Submission in marriage

[frogs]

Hi all,
Just wondering if I can please get advice on what a woman's submission in marriage should look like?
I'm having problems with my partner. We have only been together less than a year.
He wants to direct everything, I mean everything I do down to what I eat, how I spend my time, where I go and how long I can be gone for, who I speak with, when and how, how we spend all of our money, and bigger decisions such as whether I work or study, where we should live, absolutely everything. And he won't let me really have any say or input..I am expected to just say yes and obey, because 'thats obedience to God through obedience to my husband.'
I feel like this is like being like a robot and I am losing any sense of self. I feel it's too codependent as he wants me constantly by his side. He doesn't work and doesn't want me to at the moment. He says he makes all decisions with my protection in mind (as he was a refuge for me from and organised abuse situation - he doesn't trust my judgement of others to keep myself safe, and says he is putting a lot of boundaries around me to prevent me being abused again). But it feels over bearing and I wonder if it's abuse sometimes, especially when he shouts and swears at me. Can I please get perspectives on a balanced view of submission in marriage, I am having real trouble finding balanced views on this topic anywhere. Thanks

 

[trophy33]

Protection must not be worse than the thing it protects from. Thats a basic principle and its ignorance leads to various kinds of dictatorship.

Shouting and swearing is not a proper marriage leadership, marriage is not an army drill.

 

[trophy33]

Also, if he wants you to be a stay-at-home wife, he must provide enough for you to have a comfortable living.

If he does not work and his finances are problematic, its a failure on his side and his demand that you should not work either is hardly acceptable.

 

[frogs]

He is also saying that because I won't obey everything he commands without question, I'm in witchcraft and rebellion, and jezebel and church of Laodicea. And that I should obey him over and above my own conscience.

 

[trophy33]

He is also saying that because I won't obey everything he commands without question, I'm in witchcraft and rebellion, and jezebel and church of Laodicea. And that I should obey him over and above my own conscience.

It seems that he is a religious fanatic. I would personally recommend a separation till he matures into a more wise man who is able to lead both of you in a healthy and balanced way into your common prosperity, not into imprisonment, anxiety and slavery.

I do not know all the details and his side of the story, of course, so take my recommendation as based just on some internet info.

 

[Lost Witness]

religious fanatic.

Disagree with this,
The best way to deal with this is with prayer.
Seek the LORD'S guidance.


May The LORD Bless You and Keep You



Shalom Aleichem

 

[trophy33]

Disagree with this,
The best way to deal with this is with prayer.
Seek the LORD'S guidance.


May The LORD Bless You and Keep You



Shalom Aleichem

Prayer does not exclude actions.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Hi all,
Just wondering if I can please get advice on what a woman's submission in marriage should look like?
I'm having problems with my partner. We have only been together less than a year.
He wants to direct everything, I mean everything I do down to what I eat, how I spend my time, where I go and how long I can be gone for, who I speak with, when and how, how we spend all of our money, and bigger decisions such as whether I work or study, where we should live, absolutely everything. And he won't let me really have any say or input..I am expected to just say yes and obey, because 'thats obedience to God through obedience to my husband.'
I feel like this is like being like a robot and I am losing any sense of self. I feel it's too codependent as he wants me constantly by his side. He doesn't work and doesn't want me to at the moment. He says he makes all decisions with my protection in mind (as he was a refuge for me from and organised abuse situation - he doesn't trust my judgement of others to keep myself safe, and says he is putting a lot of boundaries around me to prevent me being abused again). But it feels over bearing and I wonder if it's abuse sometimes, especially when he shouts and swears at me. Can I please get perspectives on a balanced view of submission in marriage, I am having real trouble finding balanced views on this topic anywhere. Thanks

Just so you know, your description is that of a dysfunctional relationship.

My ex-husband was the same right after we got married and it didn't take long for that to devolve into severe physical abuse on top of the psychological.

If I was out and he decided I was 5 minutes too long getting home (one time in particular I remember there was a turtle crossing the road and traffic on both sides of the road stopped until it passed, which caused a small delay in my return) he would beat me. And that was only if he allowed me to leave by myself.. not a regular occurrence.

If his meal wasn't absolutely perfect - and he decided on what I was going to cook every day, I was not trusted to create the menu in our home - and perfect meant perfect seasoning and every single element of the dish taken off the stove at the exact same time so nothing was too cool when it was presented, and cooked to perfection. If it wasn't perfect - more challenging than working for Gordon Ramsay - he would throw his plate at my head at best, which was usually followed by a beating and then I'd have to start over and try again.

