Suggestion led me

[timothyu]

There were many fruit trees in Eden. All but one were freely available to Adam and Eve.

Exactly, and one tempting just like handicap or maternity parking today.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Exactly, and one tempting just like handicap or maternity parking today.

I can't get away with maternity parking.........

 

[timothyu]

I can't get away with maternity parking........

I could, with my slightly protruding belly and a simple twist of pronoun.

 

[weekEd]

No. There were many fruit trees in Eden. All but one were freely available to Adam and Eve.

sure sure... they were all available they proved it

 

[weekEd]

I like to go to Phillippians to review the steps of Christ's humbling of Himself to save us.

[Christ] Who, existing in the form of God, did not consider being equal with God a treasure to be grasped,

But emptied Himself, taking the form of a slave, becoming in the likeness of men;

And being found in fashion as a man, He humbled Himself, becoming obedient even unto death, and that the death of a cross.

Therefore also God highly exalted Him and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,

that in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,

And every tongue should openly confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father. (Phil. 2:6-11)

you wouldn't buy this today why do you think a guy named peter would believe it if you did the same things without the jewish slang and mythology either present or inherently interpreted by you today??
the miricle of birth... pretty simple statement yet it happens and the babies aren't cared for any differently than yesterday or the day before even if you include the yom as a day..
yes he carried his cross literaly without protest... majestic without the sarcasm... yes impulsive word "majestic"

 

[Joseph G]

sure sure... they were all available they proved it

Yes, and standing tall and majestic amidst them all - the Tree Of Life. One bite - instant immunity to death. Pretty fair deal, eh?

Unfortunately, they chose self-godhood instead and bought the lie. Just like God warned, death entered in.

Having already prepared a Solution in such an eventuality, God drove them out of the garden so as to prevent them then partaking of the Tree of Life, in their sinful state, thus guaranteeing eternal separation from God and any hope of redemption.

Each of us have a similar choice before us. The difference is that we have inherited the sinful nature, so in essence have already partaken of the Tree of Death.

The solution? Die to self and partake of the flesh and blood of our Savior - Jesus Christ.

Waiting for the Redeemed in Heaven? The Tree of Life again.

Brilliant plan, eh?

 

[weekEd]

Yes, and standing tall and majestic amidst them all - the Tree Of Life. One bite - instant immunity to death. Pretty fair deal, eh?

Unfortunately, they chose self-godhood instead and bought the lie. Just like God warned, death entered in.

Having already prepared a Solution in such an eventuality, God drove them out of the garden so as to prevent them then partaking of the Tree of Life, in their sinful state, thus guaranteeing eternal separation from God and any hope of redemption.

Each of us have a similar choice before us. The difference is that we have inherited the sinful nature, so in essence have already partaken of the Tree of Death.

The solution? Die to self and partake of the flesh and blood of our Savior - Jesus Christ.

Waiting for the Redeemed in Heaven? The Tree of Life again.

Brilliant plan, eh?

yeah they wanted to live that is why they ate... sorry.. tears and tears of death... from starvation or God
They chose God and he blessed them with children, blessings, more than can be counted... and we are still talking about them... at times I question my happiness yet it is better than not ever beign around... kinda like what they were thinking... so yeah God is great and wonderfull and angry at times... just like his image except God doesn't care..right?

 

[Aussie Pete]

sure sure... they were all available they proved it

Not freely. They paid a hell of a price for disobeying God.

 

[weekEd]

Not freely. They paid a hell of a price for disobeying God.

I wouldn't be here unless somebody screwed up

 

[oikonomia]

you wouldn't buy this today why do you think a guy named peter would believe it if you did the same things without the jewish slang and mythology either present or inherently interpreted by you today??

There is a lot packed into this question. Its rather filled with unbelieving doubt about Jesus.

This Person is unique and in a class of one. His work and unique.
I "buy" it because I met and know this available Person the Lord Jesus Christ.

He became in a form in which He can mingle, unite, and blend with my innermost spiritual being.
In resurrection He became a divine ife imparting Spirit to bond with my human spirit.
He is available to me as "a life giving Spirit" - Christ. The last Adam, Jesus Christ, became a life giving Spirit.

