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Struggling with this odd situation.

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My Christian Brothers and Sisters.

This is not easy for me to write about. I've been struggling with this for quite some time and I come to you for advice, understanding and help. I'll try to be as concise as possible to not make this a wall of text.

I've been married for five, almost six years. I have a lovely wife and we have two beautiful children together. The only thing lacking in our relationship is the intimacy, which died down to be pretty much non-existent since the birth of our second child nearly two years ago.

I've spoken with my wife quite a few times about it, careful not to be pushy or bring it up too often. Mainly, I just wanted to have a conversation and understand where she was coming from and if the fault was with me. She explained that she lost her drive for intimacy after our children were born and she's in "mom mode" now and has zero interest in the intimate side of things. Despite this, I tried taking her out for date nights and asking my parents to watch the children so we had some time alone together. Again, I wasn't pushy and was just hoping it would spark something but no dice.

I should say right here that my wife is Japanese and not a Christian (though I've been working on that!). We met and married before I got serious about being a Christian myself and attending church each week. I feel it's important to bring up her nationality because the difference in cultures and beliefs comes into play here.

Anyway, after having conversations with her about our lack of intimacy, she told me that she understands men and women are biologically wired differently and there are certain "needs" men innately have and she's ok if I "buy a girl" (as she puts it) to satisfy those needs. As crazy as this sounds, this is typical in Japanese culture. Something I learned after two years of teaching English to a lot of housewives in Japan who would complain to be about their husbands spending to much money on prostitutes.

While she's correct that as a man I do feel certain urges or have certain needs, what she's suggesting may temporarily satisfy those things but it doesn't fill the void of intimacy with the person you love and married. Nevertheless, she's almost encouraging me to do it, worried that if I don't, I may end up starting a relationship with someone else (which I most assuredly wouldn't for a variety of reasons.

But honestly, I don't know what to do. I won't lie and say I'm not tempted to. I imagine a lot of men in my position would be thrilled to get such permission from their wives. But as a Christian who struggles everyday to live by the word of God (and admittingly failing horribly) I feel that it's wrong even with her permission.

Lust is a sin. I understand that. But lust is powerful and in our present culture, it's pervasive and nearly impossible to ignore and resist, especially for someone like me with a high sex drive. The lack of sex is, honestly, driving me a little crazy. On its face, this would be cheating, but is it cheating if it's permitted and encouraged? Does that even matter?

I risk blathering at this point but I welcome your thoughts on this and see if anyone else has been in a similar position and how they resolved it.

Thanks.
 

2PhiloVoid

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Wow! ok.

That's a lot to deal with, Heart. I'm sorry you are having to slog through this and several issues all at once.

I'm not a counselor, so I'm not going to pretend to be. I also don't like to produce walls of texts of supposed "answers" that can't really help.

In keeping this short and to the point, I'm just going ask you: Is your wife able and willing to see a family doctor (or gynecologist) in order to have a physical exam? It might be wise to first rule out that some sort of physical stressors or damage was done by having children. I would assume the doctors who delivered your children at the hospital would have already known about any stressors your wife experienced during delivery. But it might be good to have her get checked anyway.

Also, is your wife perhaps afraid to get pregnant again and has become avoidant? If so, you might want to both see a family marriage counselor together and talk about birth control (if you haven't already done so).

With that, I'm done. Again, I'm not going to attempt to play the counselor, but I'll say some prayers for you and your wife. Hopefully, she'll eventually enliven to your times of intimacy again.

Peace!
 
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bèlla

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The marriage bed is sacred and the covenant was established between you and God. It cannot be violated. Even when an unbelieving spouse gives permission or neglects her marital duties. Nor can you hire a concubine to fill the role. The sin will fall on you even if she encouraged it. Because you know better and that's your guideline.

There is enough biblical evidence to communicate the challenges associated with third parties. It never goes well. Your wife may be Japanese but she's living in a culture that would swiftly malign you for agreeing and insist you took advantage of her challenges to meet your needs.

That may not be the case but women will oppose you and the fallout could be bad. Do not be deceived. We do not share. Cultural conditioning notwithstanding the heart knows the truth. Multi-partnered connections are typically done at the behest of men or initiated by them instead. While she may comply she wrestles within herself and the reality is painful. I have never known anyone who didn't suffer who walked that road and I've known my share.

