no transgression of the law because it didn't exist, but after the law went into effect then you could break the law, and if you got caught then you got a ticket.

Ah, but the point is that even traffic law are for the "godless and wicked". It was just as wrong to commit adultery before the law as after (and also, the law was given to Israel specifically). But sinsce the commandment is the power of sin, those under the law struggled all the more with sin. Just like today.

Before God said: "do not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil" there was absolutely no law. There was absolutely no sin at that time.

The eating of the forbiden fruit, which woman then man broke, that introduced the concept of sin, but even then that the only sin that existed until God gave the next law.

(...)

Yes, but the law gives us guidelines. You don't think that God would be very happy with us if we went around (while claiming to be one of His) lying, cheating, stealing, raping and murdering, do you? I don't think that is what God had in mind for His children. So, we are given the Holy Spirit to live in us, to guide us and to give us direction in our lives. He's with us, but at times Satan sits on our shoulders and whispers to us... he infulences us just like he influenced Eve, and we, being weak human beings, we falter and we commit adultry, we lie, we covet -- we do ungodly things.

True, there was no sin before they ate the forbidden fruit of knowledge of good and evil. And we've had tha knowledge ever sine, still eating from that tree which seems to divide everything into black and white for us. But now, we are dead to the law, the world and ourselves, ans supposed to eat of Jesus and distinguish between good and bad by trining up our senses with use. And we have the Spirit of our creator inside, so there's no need for the law at all. You see, the only way the devil can accuse us is via the law - for jews it sould be first and foremost via the mosaic law, for the gentiles it would be via the law "written in their hearts."

As long as people keep eating from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, the devil still has opportunity to tempt us, and, in turn, accuse us. So the commandment has to go, in all forms and sizes

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

What are others views here of the Commandments mentioned in Reve 14 and 22?
Are they the 10 Commandments or some other Commandments? Thanks

Reve 14:12 Here the endurance of the Saints is, here the ones keeping the Commandments of the God and the Faith of Jesus.

Reve 22:14 Happy the ones doing the Commandments of Him that it shall be the authority of them upon the wood of the life and the gates they may be entering into the City.

 

[Ame4]

What are others views here of the Commandments mentioned in Reve 14 and 22?
Are they the 10 Commandments or some other Commandments? Thanks

Reve 14:12 Here the endurance of the Saints is, here the ones keeping the Commandments of the God and the Faith of Jesus.

Reve 22:14 Happy the ones doing the Commandments of Him that it shall be the authority of them upon the wood of the life and the gates they may be entering into the City.

I take it as the 10 commandments.

While others argue we only have this now

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.



And forget that was given in the Old Testament too and that was while we had the 10 Commandments.

 

[ThomasDa]

God tells us how to do those two in the Ten Commandments. That is what they are all about.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

God tells us how to do those two in the Ten Commandments. That is what they are all about.

TRUE DAT! Us "gentiles" are are still pondering over that to this day

Luke 18:20 The commandments thou have known, no thou should be committing adultery, no thou should be murdering, no thou should be stealing, no thou should be bearing false witness. Be honouring thy father and thy mother.
[Reve 9:21]

Revelation 9:21 And not they reform/repent out of their murders, nor out from their sorceries.......
Luke 18:20/James 9:21]

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Time for another "resurrection"

 

[plmarquette]

Jesus said.....
I come, not to abolish the law of moses

but to fulfill it....Joel 2.28 / Acts 2.1

 

[VictorC]

Time for another "resurrection"

Hasn't anyone ever told you that a seed will only grow if you leave it in the ground and allow it to die?