If I didn't have perfect lines in the carpet after vacuuming I would be beaten, if the vacuum made a mark on our white baseboards I would be beaten.

But ALL of it began exactly the same way as what you're currently describing. An obsessive and controlling man.

It seemed that the more he got away with doing the worse it became until I feared for my life and the lives of my children. I left the marriage fully disabled (physical disability) from the abuse.

Every single warning sign is in your marriage and it's screaming at you to RUN before it's too late.

All the above occurred before I was saved and now that I'm saved I'm remarried to a Christian man, and the difference is night and day.

Our Christian marriages are supposed to be a reflection of God's love for us - and the first rule is one of freedom. Now that we are saved, we are FREE in Christ.

A man who controls every aspect of your life has made you a slave... Not honoring you as a free born Christian woman.

My Christian husband guides me gently if I need, talks to me when there's an issue and doesn't worry about the little things in life, because they aren't life altering. He just loves me, and his every action shows it clearly.

There can't be two chiefs in a relationship, someone has to have an overriding voice when there is two separate opinions on a topic (topics like what car to buy etc) and God has given this voice to the husband, but that should never mean that your thoughts and ideas are ignored either. You should be allowed to do you to whatever extent is possible within the relationship itself.

You need help, professional help at this point.

If I were you I would separate - because it's the ONLY way he will potentially allow this - and get counseling. You need counseling for yourself, on top of marriage counseling.

Your aim is to use everything in the arsenal, including legal, to put the marriage on a healthy track - but it may not be possible, people like that don't usually change though with God anything is possible.

Don't fear leaving even if you don't know how you'll make it. Call a women's shelter for victims of abuse if you need.. they will help you get out if you can't return to your parents house. You need counseling... You need help to navigate the situation your in, in the hopes of making it better.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I am losing any sense of self.

This is a red flag. His controlling obsession will only get worse. He has a very deep insecurity and you have to make a choice on whether to continue the relationship or not. As to your question about submission, this is most definitely NOT what it looks like. I'll pray for your quick resolution. Blessings.

Welcome to CF.

 

[sandman]

Please take heed to Hazelelponi post #8

I have counseled several women over the years in this type of situation … It doesn’t get better, you cannot change him, it is absolutely NOT Biblical, and you are not at in any way responsible for what he is doing.

Loosing your sense of self …is his objective. Right now you still have some of that …but it will rapidly diminish if you remain in this relationship as it is.

Every woman in this situation thinks she can change him, and it will get better. Sometimes they blame themselves or the alcohol, or drugs, or his parents or PTSD … the list goes on…. but there is no excuse …it’s wrong, it’s unhealthy and I have never seen it get better …only worse ….and sadly much worse.

I am not going to tell you what to do …. But without action it will get worse.

**I will post the biblical aspect to submission shortly (with this caveat) do not bring this up to him if you are still in the same house …it will only anger him. (This is for your understanding)....#12

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Hi all,
Just wondering if I can please get advice on what a woman's submission in marriage should look like?
I'm having problems with my partner. We have only been together less than a year.
He wants to direct everything, I mean everything I do down to what I eat, how I spend my time, where I go and how long I can be gone for, who I speak with, when and how, how we spend all of our money, and bigger decisions such as whether I work or study, where we should live, absolutely everything. And he won't let me really have any say or input..I am expected to just say yes and obey, because 'thats obedience to God through obedience to my husband.'
I feel like this is like being like a robot and I am losing any sense of self. I feel it's too codependent as he wants me constantly by his side. He doesn't work and doesn't want me to at the moment. He says he makes all decisions with my protection in mind (as he was a refuge for me from and organised abuse situation - he doesn't trust my judgement of others to keep myself safe, and says he is putting a lot of boundaries around me to prevent me being abused again). But it feels over bearing and I wonder if it's abuse sometimes, especially when he shouts and swears at me. Can I please get perspectives on a balanced view of submission in marriage, I am having real trouble finding balanced views on this topic anywhere. Thanks

When I find a "balanced" view of submission, I'll let you know. In the meantime, my wife has requested that I unload the dishwasher yet again, so I must be off to do my duty ...

But here's a passing thought as I go to do my chore: from one man to another, you can tell your husband for me that I think he needs to get his act together!

 

[sandman]

Submission is – loving obedience by proper arrangement and deliberate decision.

Deliberate decision is the decision you make by your own choice based on the proper arrangement which is the arrangement or agreement between you and your mate based on the Word of God which is Loving obedience.

