Icedragon,
How much of the SOP have you actually read? As you were reading it did any part of it jump out at you which caused you to have huge mental red flags telling you that the author was bogus?
When and why did you reject EG White and please give me some solid reasons why you decided to do that.
God Bless you,
Jim
JIM sorry it took so long to write this out. Here is the answer to your question.
I have all of what she wrote, conflict of the ages, thought from the mount of blessing, MOH, the testimonies. I have read the majority of the many complations, thousands of thousands of pages. I have actually sold egw books door to door. I have been a big supporter of EGW up until last year. I was raised SDA and have library's of her books. You name the book I've probally read part or all of it. So I am familure with her writings. I can quote paragraphs by memory.
As far as EGW's prophetic ministery I don't buy it. Was she a christian yes. I don't doubt her sincerity. I don't think you can attribute her work to the devil. but that does not mean she was a prophet either. I do think that she had some biological and neurological issues that expalin the visions. ibelieve that she sincerly thought she was a special messenger and so did everyone else around her. I do think there is value in her work but just not divine authoritiy. I would take her in the same way I would take other authors. For example the author of "My Utmost for His Highest" Chambers or AW Tozer "In Pursuit of Holiness" I have sensed the Holy spirit in there work as well, but that does not make them prophets. Jim have you ever sensed the H.S. in other christian writings that were not prophets??
As far as how I came to my my non-acceptance of her as a prophet. I will detail it here.
The following is a list of some of books and articles I read
1. AT Jones by G. Knight
b. Jones testimony
2. Kellogg by Schwarz,
b. The "Living Temple" by kellogg
c. Kelloggs testiomony and response to the critics of Living Temple.
3. WW. Prescott by G. Valientine
4. Canwright Secteary by Johnson
5. Joseph Bates by Knight
6. James White by Wheeler
7. Canwrighs Testimony
8. The development of the Advent christian chruch a doctral dissertation
9. "kingdom of the cults" by Walter Martin
b. Adventist world.
10. Slected studies, from the D&R study comitte
11. Daniel from the D&R Study comittee
13 . many of the whiteestate responses. some good some bad.
14. The Spring and Fall feast by Bachiocchi
As to the specific issues
1. the shut door statements
2. 1856 bible conference where they voted out the gospel
3. the kellogg hoax
4. Prescotts, Waggoner, Canwright, Ballanger, Conradi's issue with Daniel 8:14
5. The abundance of visionaries in the millerite movement. we just happen to get the right one.
6. the 1000 year bounding of satan on the "earth" instead of the "abyss" in Rev 20
7. The "chicago bulding" visions.
8. 1888 RBF about face done by egw
9. Just the abuse given to Canwright after he left. Not a good wittness.
10. the lack of biblic support for the sda chruch being the "remnant" chruch. the remnant is refering to morality not an orginization
11. The lack of support in the sanctruary typology for the investigative judgement.
12 The inconsitancy in interpating the spring and fall feasts.
13. The health visions. just happened to visit a major health center prior to her vision and was preached to for years by Joseph Bates who was a health reformer. Her vision happen to correspond with the helath beliefs and writings of her time.
Details :
Last May I statrted on a reading program to understand SDA history better. I took SDA history in College but the teacher was just terrible. I learned nothing new from him paid $1200 dollars for a $20 books. So I decided to do something about it. I started reading plan I read all sda material. I did not set out to find fault with EGW. I just stumbled upon it.
Issues discoverd
AT jones the RBF champion left the chruch over Ellen's prophetic ministry. so did his buddy E.J. Waggoner although he was also indicted in the Panthism scare. You can read A.T jones testimony online. It is interesting. The 1888 controversy is talked about very much in the in this book and they admit the issue was EGW in Knights book and valientines books. They aslo admit that in 1856 the pioneers had the issue right.
Kellogg left over a power struggle, the accuasations of panthisim was just some one making an excuse to get rid of him. I read his book "The Living Temple" it is not there LT is a book on hyigene not panthisim. I went and read it at UNION College they have 2 copies one with the "panthisem passages" the other "edited" pages, this tells you exactly where the problem is located. I compared them and then the DR's testimomony at Q & A session with the Elders before being disfelloshipped and there was not panthism. The whole panthism charge was made up to try to discredit the DR. and gain control of the financial resources that he had. The DR basicly controlled all the shots when at battle creek even EGW had to ask permission and she did not like that.
W.W. Prescott was a very brilliant man he was president of 5 different colleges and founded 2 of them. He was also a great Theologian versed in languages. He started to look into Daniel 8:14 and came to the same conclusion as the heritics, but he did not leave the chruch he just kept his mouth shut, until after his employment was up then he talked and they burried his conclusion for alomst 40 years. Also mentioned in the book was the fact that he was at the 1888 conference. He remember U. Smith having a problem with EGW. In 1888 the problem was that people rememberd EGW as taking the exact opposite postion in 1856 and endorsing with a heaven sent vision a different postion, when the subject came up 32 years earlier.
