ST. John Calvin

[Benedicta00]

As for the UN-"St" Martin, his exegesis was injured by his failure to understand some key concepts of Christianity. Why he falied to understand them is a matter of dbate, but many believe it is because he suffered from a bipolar diorder that affected how he saw reality. Bipolar's, and obsessive compulsives claim him as one of their own. This can be verified by a quick google search.

I find it to be the only rational explanation for the stark contradictions and contrasts his life represented.

.

Either that or maybe he just wasn't elected??

 

[Benedicta00]

LOL! You sure do seem to enjoy telling people to look into American history and rattling off nonsensical conspiracy theories about Protestants banding together for no other purpose than to bring down the leader of your denomination. Get over yourself. Your leader just isn't that important in the scheme of my life. I trust in God. I have neither the time, nor the inclination, to despise your pope. In fact, I know very little about him, other than that he is German. Not sure why they always assume a different name but, pomp and circumstance has always been a part of the workings of your denomination. Nonetheless, the only problem I have with your church is that they purport unbiblical tripe and call it the truth. Other than that, Michelle, they mean quite little to me, though that is no small thing.

What I say is true, it's a fact. The puritans came here to get away from what they called organized religion and the English monarchy. They were Calvinist in their theology and their tolerance was only for themselves. They persecuted and discriminated against other Christian faiths that weren't theirs. They did not want them here. They were trying to create what they called the pure Christan faith, this is where the name "puritan" came from. By the grace of God, they didn't last long but other various groups similar in belief popped up. It's all the same, it's Calvinism. They all just go by different names.

But like with everything else, we have to ask, on who's authority did they speak? Especially when they called the pope, the son of Satan? As a Calvinist, do you really stand behind that statement?

 

[simonthezealot]

Especially when they called the pope, the son of Satan? As a Calvinist, do you really stand behind that statement?

Why do you ask?
What would it matter to you, if someone felt that way?
Just curious!

 

[lionroar0]

What I say is true, it's a fact. The puritans came here to get away from what they called organized religion and the English monarchy. They were Calvinist in their theology and their tolerance was only for themselves. They persecuted and discriminated against other Christian faiths that weren't theirs. They did not want them here. They were trying to create what they called the pure Christan faith, this is where the name "puritan" came from. By the grace of God, they didn't last long but other various groups similar in belief popped up. It's all the same, it's Calvinism. They all just go by different names

That's right their current form or evolution in modern terms are congregationalist. Although the Puritams did not last long their effect can still be felt today. Speically in the way that of rules and laws of the our US society. IN the way that they are interpreted either black or white. Where there is no room for humanity

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

Says who? You whom think you can examine and judge who belongs to Christ? They were used mightly of God. They were indeed men of the faith just as Paul and Peter were.. It is not up to any denomination to recognize the saints.. Jesus said we shall know them.. By what? Their fruits. Not if they went to confession on a daily basis or partook of the Eucachrist. We can see in the scripture what the fruit of the Holy Spirit is.. We do not need men of any type to recongize and examine them..God does that Himself..

Let's see Martin Luther instigated a war and was an anti-semite.

Calvin pretty much rules Geneva with an Iron fist.

These are just some of their fruits.

We can see in the scripture what the fruit of the Holy Spirit is.. We do not need men of any type to recongize and examine them..God does that Himself..

St Paul and St Peter were Apostles chosen by Christ.

They performed miracles and are part of the Gospel.

Those other men were not apostles and are not part of the Gospel.

Real tough here (sarcasm)

And since we shall know them by their fruits and men do no need to recognize them then why the comparison?

That's nonsence.

The whole idea of comparisons is to recognize something.

You post is self contradictory.

1st you state that men do not need to recognize them.

2nd then you recognize them as men of faith by comparing them to the Apostles.

nonsence.

Peace

 

[Imperiuz]

Predestination is ridicolus and completely unbiblical. Why don't you heretics make a new prayer?: He** and God bless daz grozz saint Fhûrer Adolf Hitler, truly ein Mahn of Güd!