So also it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living soul”; the last Adam became a life-giving Spirit. (1 Cor. 15:45)

This life giving Spirit is a mysterious yet totally real Person who gives God into man.
He gives Himself into man that the reborn comatose human spirit is enlivened and joined to Christ as "one spirit".
That means a part of my being is mingled with God.

But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit. (1 Cor, 6:17)

the miricle of birth...

Not only a miracle birth God accomplished. But for thirty years God as a man lived in a dispised town apprently
so well with other people He created no particular stir. That is until the age of thirty. Then He opened His mouth in the
ministry and works that His Father gave Him to do. And the result has been catyclysmic on human history.

Such a One is available to us today. I mean today.

This sacrifice you asked about makes it possible to know as one knows no other fact, that he or she is
in a life relationship with the Father. That is because of His redemption the human spirit becomes divine life because
of righteousness (which we didn't have). The comatose and deadened human spirit becomes God's life because of righteousness.

But if Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, the spirit is life because of righteousness. (Rom. 8:10)

I have experienced this. Have you experienced that you have this Person living in you?
Do you know that God is available to us as the resurrected man who also became a life giving Holy Spirit?

Concerning His resurrection He said -
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer,
but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live.
In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. (John 14:19,20)

To really live is to have Christ living in you in a blended and mingled way.
All His sacrifice was to accomplish this for the eternal purpose of the Triune God.

 

[weekEd]

There is a lot packed into this question. Its rather filled with unbelieving doubt about Jesus.

This Person is unique and in a class of one. His work and unique.
I "buy" it because I met and know this available Person the Lord Jesus Christ.

He became in a form in which He can mingle, unite, and blend with my innermost spiritual being.
In resurrection He became a divine ife imparting Spirit to bond with my human spirit.
He is available to me as "a life giving Spirit" - Christ. The last Adam, Jesus Christ, became a life giving Spirit.

So also it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living soul”; the last Adam became a life-giving Spirit. (1 Cor. 15:45)

This life giving Spirit is a mysterious yet totally real Person who gives God into man.
He gives Himself into man that the reborn comatose human spirit is enlivened and joined to Christ as "one spirit".
That means a part of my being is mingled with God.

But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit. (1 Cor, 6:17)

Not only a miracle birth God accomplished. But for thirty years God as a man lived in a dispised town apprently
so well with other people He created no particular stir. That is until the age of thirty. Then He opened His mouth in the
ministry and works that His Father gave Him to do. And the result has been catyclysmic on human history.

Such a One is available to us today. I mean today.

This sacrifice you asked about makes it possible to know as one knows no other fact, that he or she is
in a life relationship with the Father. That is because of His redemption the human spirit becomes divine life because
of righteousness (which we didn't have). The comatose and deadened human spirit becomes God's life because of righteousness.

But if Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, the spirit is life because of righteousness. (Rom. 8:10)

I have experienced this. Have you experienced that you have this Person living in you?
Do you know that God is available to us as the resurrected man who also became a life giving Holy Spirit?

Concerning His resurrection He said -
Yet a little while and the world beholds Me no longer,
but you behold Me; because I live, you also shall live.
In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. (John 14:19,20)

To really live is to have Christ living in you in a blended and mingled way.
All His sacrifice was to accomplish this for the eternal purpose of the Triune God.

not to complicate things here...
you say you met Jesus, because your "inner spiriit" can mingle with , unite, and blend.
then mention ressurection... and something about Spirit and spirit.
"Life giving Spirit" could be defined coherently or not and it just serves as a distraction in the context of your claim of meeting Jesus to me... as if you share in the same experience as those at the tomb who proportedly saw Jesus for the first time or twice such and such.
that aside...
you and I both know there is more to a person than we can percieve, and Jesus being a person fits that narrative for me.
If I saw my friend live through what he lived through is irrelevant to me meeting him years after his ordeal wether I understand it fully or not.
that being said I see your comments as "qualified" word "salad" for a lack of better words to use.
I don't think I need to say something as ridiculous as I met an ethereal unqualified angel named Satan or whoever it was that Jesus met because the word Satan is a descriptor unlike a name in that context but it doesn't have to be either way.
Meeting Satan would be notable if it were a person like Jesus or just a person, human whom Jesus met.
not anything anthropomorphized.
Like a fluffy cloud named Spot.
I don't have to name you Satan and know that is your name nor oikonomia unless of course that is your name in an unfamiliar colloquial presentation to me, it would be incorrect if that is your name or (C/K)hris or something likewise. peter.
so Jesus the Christ Messiah for brevity Jesus, because that is what his friends called him, you met.
am I to engage in some dispute or should I just dissmiss your assertion, or prima faice accept your claim?

