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Discussion in 'Deeper Fellowship' started by Sidon, Jun 5, 2021.

  1. Sidon

    Sidon Well-Known Member

    United States

    Paul tells us that he was always this...once he learned to submit to the Grace of God. = "Christ always Gives me the VICTORY".

    =Submitting to God's Grace.

    And, the powerless Christian, the legalist, the one who is worried about losing salvation, who is trying to keep themselves saved, has not submitted to the Grace of God.
    Born again? Yes.
    Going to heaven? Yes.
    Submitted to God's Grace, NO.
    And that is why they sin and confess and this is their entire Christian Life.

    See the Things of God basically work opposite of how we THINK they should be.
    And its that mind, that is not yet renewed.
    So, we much change this mind, this "natural mind" and align it with God's perspective.
    We must stop trying to be accepted by God, and learn to believe that we are always "made righteous" by the precious blood of Jesus that never ceases to keep all the born again as Clean and as PURE as God's very own Righteousness.

    When you exist there, in your believing faith, then you have entered the renewed mind and found : "Christ always gives me the Victory".
    See, victory over self, deception, and the devil, is not found by trying to do it.
    Its found ONLY by existing as walking in the Spirit, which is to have a renewed mind.
    We do not find our power in God, by trying to be powerful.
    We find it, by resting in God's Grace that becomes our renewed mind and our : "Christ always gives me the Victory".

    Believer, to have THE Victory, is to be able to withstand the devil, and to be able to live holy.

    That's the victory.

    Paul said that "Christ always >gives< him the Victory".
    This is because there is none found when Paul tried to keep the law, or tried to resist his carnality, by WILLPOWER.

    So, how do you get that power, that is "always the victory", that Paul says is yours?

    = You submit to God's GRACE.

    See, most believers, are not submitted, they are just redeemed.
    They are blood bought, but the are not mind renewed.

    And here is the thing.....to submit to God, is not your idea of it.
    And the reason you sin and confess, is because you are trying to self manufacture deliverance, vs, walking in the renewed mind, where deliverance is your God given GRACE.
    See, you think this means to be willing and obedient to go and do.
    You think this means that you are to keep the Law, and commandments, and try harder to be better.
    But that is not what this particular Spiritual "submition" means.

    This "submit", means to stop being your natural mind, regarding your faith, and become transformed by the renewing of your mind, into the Spiritual mind.
    THAT is how you "submit", that gains the power to overcome, that is : "Christ ALWAYS GIVES..... me the Victory".
    See who is giving it?
    Its not your effort, and that is why Christ tells you that "apart from me you can do nothing".
    And this "nothing" is the fruit of sinning and confessing as someone's discipleship.

    See, when you are not overcoming your carnality, and your fear, and your SELF.... then you are not submitted.
    Every day you face, is the "evil day".
    And you overcome this, not by willp0wer, but by being given the VICTORY over it.
    You find that Victory, when you submit to God's Grace and stay submitted.

    And what is the submission?
    its this, reader.
    You have to lose all faith in yourself to try to stay saved, by trying to keep yourself saved.
    See, most believers are in THAT MIND.
    They are...>"here is what im doing to keep my salvation, and to keep myself in fellowship with God.".
    And that mind is not the right mind. That mind is the un-renewed mind.
    That faith, is broken, as it does not TRUST CHRIST to keep you saved.
    That wrong mind, does not believe this VERSE : Philippians 1:6
    So, When you are in that mind, you are not submitted to TRUTH, and so this Knowledge can not set you free.

    Jude says that we the born again, are to : "contend for the REAL Faith".
    This means you are to learn what that is, and then press into it, and cling to it, and hold fast, and never return to any type of faith in faith, or faith in self, to try stay saved, or to try to please God.

    Reader, all believers start with ...>"God saved me'....and then nearly all quickly turn from this submission to that real faith that is the Truth, and enter into....."here is what I DO, to stay saved".. "here is what I DO to make sure i go to heaven".

    See that?
    That is a lack of submission to God's Grace, and an entire submission to SELF Righteousness.
    Self righteousness, is to be in the mind set that is found trying to make yourself right with God, or to try to keep yourself right with God.
    For example, the wrong mind thinks....>"if i confess my sin, then i am back in fellowship with God".
    Whereas, The right Mind understands deeply...>"i am the Righteousness of God in Christ".. "I am "ONE WITH GOD, In Christ"... "As Jesus IS, so are the born again in this World".. "i am MADE RIGHTEOUS".. "i always have Eternal Life, because JESUS, who IS Eternal life is IN ME, and i am IN CHRIST".

    Now, what is self righteousness, that is THE enemy of the Cross?
    Its this... Its trying to "make self RIGHT"......"Self ..Righteousness".
    See that?
    When you are in THAT MIND, then your mind is carnal and the carnal mind is actually against God.
    So, how can He then provide you with His Power, when you only have faith in SELF Righteousness.?