Pursue the appropriate measures for resolution. A physician, therapy, prayer and support group. If you follow her suggestion you are guilty of infidelity. What appears reasonable in a difficult state may be horrifying when healing occurs.

Could she forgive the trespass later on? Could you forgive yourself? I hear Genesis on the wind.

But the LORD God called to Adam, and said to him, “Where are you?”

Then to Adam the LORD God said, “Because you have listened [attentively] to the voice of your wife, and have eaten [fruit] from the tree about which I commanded you, saying, ‘You shall not eat of it’; The ground is [now] under a curse because of you; In sorrow and toil you shall eat [the fruit] of it All the days of your life
.

You have an opportunity to do what he didn't. Stay the course and let the Lord resolve it.

~bella
 
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Appreciate the responses, especially so quickly. I know, this situation is a mess but I feel fortunate to have you good people give me advice.

I did ask my wife on several occasions if it was had anything to do with pain or discomfort from giving birth. She said no and that it's just a lack of interest. She says she "feels like a mom" and "not sexy." And, as I've mentioned earlier, I tried to get her to overcome that by taking her out on date nights and scheduling some time alone just for us. But when I say intimacy died down, I don't mean just specifically sex. Unfortunately, all the cuddling, hugging, random kisses etc. have also fell to the wayside. I'm not the most hug/cuddle type person in the world but her resistance to any sort of affection is leaving me feeling broken, unworthy and just plain defeated even though she's assuring me it has nothing to do with me.

At your advice, I'm going to encourage her to see a physician. Therapy if needed. I've also been trying to get her to come to church with me. I take our oldest son (5) and she stays home with our youngest (2) but I've been telling her I'd like the whole family to go. She's expressed some openness to it but she's also really shy, especially when it comes to new people and situations.

I do truly appreciate all of your input.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Appreciate the responses, especially so quickly. I know, this situation is a mess but I feel fortunate to have you good people give me advice.

I did ask my wife on several occasions if it was had anything to do with pain or discomfort from giving birth. She said no and that it's just a lack of interest. She says she "feels like a mom" and "not sexy." And, as I've mentioned earlier, I tried to get her to overcome that by taking her out on date nights and scheduling some time alone just for us. But when I say intimacy died down, I don't mean just specifically sex. Unfortunately, all the cuddling, hugging, random kisses etc. have also fell to the wayside. I'm not the most hug/cuddle type person in the world but her resistance to any sort of affection is leaving me feeling broken, unworthy and just plain defeated even though she's assuring me it has nothing to do with me.

At your advice, I'm going to encourage her to see a physician. Therapy if needed. I've also been trying to get her to come to church with me. I take our oldest son (5) and she stays home with our youngest (2) but I've been telling her I'd like the whole family to go. She's expressed some openness to it but she's also really shy, especially when it comes to new people and situations.

I do truly appreciate all of your input.

I hope it works out for you in due time. Try to get her (preferably with both of you together) to a professional marriage counselor. It could be too that your wife is suffering from some form of depression that needs to be addressed. And like @bèlla is saying above, you need to get through this somehow without caving into the 'world's alternatives.' I know that's difficult, but try your best to get yourselves into the right place with the right form of help.
 
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John G.

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I'm very sorry for your situation.
From what I understand, Japan is pretty much bottom of the globe as far as sexual relations go (pretty much an asexual society) but under no circumstances give in to temptation! The guilt is not worth it!
Press on with your efforts to witness and evangelise your wife. Once she accepts the Lord, I am sure He will speak to her heart.
 
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marycherry3

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Do the things you did when you first started dating. Whatever that was, going out for a meal, going for a walk in the park etc. Talk to each other and make time to be together. Once you start having fun together again everything else will just fall into place naturally. Its easy to get busy with life but sometimes its the small things that make all the difference.
 
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ozso

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I've heard men talk about this before. I remember one guy telling me it was like he and his wife were just room mates now. The only close mutual bond between them was being mom and dad to their kids. I'm mentioning this because a marriage counselor is probably very familiar with this phenomenon. There's probably a clinical term for it.
 
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KevinT

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My Christian Brothers and Sisters.

