Talking With Atheists & Standing Firm In Our Faith

[amariselle]

I have been thinking about this lately, mostly as a result of what I have seen going on in these forums.

I know there are Atheists (and other non-Christians) who truly do come here because they have real questions and concerns, and they want to know more about the Christian faith. However, much of what I have been seeing lately involves quite opposite.

There are a number of Atheists on these forums that seem to have absolutely zero interest in hearing any Christian perspectives whatsoever. They seem to think that they should be free to rip apart Christianity (and Christians) and in cases where a Christian does respond to this, (in a respectful way) these Atheists proceed to attack that Christian's beliefs, the Bible and who the Christian is as a person.

I have personally encountered this behaviour, I have been called a liar, and have had it suggested that I cannot read or write. (Among many other personal insults). I have seen other Christians attacked in similar ways, and I have seen the Bible referred to as "rubbish." (All of these things are clearly against forum rules, and yet they continue).

Also, when Christians do wish to participate in general areas of the forums, they are sometimes told to stay in the "Christian Only" sections. I fail to see the logic in this. These Atheists have purposely signed up to a forum called "ChristianForums.com" and yet they seem to expect that they should be able to post insulting and condescending things about the Christian faith and that Christians should stay silent. There are plenty of Atheist forums where I'm sure they could do this, so why bring it here? In my opinion, for some Atheists, joining this forum is just a game, and they have come here with the sole purpose of tearing down Christians and what we believe in. They have no questions, they have already made up their minds, and they seek out sites like this with the sole purpose of intimidating Christians.

So, my questions are, how do we deal graciously with these Atheists? They are unwilling to enter into respectful discussion and they twist words and insult people's character, so how can we move past this and attempt to have a real and honest dialogue? Is it even possible, or is it always doomed to be an endless, circular argument with no resolution?

If some Atheists come here just to play games, when do we "shake the dust from our sandals" so to speak? And how do we do so in a respectful way that doesn't shut the door for continued exploration of Christianity for those who truly desire it? How do we stand firm in our faith and yet walk away when we need to?

 

[SkyWriting]

I have been thinking about this lately, mostly as a result of what I have seen going on in these forums.

I know there are Atheists (and other non-Christians) who truly do come here because they have real questions and concerns, and they want to know more about the Christian faith. However, much of what I have been seeing lately involves quite opposite.

There are a number of Atheists on these forums that seem to have absolutely zero interest in hearing any Christian perspectives whatsoever. They seem to think that they should be free to rip apart Christianity (and Christians) and in cases where a Christian does respond to this, (in a respectful way) these Atheists proceed to attack that Christian's beliefs, the Bible and who the Christian is as a person.

I have personally encountered this behaviour, I have been called a liar, and have had it suggested that I cannot read or write. (Among many other personal insults). I have seen other Christians attacked in similar ways, and I have seen the Bible referred to as "rubbish." (All of these things are clearly against forum rules, and yet they continue).

Also, when Christians do wish to participate in general areas of the forums, they are sometimes told to stay in the "Christian Only" sections. I fail to see the logic in this. These Atheists have purposely signed up to a forum called "ChristianForums.com" and yet they seem to expect that they should be able to post insulting and condescending things about the Christian faith and that Christians should stay silent. There are plenty of Atheist forums where I'm sure they could do this, so why bring it here? In my opinion, for some Atheists, joining this forum is just a game, and they have come here with the sole purpose of tearing down Christians and what we believe in. They have no questions, they have already made up their minds, and they seek out sites like this with the sole purpose of intimidating Christians.

So, my questions are, how do we deal graciously with these Atheists? They are unwilling to enter into respectful discussion and they twist words and insult people's character, so how can we move past this and attempt to have a real and honest dialogue? Is it even possible, or is it always doomed to be an endless, circular argument with no resolution?

If some Atheists come here just to play games, when do we "shake the dust from our sandals" so to speak? And how do we do so in a respectful way that doesn't shut the door for continued exploration of Christianity for those who truly desire it? How do we stand firm in our faith and yet walk away when we need to?

