Tate Publishing

[Christianbelle]

As anyone ever dealt with Tate Publishing?????

 

[Christianfantasy]

I researched Tate a few months ago. I don't have the documentation in front of me, so I'll have to fill you in by memory. They're very expensive, but apart from that appear to be on the up and up. I read the comments of several authors who have published with them who were quite satisfied. What decided me against them was a couple of things. First, there was a comment [I think I read it on Absolutewrite] to the effect: 'have you ever seen a book published by Tate in Barnes and Nobles, Borders, or anywhere else???' (No.) Second, the company could not confirm that in any case at any time had they made good on their promise to refund the entire publishing fee if a book sold a certain number of copies--which tells me they've never published a single book that has smade even a few thousand dollars worth of profit. Finally, I read the comments made by the editor/operator of Tate, which he had posted on a public thread/forum in defense his company. The mispellings and grammatical errors were just embarrassing. If you're going to run a publishing company, and if you're going to post on the Internet for all to see, I would think a simple spellcheck and a basic command of good English would be in order.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. I hope you find them helpful. [You can also use your favorite search engine to locate Tate publishing discussion threads, and read them first hand. There are several out there, and they are quite enlightening.]

 

[Christianbelle]

Wow! Thanks for the info!

 

[Kelly8191]

Hi! I am new to this site, but when I saw your post, I just had to respond. I am very familiar with Tate, and I'll tell you that it has its good points and its bad points. First of all, it's a hybrid publisher. That's what I've always thought of it as, and apparently what Sally E. Stuart calls it. (I'm sure you already know this, but just in case, she publishes Christian Market Guide)

Tate would probably take issue with that label, but I think it is a compliment, because it means that Tate is somehow more than a subsidy/vanity press. But it is simply not a traditional publisher, because you have to invest your own money up front. That's the trademark of a vanity press. Period.

Now for the good part. If you look at Tate's website and see the staff... they are good people, at least the ones I know. They work really hard and they really care about doing their jobs well. Almost all of them are hired right out of college and they are "hungry" -- which is a good thing. They aren't bored or hopefully not yet burned out; they are excited to be editing, or designing book covers and they bring all they have to the table.

A big difference between Tate and a pure vanity press is that Tate works really hard to sell books. They spend lots of money on advertising and try their hardest to get bookstores to stock author books (which is really hard, and FYI, no bookstore chain stocks POD books. So again, you see that Tate is a hybrid). Their Marketing team is made up of really nice people who try so hard to do their jobs well. HOWEVER. At this point, Tate just doesn't have a strong marketing arm. Walk into a bookstore and try to find a book published by Tate. You probably won't be able to find a single book with their red logo. The only exception is if a local author has recently had a book signing at that one store. You might find one or two copies of that particular book. That's the bad news.

You just have to weigh your individual situation and be realistic. Can you afford the author investment? Even if you get nothing back? Is this the way you want to publish?

Tate will do the best it can, but as far as selling your books (and then earning back your author investment) it will be up to you. Some people can make this work. Most don't. People who do public speaking have the most luck -- look at Rick Warren, he self-published "Purpose-Driven Life" (note with Tate, btw). And "I Kissed Dating Goodbye" was originally self-published. Both these men were totally on their own and made it work. Tate will at least try, but don't get your expectations too high if you go with them.

You'll get good people, a full edit, and a really good-looking cover. (With vanity presses, I think you get a book that looks homemade, not professional.) They'll try to help you market it, but you're mostly on your own. That's the honest truth of the matter. For some that's a good fit, for others it's not.

Best of luck!

 

[Kelly8191]

It's in a written contract that you get the author investment back if you sell 5,000 books, so that's legally binding. (in answer to the earlier post)

 

[Christianfantasy]

Tate charges in the vicinity of $4,000, to the author, to publish a book. Yes, they legally guarantee to refund the full amount if the book sells a certain number of copies, and 5,000 sounds like the figure I recall. My point was/is that, when pressed, Tate Publishing was unable to cite a single case in which a book/author qualified for the refund. I wasn't suggesting Tate would refuse to repay the money if a book sold the requisite number of copies. What I said was that by their own admission they've never done so. This should tell any objective observer that Tate makes its money not from selling books but by charging authors. If your goal in writing is to pay a high enough fee to a publishing co. to enable that company to stay in business, and so long as you get a good looking published book out of the deal you're happy, then Tate is the place for you. If you believe an author's contribution is the time, hard work, skill, creativity and excellence of their craft, and that rather than have to subsidize a publisher on top of it all the author should actually make (rather than pay) money, then the track record of Tate suggests it would be a poor choice. Personally, I would be far more open to the Tate Publishing model if they could cite even one single book they had published that really took off, sold lots of copies, and made money for both the company and the author. As I mentioned above, however, I have read the testimonies of purported Tate authors who are quite happy with the company and the service, so as best I have been able to find out it is a company that pleases at least some of its customers very much.