But honestly, I don't know what to do. I won't lie and say I'm not tempted to. I imagine a lot of men in my position would be thrilled to get such permission from their wives.
I will give you five good reasons to not hook up with a prostitute: Herpes, cancer-causing HPV, syphilis, gonorrhea, and HIV.

Don’t do it.

Having said that, I agree with others that you both need to meet with a marriage counselor.

Best wishes
KT
 
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Jo555

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My friend wrote a piece on intimacy once and gave me permission to share.

Thought it may help some. Here it is:

We have been created by God with a deep need for intimacy. He is a deeply intimate and relational God and He has created us with the same need.



What is intimacy? Intimacy is defined as an inner closeness and depth of relationship; complete mutual awareness and unhindered access of interpersonal issues, information and interests. The first deception concerning intimacy is that a relationship or marriage will automatically be intimate. All of us should be comforted to know that no relationship has automatic intimacy. The second major deception concerning intimacy is that sex produces intimacy. If that were true, prostitutes and other sexually active people would be the most fulfilled people on the earth. However, that isn’t the case. Even though sex is a wonderful expression of intimacy, the act of sex doesn’t constitute intimacy.



A simple definition of intimacy is "to be close and/or deep." An intimate marriage or relationship is a relationship of emotional and spiritual closeness that goes much deeper than the average friendship or family bond. Because intimacy requires the deepest levels of personal exposure and vulnerability, it can only occur successfully and over a long period of time, where certain elements are present. Genesis 2:24-25 gives us God’s plan for marriage, which is the pattern for intimacy:



"Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed." -KJV

intimacy.317145052_std.jpg



Intimacy is sharing an attitude of openness and surrender. Intimacy is impossible unless sharing occurs on the deepest levels. More important than anything else is the sharing of our hearts through open and honest communication.




In addition, we must also have meaningful time together regularly, as well as share experiences, friends, etc. An intimate life is a shared life. Lack of intimacy develops in an atmosphere of separateness and selfishness. On the other hand, intimacy occurs when we surrender our individual selves to the common good of our marriage or relationship. This is the way we fall in love, and it’s one of the secrets to staying in love.



A relationship of mutual support and encouragement. Couples who are intimate don’t compete with each other; they compliment each other. An intimate couple’s partnership begins with a strong and regular expression of commitment, an atmosphere of regular, positive exchange.



We bond with the source that meets our needs. When we are being fed and fulfilled by our spouses or loved one, we want to be with them. Not only that, but the act of nourishing and cherishing each other bonds our spirits together. This is one of the reasons a child bonds in such a profound way to his or her parents. Whoever meets our needs will have our hearts. Also, wherever we invest the treasure of our lives is where our hearts will be. It is important that we aggressively meet each other’s needs on a daily basis. As we do this, we increase the intimate bond of our relationship. When we stop, we starve the soul of our marriages and we embitter our spouses or loved one.




Another key element is trust, an environment of safety and security. True intimacy requires sharing the depths of one’s soul as well as giving of one’s life daily. This is only possible in an atmosphere of safety and security. To the degree that we create an atmosphere of trust is to the same degree we can open our hearts to one another. Trust is built through consistency, careful speech, kindness and humility.



Trust is destroyed through arrogance, careless words, harshness and sin. When trust has been broken, it can only be rebuilt when the offender takes responsibility for his or her behavior and begins to consistently display a sincere heart.



I also recently saw an article that a study found the secret to a long marriage (and relationship) is communication. New research now finds it’s also the key to a long life! To be free to express feelings other than be resentful that the person could not express feelings.



The worse thing to do is keep it in, not talk about the problem, and be continuously angry. Also, the best way is to listen, don’t interrupt, HEAR the other person, and likewise. You talk back and forth. Use imagination, resolve the problem and come to some agreement that is workable.



Yes, I believe in communication, true, honest communication. This helps lead to true intimacy, which can make all the difference in true commitment. Yes, I think Jacob knew what intimacy and commitment were all about. This story about his commitment is found
Genesis 29:1-35
 
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Diamond72

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The only thing lacking in our relationship is the intimacy
There is a book about The ART of Intimacy written by Manis Friedman. Porn is the worlds substitute for the Intimacy that God has for us in a marriage. You need to educate yourself first and then you can educate your wife as to what God's plan is for marriage. Rabbi Friedman was a marriage councilor for many years. He has video on YouTube also if you want to listen to some of that.