    So When you leave that mind and SUBMIT to God's GRACE, to this truth, which is "THE Faith", that Jude is describing, then you have found the place of REAL FAITH< and NOW Christ can give you "the Victory", over all that is against you every "evil day."

    Notice that Peter says.......in 1Peter 9:5... that you "resist the devil" "in the Faith".
    See that?
    Not by might, or by will power, but by being " IN THE FATIH."

    Now let me explain that to you.
    When you are in THE Faith, submitted to only believing that God has made you righteous and keeps you righteous,... Philippians 1:6... .then that FAITH becomes your POWER over the world, the flesh, and the devil.
    That is the renewed mind.
    That is how you "abide IN the Vine", vs being "apart from me, you can do nothing".
    See it?

    Here is how it works, reader....
    If the Devil can deceive you out of real faith, and into SELF FAITH, which is try try to stay saved, proven by the fact that you are not trusting in CHRIST ALONE to keep you saved, then you are powerless, as you have no real faith.
    You can then be destroyed by the destroyer, who looks around not for unbelievers, as they already belong to him, but he looks for the faith failed. This is the person who has not submitted to God's righteousness as their renewed mind, and are instead trying to work at salvation, by self righteousness.
    So, when you are that mind, you have no real FAITH , as Peter is describing, so you are basically naked and defenseless and the "wiles of the devil" will drown you and you can't stop it.
    He'll keep harming you, if you don't learn how to resist Him properly, by being in the "Real Faith", where this is found : "Christ always gives me the VICTORY">

    So, get your mind of faith correct, and you have submitted to God's Grace.
    Then God brings the armor and the power that sustains your VICTORY, every day.
    This is how you become "perfected" and exist as "the fullness of the Stature Of Christ".
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2021
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    SANTOSO Well-Known Member

    I don’t agree what you have said.
    Dear one,
    please support your thoughts with bible verses, that we may know what you said align with the words of God.

    For we heard:
    I have applied all these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, brothers, that you may learn by us not to go beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up in favor of one against another. -1 Corinthians 4:6
  3. Sidon

    Sidon Well-Known Member

    United States
    You didnt quote what i said, that you dont "agree with", so, go back and quote it.
    And i will address it for you.

    Also, i teach the fundamentals of Pauline Theology.
    So, if this is "new" to you, then you are not currently engaged in learning the correct application of theology, that you need to know.
    Study my Threads.
    A lot of people do. Many print them, and study them with their bible.
    This happens all over the world.

    "Study to show yourself approved, unto God", means using the Bible, as well as a good Pauline Theology ONLY teacher who can take you into the aspects of God, regarding how God wants you to BELIEVE and THINK.
    This is so very important regarding a person's Christianity.

    SANTOSO Well-Known Member

    Dear one,
    It is true that I didn’t agree with what you have said in this matter. Let us bear in mind what we have heard and what we have been taught:
    If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. -Galatians 5:25
    Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another. -Galatians 5:26

    Likewise, we heard:
    All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, -2 Timothy 3:16
    that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work. -2 Timothy 3:17

    So I am here to correct you, not to quarrel with you.

    Likewise, also we heard:
    And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, -2 Timothy 2:24
    correcting his opponents with gentleness.
    God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, -2 Timothy 2:25

    So dear one, I try to convey to you that I am here to correct gently leading you to a knowledge of truth.

    Before I begin quoting you what I don’t agree. I like to remind you that I neither seek intellectual self edification nor try to gratify your intellectual edification but to serve you as a good steward of God’s grace, as we heard:

    As each has received a gift, use it to serve one another, as good stewards of God's varied grace: -1 Peter 4:10

    whoever speaks, as one who speaks oracles of God; whoever serves, as one who serves by the strength that God supplies'in order that in everything God may be glorified through Jesus Christ. To him belong glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen. -1 Peter 4:11

    Dear one,
    You said :

    “And, the powerless Christian, the legalist, the one who is worried about losing salvation, who is trying to keep themselves saved, has not submitted to the Grace of God.
    Born again? Yes.
    Going to heaven? Yes.
    Submitted to God's Grace, NO.
    And that is why they sin and confess and this is their entire Christian Life.”

    If you said that they are “going to Heaven”! Why you makes assumption that they have not submitted to God’s grace.

    Aren’t those who have gone to Heaven ? ; that they have obtained God’s grace.

    Why you considered those go to Heaven as legalist ? Why you consider those go to Heaven as powerless ? Aren’t those who have gone to Heaven receive power ?

    Why you consider those go to Heaven as those who sin their entire life ?

    If they sinned and have confessed ! And God received them in Heaven. Why you consider them as worried about losing their salvation?
    For they sinned and confessed, they received salvation; for they go to Heaven where Christ is.