 

[lionroar0]

I think it's Saints envy. We got them they don't

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

LOL! You sure do seem to enjoy telling people to look into American history and rattling off nonsensical conspiracy theories about Protestants banding together for no other purpose than to bring down the leader of your denomination. Get over yourself. Your leader just isn't that important in the scheme of my life. I trust in God. I have neither the time, nor the inclination, to despise your pope. In fact, I know very little about him, other than that he is German. Not sure why they always assume a different name but, pomp and circumstance has always been a part of the workings of your denomination. Nonetheless, the only problem I have with your church is that they purport unbiblical tripe and call it the truth. Other than that, Michelle, they mean quite little to me, though that is no small thing.

Actullay she is correct and it is not nonsence. People were being told tha the CC had great big tunnels under the Atlactic ocean, with a great big Catholic Army just poised to lauch an all out attack on the US. It was just was just waiting for the Pope to snap his little bitty fingers.

Also Catholic were not allowed to own land.

There were many anti-catholic laws that had been passed.

Just about 50yrs ago the KKK had hanged Catholic nuns and priests. Not so long.

The US has a history of being anti-catholic

Peace

 

[mont974x4]

Predestination is ridicolus and completely unbiblical. Why don't you heretics make a new prayer?: He** and God bless daz grozz saint Fhûrer Adolf Hitler, truly ein Mahn of Güd!

easy there my friend. Check the rules and see if you want to edit that.

 

[Benedicta00]

easy there my friend. Check the rules and see if you want to edit that.

how is it against the rules? it isn't any worse than what is said about the popes day in and day out around here.

 

[Benedicta00]

Actullay she is correct and it is not nonsence. People were being told tha the CC had great big tunnels under the Atlactic ocean, with a great big Catholic Army just poised to lauch an all out attack on the US. It was just was just waiting for the Pope to snap his little bitty fingers.

Also Catholic were not allowed to own land.

There were many anti-catholic laws that had been passed.

Just about 50yrs ago the KKK had hanged Catholic nuns and priests. Not so long.

The US has a history of being anti-catholic

Peace

And right now Catholic politicians are the only politicians who have to ensure the public that their faith won't interfere with their ability to serve in office. Catholics are still very much discriminated against.

 

[Benedicta00]

That's right their current form or evolution in modern terms are congregationalist. Although the Puritams did not last long their effect can still be felt today. Speically in the way that of rules and laws of the our US society. IN the way that they are interpreted either black or white. Where there is no room for humanity

Peace

And we don't have to even mention Salem, do we? That was pitiful. They persecuted and executed children even all due to the error they believed was truth. The law and the justice system at that time was all based on Calvinist theology which history reveals now is grave error.

This is why truth is vital, because if we believe error it can lead to really bad things. See Islam, see the Zionist movement, both Jewish and Evangelical. Error leads us into war.

 

[Benedicta00]

Show me where the RCC ideal on this is found in Scripture.

As soon as you show me where your ideal is at in scripture... that the bible teaches us that every last teaching and nuance of our faith is only contained with in the pages of scripture...

Well...? can you show me that? No... you can't, so I'm going to have to dismiss this demand because it has literally no basis in revealed truth from God what so ever.

 

[Benedicta00]

Here Mont, here is the scripture that supports our ideal, that holy ppl are called Saint and holiness is revealed in love as well as faith, not hate like the way Luther and Calvin taught ppl to hate the Catholic Church. faith alone is not enough... you must have works, ie LOVE.

Here is the scripture that shows us that what we will be still remains to be seen because we all have to "work out" our salvation.

John teaches us that if we have hope for ourselves in Christ, that will sanctify us, we will be holy as God is holy.

He says what we are now is not yet revealed to us now, it is reveal to us when we are in heaven, (face to face) not in the here and now like the way you all mistakenly think.

We have zero evidence that Calvin or Luther is in heaven. We can hope they are but we can not say that they are because A) they did not show any of the fruits that John says a true holy person will have. And B) We have no documented miracles from them showing us they are with God face to face.

1 John 3
1 Behold what manner of charity the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called, and should be the sons of God. Therefore the world knoweth not us, because it knew not him.

2 Dearly beloved, we are now the sons of God; and it hath not yet appeared what we shall be. We know, that, when he shall appear, we shall be like to him: because we shall see him as he is.