As we all know marriage between a husband and wife is to be an example of marriage between Jesus and His bride the church.
1726910054649.png
 
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Bob Crowley

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As a member of a Vincentian Conference, another chap and I were doing a visit to a couple who had been divorced but had moved back together for financial reasons. He had a disability and she was very sick. I know she has since died.

After we departed and were outside, I made a comment that I believed their relationship was platonic and they were telling the truth. She was too sick for any intimacy.

With a sardonic look on his face, my Vinnies mate joked "Marriage gets to the stage where it's platonic anyway!"

Anyone who has been married knows very well that (to quote a workmate from long ago) "The novelty of sex wears off pretty quickly".

If I were the OP I'd just hang in there and keep on keeping on. It may be discouraging, but the chances are that she'll "come around" sooner or later. Bear in mind the honeymoon days are over, and the carnal garbage Hollywood pumps out needs to be ignored.

Turn it over to God and leave it in His hands. I think the semi-celibate stage most marriages reach at some stage is part of God's training in patience.
 
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bèlla

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I don't believe the semi-celibate stage some marriages experience is the norm. Nor should the notion be normalized in christian circles. It's clearly unbiblical. The periods devoid of physical intimacy are to be agreed upon barring injury or circumstances. A woman's refusal to lie with her spouse can occur for many reasons. Including the possibility the OPs dilemma is hinting at that needs to be discussed.

Women are prepared for marriage by their parents. Although the culture places the primacy upon the mother this situation demonstrates the problem with that position. A man's interpretation of a wife's duties won't mirror a woman's and both are needed. The man will address the physical in a depth a woman may never broach. It's important for wives to understand the significance of that need and what he experiences when it goes unmet.

It is more culturally acceptable for a woman to forgo relations than for a man to deny her affection. The former is weaponized and frequently demonstrated on the screen and the latter's taint remains unchanged. To be unaffectionate is unforgivable for most.

The exaltation of the child in deference to the spouse and upsetting of the order has been ignored. Many women declare unapologetically that the child comes first. Which is a reflection of her ignorance and societal influences. His position doesn't change when the child is conceived. They prioritize its care for a time but the order remains.

That's why it's important for women to nurture their femininity and embrace their essence. When they don't imbalances occur and something fills that space. A woman who's settled within herself exhibits the delight we see in The Song of Solomon. That place can't be satisfied by a child or friend. It seeks the masculine and that's the norm. When that isn't the case there's usually a wound impeding its expression.

It's important for believers to forge connections with couples who have healthy happy marriages and both qualities are required. You can't get that from a book or a screen. You need to see it up close. Don't settle for existence in your unions. You need kinsmen who know how to fight (and have fought) for something substantial.

The majority settled but you must determine your end and once you do you'll draw your complement. And those are the ones you listen to.

~bella
 
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Diamond72

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"The novelty of sex wears off pretty quickly".
Now what we read in our Bible. What wears off is the porn that we see on the internet. Thanks to the liberal supreme court that exposes our children to porn. People do not know what it means to be intimate.

  1. illicit sexual intercourse
    1. adultery, fornication, homosexuality, lesbianism, intercourse with animals etc.
    2. sexual intercourse with close relatives; Lev. 18
    3. sexual intercourse with a divorced man or woman; Mk. 10:11-12
  2. metaph. the worship of idols
    1. of the defilement of idolatry, as incurred by eating the sacrifices offered to idols

This is why in the world they go from person to person and never find what they are looking for.
 
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com7fy8

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The only thing lacking in our relationship is the intimacy,
my wife is Japanese and not a Christian
Intimacy can include marital sharing. But marital sharing can be only you being intimate with the pleasure feelings you produce inside yourself . . . not really deep intimacy of love with the other person.

And if she is not a Christian, she is not living in God's love which alone can have us intimate with one another. I mean deep spiritual intimacy.

If we have intimacy in God's love, this is in sharing with God and even with other children of God, all through the Holy Spirit. So, this can be at any time, and I offer that the intimacy of love is deeper and more sweet and beautifully wonderful than any amount of physical sex and its pleasures in us.

Because God values our loving as family with all our brothers and sisters. And His love works with this intimacy more than just physical intimacy.