 

[Kelly8191]

Hi Indy-

You make some great points that I really do agree with. I myself, would not chose to go with a vanity or subsidy press. However, I do (like you, I'm sure) respect those who for their own reasons elect to go with those presses.

Just for the sake of integrity (mine, not yours) I have to point out an error in your post. Some authors have in fact received their author investment back. Tate says that in 2005, by October of that fiscal year, five authors had. In all fairness, that is a very small number relative to how many they actually publish. I do not know what more recent statistics are. (Hopefully better, as their marketing department has grown quite a bit)

I don't know if anyone is following this post, but I wanted to make sure that the info is correct, at least to my knowledge.

Blessings!

 

[Christianfantasy]

I am genuinely curious; who are the authors, and what are the titles of their books? I would be interested in reading more about them. One reason I'm so curious is because I read an entire thread [but didn't bookmark it] some months ago in which a Tate representative participated. He couldn't cite a single case in which the company had refunded the original fee. If they had done it five times, I would think he would have brought that information forward right away. Two other things I have noticed that seemed odd. On one thread, a poster showed up who claimed to be a Tate author whose book had sold well. Yet he refused to give either his name or the title of his book. On another thread a similar thing happened--but it turned out that the supposed author had 'Tate' embedded in his email address. It could have been a coincidence, except that the poster deleted his email address from his Absolutewrite profile the moment it was pointed out. Hmm.

But be all that as it may, I am still extremely curious to see the names of the authors and their books, and to read a more about their publication and sales histories. I look forward to seeing that information; thank you in advance.

 

[Christianfantasy]

One more thing I am extremely curious about. Namely, what is the total number of books Tate has published versus the number of fees they claim, or can document, having refunded? In other words, what percentage of authors published by Tate receive documentable refunds? (I would hope the company makes this information readily available, as it should certainly be a component in any author's decision to publish with Tate or go a less expensive (to the author) route.) Thank you in advance.

 

[Kelly8191]

The only two titles that I was told were:

Crystal Meth by a woman whose name escapes me. She is highly regarded in her field, so I imagine that's why she could do it. My guess is she needed something hard-copy to sell when she spoke, which is when of course it makes sense to self-publish.

The other one was written by Leon Metzer. At least I think that's how you spell it. He is a rabid Tate endorser, so I hope he doesn't show up on this thread! I googled some websites that talk about Tate, and he seems to always show up. No disrespect meant, but I really don't want to read another post from him. (sorry, I know I sound rude, but it's been a long day!)

I apologize for my laziness, I could look up the names and titles on the Tate bookstore, but I am not up for it. Tate can sell Tate; I just wanted to share a bit of what I know.

Publishing a book is so much harder than the average person suspects. My advice to others is if you have the money (by all means don't go into debt) hire a good freelance editor then try your hardest to get an agent. A lot of times people just want the immediate gratification -- I've seen really good books go the subsidy route that with more time and harder work might have had a chance getting published with one of the big boys.

 

[Kelly8191]

Any author that sells books at Tate gets royalties. But you have to sell those 5 thousand before your received royalties surpass what you paid them. So for one quarter your royalty check might be only one hundred dollars. They don't hold onto your royalties until you hit the 5000 mark, but it might take a long time to get there. Or you might never get there.

Surely they would share some hard stats, because I totally agree that it's critical information for any potential author.

There are a LOT of books in the online bookstore.

 

[Christianfantasy]

Thank you for the information. I found the Crystal Meth book with no problem. There were no sales figures available, but it appears that Dr. Holley tours the world giving lectures on crystal meth and selling her book. I have no trouble believing she has sold upwards of five thousand copies, since that is her full time job (or so it appears). I couldn't find a published author named Leon Metzer. I appreciate the information anyway, and I'm calling it a night. Thanks again.