 

[oikonomia]

not to complicate things here...
you say you met Jesus, because your "inner spiriit" can mingle with , unite, and blend.

Yes.

then mention ressurection... and something about Spirit and spirit.
"Life giving Spirit" could be defined coherently or not and it just serves as a distraction in the context of your claim of meeting Jesus to me... as if you share in the same experience as those at the tomb who proportedly saw Jesus for the first time or twice such and such.
that aside...

Yes. "Life giving Spirit" is a Jesus giving Spirit. Jesus can be given to us.
"Life giving Spirit" is a God giving Spirit. Both the Father and the Son can be given to us to make an abode with us.

This discussion of His transition from being AMONG men to being IN men is disclosed by Him before His death and resurrection
in John's Gospel- chapters 14-17.

And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Comforter, that He may be with you forever, (John 14:16)
Even the Spirit of reality, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him; but you know Him, because He abides with you and shall be in you. (v.17)
I will not leave you as orphans; I am coming to you. (v.18)

You see the "another Comforter" is the first Comforter Jesus in another form.
When He is sent into us who receive Him, He remains in us for eternity.

The world cannot see him by their natural means.
But Jesus said "but you know Him, because He abides with you and shall be in you."
For three and a half years Jesus abode WITH them. Now when He goes into death and comes out in resurrection
He who was abiding with them (as the first Comforter) will be able to abide IN them (as another Comforter),

This indwelling "another Comforter" is Jesus of Nazareth in another form as "the Spirit of reality".
The comfort this one brings will extend unto eternity.

In verse 18 the "He" suddenly changes to "I". The "I" will not leave the disciples as orphans but it coming TO them.
I will not leave you as orphans; I am coming to you. (v.18)
Jesus Christ would not leave His followers abandoned as orphans. As "another Comforter" Jesus is coming to us
if we receive His work and Him.

He came to His own, yet those who were His own did not receive Him.
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the authority to become children of God,
to those who believe into His name, (John 1:11,12)

Now you can see why Paul wrote truthfully - "the Last Adam became a life giving Spirit".
Truthfully in resurrection - I am coming to you.

you and I both know there is more to a person than we can percieve, and Jesus being a person fits that narrative for me.
If I saw my friend live through what he lived through is irrelevant to me meeting him years after his ordeal wether I understand it fully or not.
that being said I see your comments as "qualified" word "salad" for a lack of better words to use.

This is not a word salad. But it is in a divine and mystical realm. Let me say more about John 14.
Below verse 18 He promises that He will manifest Himself to His lovers, His disciples. And His perplexed disciples
asked and asked about this manifestation of Himself to them.

He who has My commandments and keeps them, he is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will manifest Myself to him.
Judas, not Iscariot, said to Him, Lord, and what has happened that You are to manifest Yourself to us and not to the world?
Jesus answered and said to him, If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word, and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make an abode with him. (vs. 21-23)

You see He and the Father as the divine "We" of the miraculous three-one God will come to us ans make an abode with us who
receive Him.

am I to engage in some dispute or should I just dissmiss your assertion, or prima faice accept your claim?

I think you should not miss out on the enjoyment of the true claims of the New Testament.
If you have terrible doubts and lots of problems with Christians and with the Bible this is what I suggest.

Find some place where you can be alone and pour out your heart to God in gut level honesty all that
you don't like or believe or find confusing to God. He always accepts an honest heart.

If there is an obstacle, a barrier circumventing and obstructing your enjoyment of Jesus Christ, I would
pour out my heart to God insisting that He show you where the real problem is.

Now having said that, I would advize let your pouring out of your starkly honest complaint be
accompanied with a little thanksgiving.

I don't care who you are or what you have been through. Every man or woman can look back
over their life and find something for which they could pray "Well God, at least I thank You for this."