    Aren’t those who have gone to Heaven have received their salvation?
  5. Sidon

    Sidon Well-Known Member

    United States
    To "Live by the Spirit" is to be born again into the Spirit of God, by the Holy Spirit, as a "new Creation" "In Christ".

    To be "in step with the spirit", is to have a renewed mind that is in spiritual alignment/union with God's perspective of what it means to be "in Christ".
    This is how you "renew you mind".
    You become God's perspective of what it means to be "in Christ" as your real faith.

    When we have that, we are walking IN the Spirit, which is to be "in Step with".....
  6. biblelesson

    biblelesson Member

    United States
    Thank you for your post. I'm new here but I want to share my thoughts. I understand the gospel where we received the victory by God's grace only, and when we try to secure our own salvation from our works, the law, in our own strength, we miss the mark and continue to suffer. I know this well because God has blessed me many times when I was able to submit to him. He immediately bestowed his Spirit on me - filling me up. But something would happen, and I would get worried about something, start to doubt, and the Spirit would leave. Then comes the suffering to get back to the Spirit, which at that point, I realize I'm trying to secure the Spirit in my own strength. It becomes hard to get back in a submissive stance, once I allow my flesh to take over to and once the Spirit leaves, because I grieved Him.

    But one thing that hurts my heart when He leaves is I have a clear picture of the fleshly carnal man, and the new man in the Spirit. I see two persons. One is ugly, and the other is Sweet, lovely, kind, humble, soft, strong, and full of power. So I suffer when I find myself back in the ugly person, and once back there, it gets hard to submit, put off the old man, because the flesh does not want to die.

    What you said about believing what Christ has said about Victory is true. Christ has shown me in experience that it's true. When I try and figure things out in my own mind, and "try to believe" instead of just simply believe the truth of salvation and grace, I'm in "self belief, and self will." This is a suffering place for me because God has been so gracious to me to allow me to experience the Holy Spirit many times. I just seem to grieve Him. However, I realized that I'm dealing with a very hard situation where I'm being attacked by Satan non-stop from morning to night. It's a situation that cannot be explained, and is full of attack, tearing down of my personality, deception, lies, theft, and even loved ones being harmed and myself as well. Therefore, I'm sometimes able to turn to God. And other times I slip back in fear. However, I keep praying, and God helps me. I think God is showing me how to turn to Him, by building me up to be strong in Christ, and I will soon get the victory. Some situation takes time to learn how to stay in that right Christ faith.

    But I thank you so much for your post. I plan to read it in my studies because I can see where, although I'm struggling from what others are doing to me, I am also struggling due to self will. That's what I must pray for God to removed from me no matter how hard Satan attacks me.

    Thank you!

    SANTOSO Well-Known Member

    Dear one,
    Meditate psalms 143.
    You will understand the relevance what you are going through. And how the Lord will lead you. Be blessed.
  8. Sidon

    Sidon Well-Known Member

    United States
    God bless you into more of the revelation if His Grace.
    Keep your heart established in God's eternal forgiveness. Rest in this Place of Rest, that is found by only IN believing that God's own shed Blood is the reason you are His.
    Stay in that mind.
    See, when you stay there, you rest from "im trying to be accepted", which cuts off Christ's power to keep you empowered to live that holy life..

    Our power, our victory is only found when we stop trying to do, what only Christ can do in us and for us and through us.

    Its when we REST in God's Grace, we find our VICTORY over the world the flesh and devil.

    Our Victory is GOD's power, in us, being released as our VICTORY.
    WE can't do this, and when we try, we fall....everytime.
    We only "STAND" when we put on the whole armor, and that armor is GOD's GRACE and not our self effort.
  9. biblelesson

    biblelesson Member

    United States
    Thanks for the encouragement! When I went to bed last night, I notice my thoughts and how I lacked the ability to stay focused on Jesus, although when I simply let go, I felt peace. When I woke up this morning, once again, my mind was flooded with thoughts of trying to figure out what's going on in my life. However, I'm glad to read these posts because I'm encouraged.

    And, meditation does help; I need to commit more time.
  10. Sidon

    Sidon Well-Known Member

    United States
    The blood of God, which is Jesus on the Cross, is a "one time eternal sacrifice" for all your sin.
    This blood of God, has been applied to you., and you are born again.
    This means that God's blood is your safe keeping.
    It will never let you go, and it will always make you as righteous as The Righteousness of God Himself, who supplied it.
    How can it not?
    Rest in God's Grace, and find your POWER as the Joy of the Lord as your Strength.

    The NT teaches us that this Grace of God is "new every morning".
    And that is to understand every morning that we wake up, that we are in the Arms of God, kept righteous by the Blood of Jesus, and this can never fail us.
    What a GOD.
    What a SAVIOR.
    What a "GIFT of Salvation".
  11. biblelesson

    biblelesson Member

    United States
    Thank you!