Canwright - The poor man. The most maligned man in SDA history. He was treated poorly. I read Canwright's Secetary and Then I read Canwright's Testimony and I found out that He was not the devil he was made out to be. When you compare"Canwright Secetery" with Canwright's Testimony you see a world of difference between them. CS is full of misrepresentations and canwrights Testimony is full of facts. I challange you to compare the two. He had doubhts from the age of 24 to the 41 when he left. he quit the professional minstery numerous times, but was lied about by the denomination as to why. He never left the faith until finally left the church. Canwright knew James white and Ellen and personally wittnessed behind the secens activity at their house I found most of his explinations to be very consisant with what we know about them from history. Canwright was James Whites right hand man when he was in good with the Whites and the devil if he disagreed. Character traits that were considered Good while working for the denomination and the Whites, were abruptly called flaws the moment he left. They exploited those flaws made them bigger. After reading the canwrights sectary I decided to purchase my first Non SDA book.
Walter Martin "kingdom of the Cults" I read the 100 pages on the SDA chruch and was suprised how fair he was with us. I was expecting some one who lied about the Sda church, but i did not find that. He was very balance in his treatement about us and his conclusion was that you can be a christian and and SDA, but i just don't get the werid Ideas about the investigative judgement and that prophet. At the same time I read the article in the October issue of "Adventist World" about Hiram edson. I compared it with what walter martin said and found they were reporting things differently. The SDA chruch was softening things to make look better them it really was, That was the trurning point, they had been for years softing the reality of the Great Disappointment. I have since read new material that shows that that the millerites suffered extremely hard after the G.D, persecution and ridiclue, tourture and in somecases death. this is important because the development of the sanctuary came out of this enviroment. they were trying to explain why Jesus had not come they needed something to save face. When Edson had the vision it was in a cornfield? ever wonder why? He was trying to escape the taunts and the mocking gazes of the skeptics. A lot of humiliation and pressuer people were desprate.
When I got done with those I relized I had accidentily read most of the heritics and trouble makers of Adventism and they all had one thing in common "The Whites" and certian theological passages.
I then truned my attention to the first generation and the pioneers. I read the books on joseph bates and James white
Joseph Bates "The REAL founder of Seventh-day Adventistm" is not far from the truth. Most of the doctrines were held by him before the foundation of the SDA chruch, the lifestyle issues too. Infact, I cannot find one doctrine that that was not held by him before everyone else. Seventh-day Adventism should be called "Bateism". Bates was a prominate Millerite Leader of the Sabbatarian shut door movement. He wrote a book about a year and a half before EGW had her "planet vision" EGW had time to learn what Bates liked and taylor her message to him in order to gain influence. James White would eventually wrest power from him over the shut door issue and the 1851 failure of Christ to return at the end of the tarrying time, which EGW had endorse while in vision. Bates devloped the purpose of the of the Sabbatarian movement that was to call out Gods people from babylon, the other chruches. Bates is also respoinsible for the Sunday Law. http://www.ellenwhite.org/nsl/egw22a.htm good article. The Origins of the Sunday Law are based in the main line chruches rejecting the False interpation of Miller and then the Millerites rejectecting the Shut door Movement. I suggest reading the article above. it is amazing.
I then read "James White; innovater and overcomer" The first line of the book was not a ringing endorsement for White, quoting U.smith at J.W's furenal, he was a man with may friends and many enemies. It backs up what canwright said. He was also accused about financial misdealings and it plagued him most of his life. He also had a way lashing out at people and making demands on people that were not chrisitan. All consitient with Canwright.
I then ran accross a disseration on the fromation of the Advent christian Chruch another denomination that was formed from the Millerite movemet. It was intresting for the information that they give on what happened to the Millerites after the great disappointment. The Millerites fractured into many groups of which the SDA came out of, we actually came out of the smallest fracture and the most fanatical one. They were rejected by the main body. the had to come up for the reason for there existence The sunday law issue was invented. This was intersting for the informations about the shut door movement. They give a pretty lengthy explination of the shut door movement. It was then that I learnd that from 1844-1851 those in the movement still believed jesus was going to come and that the door of salvation was shut to sinners, all were lost except those who had accepted millers work, so they did not even bother to do evenglism. I compared this with the EGW statments on the shut door and found that she had endorsed in vision that the door of mercy had been shut and then later denied that she had done so. That Is a HUGH problem. That is a failed prophecy That is when I knew the jig was up as far as her being a prophet.