Enter into His gates with thanksgiving and into His court with praise.
So bring your stark, gut level, down to the nitty gritty objection to God.
But also bring some thanksgiving. You have somethings you can THANK God for.
Bring some thankfulness and then pour out your heart's problems (not with me) but with the word of God.

You will get some results I do believe.

 

[weekEd]

is that your video?

 

[oikonomia]

is that your video?

Yes. I have a hobby of setting the bible verses to songs.
If you like singing the scripture for memorization here's my latest from John 6:63.
(Its difficult to control what follows the video).

 

[weekEd]

in recolection Spirit is breath to my understanding based on what I have read in the biblle.
That is why they were confident that Jesus was dead noting that his Spirit left him, that all intents and actions were over.
Then a few days later he got up and went somewhere.

 

[oikonomia]

in recolection Spirit is breath to my understanding based on what I have read in the biblle.
That is why they were confident that Jesus was dead noting that his Spirit left him, that all intents and actions were over.
Then a few days later he got up and went somewhere.

He spent 40 days training them to live by His invisible presence. He trained them to realize
that though they often could not see Him He was still with them. This transition had to be made crystal clear to the twelve
apostles and to others with them.

Over the course of 40 days then He would appear in thier midst and then hide Himself as if to vanish.
He did not "go away." He took weeks to accustom them to this new relationship.

He breathed Himself into them with the symbolic act of blowing His breath into them.
When He enacted this act in the divine and mystical realm Jesus as the life giving Spirit entered into them.

When therefore it was evening on that day, the first day of the week, and while the doors were shut where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and said to them, Peace be to you.

And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side. The disciples therefore rejoiced at seeing the Lord.

Then Jesus said to them again, Peace be to you; as the Father has sent Me, I also send you.

And when He had said this, He breathed into them and said to them, Receive the Holy Spirit. (John 20:19-22)

He trained them to deeply realize that it was expedient for them that this new inward presence was just Himself.
These were the things of the kingdom of God that He spoke to them for a period of 40 days.

And they got well trained to the point nothing now could desuade them of the truth of His indwelling living.
So they were able to give their lives for the gospel even to death.

Until the day on which He was taken up, after He had given commandment through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom He chose;

To whom also He presented Himself alive after His suffering by many irrefutable proofs, appearing to them through a period of forty days and speaking the things concerning the kingdom of God. (Acts 1:2,3)

 

[weekEd]

"expedient for them"?

 

[oikonomia]

"expedient for them"?

Yes. Absolutely it was expedient for them and for the Triune God and His eternal purpose.

It was absolutely critical, crucial, paramount, and the highest of priorities. He said so here.

But now I am going to Him who sent Me; and none of you asks Me, Where are You going?
But because I have spoken these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart.

But I tell you the truth, It is expedient for you that I go away; for if I do not go away,
the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. (John 16:5-7)

They did not at that time see how it could be expedient.
But He said there sorrow would be turned into JOY of receiving Him the into them as eternal life.

Forgive me if I share a song I wrote on those verses also. (Ignore if afterwards something else plays)

 

[Hawkins]

Without the understanding of what Christian is I'm finding it difficult to qualify myself as non Christian

The preaching of the gospel is like when you are on a boat in the middle of the seas, when the radio says that there's tornado coming toward your location. It boils down to why you have to believe what the radio says and make a run. What determining factors would make you realize that it's a truth.

That being said. Christians are those believed to make their run. At the subconscious level, they reckon the "voice" of the Shepherd to determine that what being preached is a truth, in the same manner as how the one the boat making his decision.

Satan on the other hand, is to lead humans to distractions and to blind them from recognizing the determining factors which subconsciously allow humans to make a correct decision, same as the one on the boat.

 

[AlexB23]

The preaching of the gospel is like when you are on a boat in the middle of the seas, when the radio says that there's tornado coming toward your location. It boils down to why you have to believe what the radio says and make a run. What determining factors would make you realize that it's a truth.

That being said. Christians are those believed to make their run. At the subconscious level, they reckon the "voice" of the Shepherd to determine that what being preached is a truth, in the same manner as how the on the boat making his decision.

That is a good analogy sir. It has happened to me, where I get this gut feeling that something I am about to do is wrong, and I change my mind. Sometimes God puts in a pang of feeling into us to prevent us from straying down the wrong path.