3 And every one that hath this hope in him, sanctifieth himself, as he also is holy.

4 Whosoever committeth sin commmitteth also iniquity; and sin is iniquity.

5 And you know that he appeared to take away our sins, and in him there is no sin.

6 Whosoever abideth in him, sinneth not; and whosoever sinneth, hath not seen him, nor known him.

7 Little children, let no man deceive you. He that doth justice is just, even as he is just.

8 He that commmitteth sin is of the devil: for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose, the Son of God appeared, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

9 Whosoever is born of God, commmitteth not sin: for his seed abideth in him, and he can not sin, because he is born of God.

10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil. Whosoever is not just, is not of God, nor he that loveth not his brother.

11 For this is the declaration, which you have heard from the beginning, that you should love one another.

12 Not as Cain, who was of the wicked one, and killed his brother. And wherefore did he kill him? Because his own works were wicked: and his brother's just.

13 Wonder not, brethren, if the world hate you.

14 We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not, abideth in death.

15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer. And you know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in himself.

16 In this we have known the charity of God, because he hath laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
17 He that hath the substance of this world, and shall see his brother in need, and shall shut up his bowels from him: how doth the charity of God abide in him?

18 My little children, let us not love in word, nor in tongue, but in deed, and in truth.

19 In this we know that we are of the truth: and in his sight shall persuade our hearts.

20 For if our heart reprehend us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

21Dearly beloved, if our heart do not reprehend us, we have confidence towards God:

22 And whatsoever we shall ask, we shall receive of him: because we keep his commandments, and do those things which are pleasing in his sight.

23 And this is his commandment, that we should believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ: and love one another, as he hath given commandment unto us.

24 And he that keepeth his commandments, abideth in him, and he in him. And in this we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

 

[Rick Otto]

Here Mont, here is the scripture that supports our ideal, that holy ppl are called Saint and holiness is revealed in love as well as faith, not hate like the way Luther and Calvin taught ppl to hate the Catholic Church. faith alone is not enough... you must have works, ie LOVE.

And here I thought it was the immolations hosted by the Inquisitors that taught Prots to prefer freedom!
Sure, burning witches was a paranoid delusion, but...
burning Christians was a labor of love?

 

[jckstraw72]

the Inquisitions werent too rosy, but nevertheless, they are blown way out of proportion. in my american religion class we talked about this and the prof siad less than one hundred ppl i believe were killed.

 

[simonthezealot]

Here is the scripture that shows us that what we will be still remains to be seen because we all have to "work out" our salvation.

Just curious whether you've thought about the fact that it says work OUT your salvation, as opposed to work ON your salvation?
You know like working OUT a diamond in a mine you own!

 

[simonthezealot]

A) they did not show any of the fruits that John says a true holy person will have..

Lets discuss this, I am not sure where John speaks of fruits, I know that Galatian 5:22 talks of fruits of the spirit and among those is faithfulness, these men were faithful to the Lord at the threat and/or cost of life and limb.

 

[Benedicta00]

much of what ppl are willing to believe about the inquisition is a myth http://www.catholicleague.org/research/blacklegend.htm

 

[IamAdopted]

much of what ppl are willing to believe about the inquisition is a myth http://www.catholicleague.org/research/blacklegend.htm

Sure it is.. That is why it is taught in the schools. It is a part of history. You may want to try and explain it all away and believe it did not happen but the fact is that it did.. These men stood true to Christ and the written scriptures until there deaths.. Just as Paul and Peter and the other Apostles did..Truth is found in the scriptures for Jesus said continue in my word and ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.. He also said that men shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God. Then we also see that ALL scripture is inspired by God.. Quite telling where truth is found.. We see King David and what He said about Gods word.. I have hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against you he said. Then we see in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God and the word became flesh and dwelt among us.. So with the whole counsel of the written scriptures we can have truth. It is when men want to take over the authority of the written scriptures that we see what we have seen even when Christ walked the earth. Tradition trying to trump the written word of God and men walking in error.. Then because someone brings truth those who hold on the the power of the tradition want them out of the way one way or another.. The even Crucified Christ.. God Himself because He preached against the tradtion and spoke Gods truth..