We stand firm in our faith and walk away when we need to.
This opens the door for God step up and enter their lives.
You can put on thicker skin, or put on the armor of God
if you wish. Both work fine. Avoiding hurt feelings is the
best indicator that you believe what you say. Can you read
and write? If so, why would anything said to the contrary
be an issue?

 

[amariselle]

We stand firm in our faith and walk away when we need to.
This opens the door for God step up and enter their lives.
You can put on thicker skin, or put on the armor of God
if you wish. Both work fine. Avoiding hurt feelings is the
best indicator that you believe what you say.

I am not personally offended, just commenting on the attacks I have experienced and witnessed happening to Christians. And I am asking those here who would like to comment, what they as a Christian feel is the most gracious way to deal with this. We are after all warned by Jesus that the world will hate us, so that should come as no surprise.

Can you read and write? If so, why would anything said to the contrary be an issue?

That was something someone said to me on these forums because I made a spelling error in one of my posts.

 

[SkyWriting]

That was something someone said to me on these forums because I made a spelling error in one of my posts.

That shows you were making sense to them
and they were grasping at straws to keep
a hold of their wobbly logic seat.
Take it as a compliment.

 

[Albion]

They are unwilling to enter into respectful discussion and they twist words and insult people's character, so how can we move past this and attempt to have a real and honest dialogue? Is it even possible, or is it always doomed to be an endless, circular argument with no resolution?

It is always doomed to be an endless, circular argument with no resolution.

If it doesn't bother you that they can go on doing what they do just as happily so long as some Christian, any Christian, is willing to engage with them, you can put all such characters on "ignore" and you won't miss a thing yourself. There will almost always be other posters with whom a discussion s possible.

 

[amariselle]

It is always doomed to be an endless, circular argument with no resolution.

If it doesn't bother you that they can go on doing what they do just as happily so long as some Christian, any Christian, is willing to engage with them, you can put all such characters on "ignore" and you won't miss a thing yourself. There will almost always be other posters with whom a discussion s possible.

Good thoughts Albion.

 

[Starcrystal]

That shows you were making sense to them
and they were grasping at straws to keep
a hold of their wobbly logic seat.
Take it as a compliment.

I too have had people turn to correcting spelling errors, saying I had no education, was dumb, etc...not recently here but in the past, and also in other places.
The topic may be deep and you are digging into some really profound issues, then you post without using spell correct and someone immediately picks on that to try to "prove" you are not qualified to speak on the subject due to a simple typo.

 

[amariselle]

I too have had people turn to correcting spelling errors, saying I had no education, was dumb, etc...not recently here but in the past, and also in other places.
The topic may be deep and you are digging into some really profound issues, then you post without using spell correct and someone immediately picks on that to try to "prove" you are not qualified to speak on the subject due to a simple typo.

Exactly. I guess this form of argument makes no sense to me. I don't think there is a single person out there who can honestly say they've never made a spelling mistake.

 

[Starcrystal]

Exactly. I guess this form of argument makes no sense to me. I don't think there is a single person out there who can honestly say they've never made a spelling mistake.

When it happened here I was also in college and used to just tell them "this isn't a college final here, and even the prefessors usually had you submit a rough draft that they would add corrections to"

I will leave MY typo just made "professors" as proof..also besides that my keyboards letters are nearly worn off so it is easier to make a typo

 

[Erose]

There is an insight that Archbishop Fulton Sheen had once concerning atheists. He asked an atheist once, "How is it possible to hate someone that you don't believe exists?"

It is the militant atheists who are walking around deceiving themselves, because you can't hate someone who doesn't exist. Deep down inside they believe that God exists, but are trying their hardest to convince themselves that He doesn't. Pretty sad in my opinion.

 

[Arsenios]

Exactly. I guess this form of argument makes no sense to me. I don't think there is a single person out there who can honestly say they've never made a spelling mistake.

One small corrective is to always correct typos on the part of those with whom you disagree, making their post all pristine and grammatical, you then have the exousia - the power and authority - to simply reply: "But Boo-Boo, I ALWAYS correct YOUR typos and NEVER call YOU an ILLITERATE ATHEIST..." And then follow it with a ...