Loving obedience is not control, not fear motivated or in any way subservient. It is loving obedience of the Word of God, within the confines of the Word, and by the standards of the Truth.

Submission is viewed through the lens of the Word ….not through a maniacal natural lens sculpted from the world.


Eph 5:21 Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God Christ. ← (should read Christ according to all critical Greek text)

Context determines the meaning of fear (being afraid ….or reverence & respect) in this verse it is the reverence and respect of God (His Word) that we submit to one and other.

Eph 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. (submit yourselves .. is omitted in a few critical Greek text and early manuscripts, although it is implied in the previous verse.)

Eph 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church → (ekklēsia – the called out, body of Christ) and He is the saviour of the body.

The husband is the head “EVEN AS” Christ is the head of the called-out believers. Christ does not control or manipulate…. He lovingly encourages and guides ….that is the → even as


Eph 5:24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

their own omitted in most critical Greek text

Wives to be lovingly encouraged and guided by the husband’s in everything (based in the love of God)

We in the church are subject to Christ by loving obedience, Christ is the head we are the body.

Husbands alert

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

This is the standard that should reflect how men should love their wives. Christ, (who was the epitome of the love of God) poured Himself out, emptied himself of all that He was for the church.... and willfully gave himself up to the agonizing death for us.


Eph 5:26 That He might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

This is a comparison of a husband setting his wife apart from the common lot.... set apart from all other women.

The washing or bathing of water is referring to the Word of God. The comparison here between cleansing by washing in water, and cleansing by of God. The church is cleansed by bathing in the Word of God (Jhn 15:3)

Eph 5:27 That He might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

not having spot, or wrinkle… is an orientalism (I will try to condense it) Oriental women pride themselves on their calm, composed demeaner since they believe their worried look betrays a lack of trust in God. (Eastern biblical culture) i.e. v 27 That their faith will have been so great they will have no wrinkle from lack of trust in God (Job 16:1-8 is a wrinkle refence)

without blemish = without visible defects internally or externally.

~These comparisons between Christ and the church equate to husband with the wife~

Eph 5:28 So ought men …. to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

Love is the agapaō love. The love of God in the renewed mind in manifestation “As Christ love the church”….. Our love towards the woman of God should be a mirror reflection of Christ.


Eph 5:29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Christ, the church:

You cannot hate yourself and love others….. And that is a big key…People will always try to bring you down to their level through disparagement and denervation. ….(it’s control).


Eph 5:30 For we are members of His body, of his flesh, and of his bones. ← not in text

Eph 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

One flesh is not bonded with distrust, anger, control, suspicion, or manipulation. One flesh is bonded in and with the love of God.
The only true submission has to be centered in the Word with Christ being our example.

 

[Blade]

Well I don't know your background but for me that would not be a marriage.

"what a woman's submission in marriage should look like?" if its based on Christ .. well how does Christ love the Church? And love never thinks of self first. To me sounds more of just someone that wants to control you. So with me and my wife its not what she does or does not do.. its what do I do. I am not her God nor her master.

 

[eleos1954]

Hi all,
Just wondering if I can please get advice on what a woman's submission in marriage should look like?
I'm having problems with my partner. We have only been together less than a year.
He wants to direct everything, I mean everything I do down to what I eat, how I spend my time, where I go and how long I can be gone for, who I speak with, when and how, how we spend all of our money, and bigger decisions such as whether I work or study, where we should live, absolutely everything. And he won't let me really have any say or input..I am expected to just say yes and obey, because 'thats obedience to God through obedience to my husband.'
I feel like this is like being like a robot and I am losing any sense of self. I feel it's too codependent as he wants me constantly by his side. He doesn't work and doesn't want me to at the moment. He says he makes all decisions with my protection in mind (as he was a refuge for me from and organised abuse situation - he doesn't trust my judgement of others to keep myself safe, and says he is putting a lot of boundaries around me to prevent me being abused again). But it feels over bearing and I wonder if it's abuse sometimes, especially when he shouts and swears at me. Can I please get perspectives on a balanced view of submission in marriage, I am having real trouble finding balanced views on this topic anywhere. Thanks

Neither are to be "door mats" to the other ..... both are to be obedient to Christ ... shouting and swearing is definitely not Christ-like ... and if that's going on .... it is abuse .... verbal abuse ... we are to love one another .... what does that look like?

1 Corinthians 13:4–8 Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.

Revisit love and put it into practice .... both of you.