"Because Your lovingkindness is better than life,
. My lips shall praise You." (Psalms 63:3)

Whoever wrote this experienced how God's love is better than sex, and more deep in intimacy. There is "unconditional satisfaction" in God's love which satisfies us to love any and all people, while also being able to be dearly deep and intimate with other children of God.

So, seek God first and how He is able to develop and mature you in His love and His family way of relating.

And in case she does not want something > I understand that God does not have us pushing and forcing and pressuring anyone to do what the person is not ready to do. And you have said, it seems, that you have gone easy on this matter. Except for one thing . . . repeatedly . . . getting back to the same subject . . . this could be you being a little sneaky to push her.

So . . . my experience is that God's love is very nicely quiet and emotionally kind and perfectly satisfying, and lusts for pleasure can be quite noisy and pushy, and very convincing so humans confuse lust with "sexual need"!!

So, may God use you to win her to Jesus, with your example >

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5 :3)
 
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John G.

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Don't know what "marriage councelors" can do for you as your situation is fairly common in Japan.
Your wife needs to be saved, to acquire a new "culture" outside what she's known, to become a new creation.
Then, you can pray together, read scripture together (e.g. 1 Cor. 7:4-5) and God will speak to her heart.

PS. How did you come to be married to an unbeliever?
 
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Paul4JC

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My Christian Brothers and Sisters.

This is not easy for me to write about. I've been struggling with this for quite some time and I come to you for advice, understanding and help. I'll try to be as concise as possible to not make this a wall of text.

I've been married for five, almost six years. I have a lovely wife and we have two beautiful children together. The only thing lacking in our relationship is the intimacy, which died down to be pretty much non-existent since the birth of our second child nearly two years ago.

I've spoken with my wife quite a few times about it, careful not to be pushy or bring it up too often. Mainly, I just wanted to have a conversation and understand where she was coming from and if the fault was with me. She explained that she lost her drive for intimacy after our children were born and she's in "mom mode" now and has zero interest in the intimate side of things. Despite this, I tried taking her out for date nights and asking my parents to watch the children so we had some time alone together. Again, I wasn't pushy and was just hoping it would spark something but no dice.

I should say right here that my wife is Japanese and not a Christian (though I've been working on that!). We met and married before I got serious about being a Christian myself and attending church each week. I feel it's important to bring up her nationality because the difference in cultures and beliefs comes into play here.

Anyway, after having conversations with her about our lack of intimacy, she told me that she understands men and women are biologically wired differently and there are certain "needs" men innately have and she's ok if I "buy a girl" (as she puts it) to satisfy those needs. As crazy as this sounds, this is typical in Japanese culture. Something I learned after two years of teaching English to a lot of housewives in Japan who would complain to be about their husbands spending to much money on prostitutes.

While she's correct that as a man I do feel certain urges or have certain needs, what she's suggesting may temporarily satisfy those things but it doesn't fill the void of intimacy with the person you love and married. Nevertheless, she's almost encouraging me to do it, worried that if I don't, I may end up starting a relationship with someone else (which I most assuredly wouldn't for a variety of reasons.

But honestly, I don't know what to do. I won't lie and say I'm not tempted to. I imagine a lot of men in my position would be thrilled to get such permission from their wives. But as a Christian who struggles everyday to live by the word of God (and admittingly failing horribly) I feel that it's wrong even with her permission.

Lust is a sin. I understand that. But lust is powerful and in our present culture, it's pervasive and nearly impossible to ignore and resist, especially for someone like me with a high sex drive. The lack of sex is, honestly, driving me a little crazy. On its face, this would be cheating, but is it cheating if it's permitted and encouraged? Does that even matter?

I risk blathering at this point but I welcome your thoughts on this and see if anyone else has been in a similar position and how they resolved it.

Thanks.
Praying for you brother.
 
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Jo555

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I would also recommend "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus".

He also wrote, "Mars and Venus on a Date".

Both are by John Grey, possibly spelled.Gray.

It dives into the differences in the sexes there. I got a lot out of the dating book. I was one of those rare Venetians he speaks about that lived on Mars-independent, and more-and made a lot of sense of my challenges in dating.