The most important thing to remember is that you are not responsible for their thoughts and decisions in thinking and acting... Most of them are simply here to test their ideas in the face of contrary ideas... So they will tend to argue tooth and nail to the end... Christians here are often here for the same reason, btw...

This is why I am so joyful in my engagements with them and with atheists when they post, because there are a bizillion ways of approaching any issue according to what is presented for discussion, and how it is presented... But always remember, a person who is mature in the Faith of Christ will love and thank God for ALL things, even for the killer as he or she is murdering your child before your eyes... Praying for that person in the Love of God Who even and especially loves sinners is quintessential Christianity... It is not Milk, but Milk prepares for it...

Christianity is a RADICAL Faith...
It is loving and it is kind...
Castigating one who disagrees with you is a confession of failure...
Get castigated and rejoice!
Then look for a way to be kind...
And always be praying for all...

Arsenios

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

I have spent a lot of time on atheist forums in order to brush up on my apologetics and I have had many dealing with atheist. The other forum that I venue is "the thinking atheist". Even though I am one of a handful of Christians on that particular forum, remarkably, I have a fairly positive reputation. Here are my recommendations for "dealing with such individuals.

1. Remember that an attack on your post is not an attack on you as an individual. I have had many heated debates with atheist who would "rip apart" my post and throw out insults on topics regarding religion only to turn around and have a wonderful conversation about secular topics. Just remember that the insults are directed to your post and not on you.

2. Anytime you are interacting with an atheist, do not make it your mission to change their point of view or convince them of anything. If they ask a question, answer it as best as you can. If they are calloused and do not want to listen, let it go.

3. Do not view these "interactions" with atheists as a discussion. Rather look at it as a debate. In a discussion, people with different views discuss a topic to gain further understanding and will result in both parties learning something new and hopefully leaving with a mutual agreement. Unfortunately, atheists on a Web forum do not have "discussions", they have debates. In a debate, two people with opposing views argue with each other in order to "win" an arguement....not to learn anything. Normally in a debate, judges will decide a winner. However, in an Internet forum, the readers are the judges. You may feel like you are talking to a brick wall. You may get frustrated because the atheist is grabbing straws and going in circles. Don't worry about it. Instead, think about the curious reader who is looking for answers. That individual will read both sides of the argument and make their own decision based on the information provided. If you convinced the reader, you win. If you fail to convince your opponent, who cares because it's to be expected.

I hope this helps.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[ClothedInGrace]

Another Issue I see is not with atheists who ridicule our faith in Jesus and the Bible, but with other "Christians" who do so. I know there is always room for growth and grace, but some "Christians" on here are always siding with the world and are against the scriptures. I have a bigger issue with these folks than those who reject Christ altogether, because at least the atheists are being honest about what they believe!

 

[Albion]

Another Issue I see is not with atheists who ridicule our faith in Jesus and the Bible, but with other "Christians" who do so. I know there is always room for growth and grace, but some "Christians" on here are always siding with the world and are against the scriptures. I have a bigger issue with these folks than those who reject Christ altogether, because at least the atheists are being honest about what they believe!

As for those "some Christians"....

It does not happen in most cases, but bear in mind that labelling oneself "Christian" is sometimes done around here in order to be evasive. Most Christians will list their denomination, but non-believers who want to post on the "Christians Only" forums have been known to select "Christian" for their personal profile, knowing that the meaning of the word can be stretched almost indefinitely.

 

[ClothedInGrace]

As for those "some Christians"....

It does not happen in most cases, but bear in mind that labelling oneself "Christian" is sometimes done around here in order to be evasive. Most Christians will list their denomination, but non-believers who want to post on the "Christians Only" forums have been known to select "Christian" for their personal profile, knowing that the meaning of the word can be stretched almost indefinitely.

I figured as much. However, the users I am thinking of have more a more specific label.

 

[Albion]

Yeh, I think I know who you mean.