That wasn't all it. As a Christian i dated mostly secular men in my younger days, which did not pair well morally, but nonetheless the book helped because i realized that men love to do things for women and get value out of it and a sense of purpose.

Not all, but i saw the truth in that. In today's society that seems to be diminishing, but I'm sure there is still truth in that

If your wife's issue is more of a cultural thing not sure how much it will help. I will say though that overall i feel the things that turn men on are not the same as the things that turn women on and i do believe you would benefit from both books.

Just some additional advice to throw in the pot.
 
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Jo555

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Here is another one that might interest you. It is called the 5 languages of love. I'm not much into online ebooks, but it's free. I read it a long time ago and from what I recall it was pretty good. From what I remember the premise was basically that some actions speak more love to us than others and everybody can be different in that regard.

Of course as Christians we all need to be united in him and get all that value from him, but it helps us to understand that each of us are in different places and have different needs and some of those needs are uniquely ours in how much due to our Creator's design.

My love language is loyalty. Not much speaks of one's love to me as loyalty does, but I'm aware that things like this varies with everyone.

The book:
 
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Mark Quayle

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My Christian Brothers and Sisters.

This is not easy for me to write about. I've been struggling with this for quite some time and I come to you for advice, understanding and help. I'll try to be as concise as possible to not make this a wall of text.

I've been married for five, almost six years. I have a lovely wife and we have two beautiful children together. The only thing lacking in our relationship is the intimacy, which died down to be pretty much non-existent since the birth of our second child nearly two years ago.

I've spoken with my wife quite a few times about it, careful not to be pushy or bring it up too often. Mainly, I just wanted to have a conversation and understand where she was coming from and if the fault was with me. She explained that she lost her drive for intimacy after our children were born and she's in "mom mode" now and has zero interest in the intimate side of things. Despite this, I tried taking her out for date nights and asking my parents to watch the children so we had some time alone together. Again, I wasn't pushy and was just hoping it would spark something but no dice.

I should say right here that my wife is Japanese and not a Christian (though I've been working on that!). We met and married before I got serious about being a Christian myself and attending church each week. I feel it's important to bring up her nationality because the difference in cultures and beliefs comes into play here.

Anyway, after having conversations with her about our lack of intimacy, she told me that she understands men and women are biologically wired differently and there are certain "needs" men innately have and she's ok if I "buy a girl" (as she puts it) to satisfy those needs. As crazy as this sounds, this is typical in Japanese culture. Something I learned after two years of teaching English to a lot of housewives in Japan who would complain to be about their husbands spending to much money on prostitutes.

While she's correct that as a man I do feel certain urges or have certain needs, what she's suggesting may temporarily satisfy those things but it doesn't fill the void of intimacy with the person you love and married. Nevertheless, she's almost encouraging me to do it, worried that if I don't, I may end up starting a relationship with someone else (which I most assuredly wouldn't for a variety of reasons.

But honestly, I don't know what to do. I won't lie and say I'm not tempted to. I imagine a lot of men in my position would be thrilled to get such permission from their wives. But as a Christian who struggles everyday to live by the word of God (and admittingly failing horribly) I feel that it's wrong even with her permission.

Lust is a sin. I understand that. But lust is powerful and in our present culture, it's pervasive and nearly impossible to ignore and resist, especially for someone like me with a high sex drive. The lack of sex is, honestly, driving me a little crazy. On its face, this would be cheating, but is it cheating if it's permitted and encouraged? Does that even matter?

I risk blathering at this point but I welcome your thoughts on this and see if anyone else has been in a similar position and how they resolved it.

Thanks.
I can't speak from a woman's point-of-view, but sometimes the spouse's personality ruins the bed for them. My advice to you is to not push the issue, suffer for the Lord's sake if that is your lot, and try to stay pure. My guess is, frankly, that she expected something from you, or for you to become something you are not. Not saying it is your fault —it's like the saying goes, "He marries her, hoping she won't change. She marries him expecting he will change. She does, he doesn't."

My advice is to pour your passions out before the Lord. Pursue the Bible itself, hours at a time, if possible, for wisdom. And don't expect any relief, and you may just get it, eventually. When God gives you the desires of your heart, they can be far beyond what you had prayed for (and different!), but you may have to go through a lot of pain and correction to get there. This life, your problems, are not about you, but about Christ.
 
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