 

[amariselle]

There is an insight that Archbishop Fulton Sheen had once concerning atheists. He asked an atheist once, "How is it possible to hate someone that you don't believe exists?"

It is the militant atheists who are walking around deceiving themselves, because you can't hate someone who doesn't exist. Deep down inside they believe that God exists, but are trying their hardest to convince themselves that He doesn't. Pretty sad in my opinion.

Thank you for sharing this perspective Erose. I had never really thought of it that way before.

 

[amariselle]

One small corrective is to always correct typos on the part of those with whom you disagree, making their post all pristine and grammatical, you then have the exousia - the power and authority - to simply reply: "But Boo-Boo, I ALWAYS correct YOUR typos and NEVER call YOU an ILLITERATE ATHEIST..." And then follow it with a ...

Ha ha, genius idea.

The most important thing to remember is that you are not responsible for their thoughts and decisions in thinking and acting... Most of them are simply here to test their ideas in the face of contrary ideas... So they will tend to argue tooth and nail to the end... Christians here are often here for the same reason, btw...

This is why I am so joyful in my engagements with them and with atheists when they post, because there are a bizillion ways of approaching any issue according to what is presented for discussion, and how it is presented... But always remember, a person who is mature in the Faith of Christ will love and thank God for ALL things, even for the killer as he or she is murdering your child before your eyes... Praying for that person in the Love of God Who even and especially loves sinners is quintessential Christianity... It is not Milk, but Milk prepares for it...

Christianity is a RADICAL Faith...
It is loving and it is kind...
Castigating one who disagrees with you is a confession of failure...
Get castigated and rejoice!
Then look for a way to be kind...
And always be praying for all...

Arsenios

Wow, what humbling words. You are right. I know I am far from mature in my Christian faith, and reflection on my inability to face the hatred I receive with love, reminds me of that. Obviously so many Christians have endured far more than I have, and they are the ones who have truly stood firm, even to death.

I fall far short of this, and I need to pray for forgiveness and help to do better.

 

[amariselle]

I have spent a lot of time on atheist forums in order to brush up on my apologetics and I have had many dealing with atheist. The other forum that I venue is "the thinking atheist". Even though I am one of a handful of Christians on that particular forum, remarkably, I have a fairly positive reputation. Here are my recommendations for "dealing with such individuals.

1. Remember that an attack on your post is not an attack on you as an individual. I have had many heated debates with atheist who would "rip apart" my post and throw out insults on topics regarding religion only to turn around and have a wonderful conversation about secular topics. Just remember that the insults are directed to your post and not on you.

2. Anytime you are interacting with an atheist, do not make it your mission to change their point of view or convince them of anything. If they ask a question, answer it as best as you can. If they are calloused and do not want to listen, let it go.

3. Do not view these "interactions" with atheists as a discussion. Rather look at it as a debate. In a discussion, people with different views discuss a topic to gain further understanding and will result in both parties learning something new and hopefully leaving with a mutual agreement. Unfortunately, atheists on a Web forum do not have "discussions", they have debates. In a debate, two people with opposing views argue with each other in order to "win" an arguement....not to learn anything. Normally in a debate, judges will decide a winner. However, in an Internet forum, the readers are the judges. You may feel like you are talking to a brick wall. You may get frustrated because the atheist is grabbing straws and going in circles. Don't worry about it. Instead, think about the curious reader who is looking for answers. That individual will read both sides of the argument and make their own decision based on the information provided. If you convinced the reader, you win. If you fail to convince your opponent, who cares because it's to be expected.

I hope this helps.

It does help, and is all very good advice. Thank you so much for sharing Jason.

 

[amariselle]

Another Issue I see is not with atheists who ridicule our faith in Jesus and the Bible, but with other "Christians" who do so. I know there is always room for growth and grace, but some "Christians" on here are always siding with the world and are against the scriptures. I have a bigger issue with these folks than those who reject Christ altogether, because at least the atheists are being honest about what they believe!

Absolutely! I very much agree. I've actually been quite disheartened to see how much this goes on here.