Spiritual Physics

truthpls

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1: a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions
Definition of PHYSICS
The miracles of Jesus and other miracles in the bible and human experience demonstrate that there are different laws in existence than the ones science is familiar with.

Walking on water
Producing massive amounts of food from a small amount
Raising the dead
Healing blindness
Healing the deaf
Healing all types of diseases instantly
Turning water into wine
Walking through walls
Being teleported to another place instantly
commanding animal life and having them obey
Knowing precisely what would happen in both the near and far future

-To name some miracles

The interactions with matter and energy qualify these to be physics related

Not only physics related but related to the physical

This thread is to discuss spiritual physics
 
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its all perception .... time and the process of our soul being one and the same ... knowledge being a comparison of two opposites ... you can not have one without the other ... a beginning and an end being two points of reference needed for measurement and this measurement our perception we measure ourselves by ... Jesus was not bound between these two pillars whilst he walked the earth ...
 
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Bobber

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1: a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions
Definition of PHYSICS
The miracles of Jesus and other miracles in the bible and human experience demonstrate that there are different laws in existence than the ones science is familiar with.

Walking on water
Producing massive amounts of food from a small amount
Raising the dead
Healing blindness
Healing the deaf
Healing all types of diseases instantly
Turning water into wine
Walking through walls
Being teleported to another place instantly
commanding animal life and having them obey
Knowing precisely what would happen in both the near and far future

-To name some miracles

The interactions with matter and energy qualify these to be physics related

Not only physics related but related to the physical

This thread is to discuss spiritual physics
I have thought about this for years. From a pulpit its just good to stay in the mode of God releases his power and this or that occurs.

So what is the power which does miracles. Different words can be used. The Bible say this a lot when Jesus released his GLORY (turning the water to wine) the disciples believed on him. Glory is the power, might, divine energy power it manifest itself we could say atomic power.....although I'd never say atomic power in church .....but God did not create all things out of nothing. Science says a way you can define physical things is that it's a form of energy. Everything is energy.
 
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Petros2015

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Bob Crowley

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The spiritual world and our physical world exist cheek by jowl at all times. Spiritual beings can "see" us, but we can't see them. Obviously there is a barrier of some sort between the two of us, a bit like a two way mirror.

For what it's worth I think the barrier is space-time.

Sometimes during demonic deliverance sessions, the patients levitate, which is against the laws of physics. Early on in my Christian walk, I was copping some spiritual harassment. Amongst other things I visited a couple of people who had experience in that area, and they both told me that they had seen "patients" levitating up around the ceiling.

At Fatima in 1917, it had been raining for hours. Yet suddenly the ground and the clothes of those present were dry. I can't find it right now but I believe the energy required to vaporise all that water would have been around that of a 10 megaton nuclear explosion.

But there was no trace of any such energy being applied. Had it been, the crowd and everything around them would have disappeared in a fireball. God just removed the water by some sort of supernatural sleight of hand but I have no idea how He did so.

But then what is matter? A bunch of quantum wave functions?

I've often claimed that the night my father died he appeared in my room. We talked and argued and at the end he gave this blood curdling scream and then just disappeared.

But we were talking. As far as I could make out he was "talking", "seeing", "hearing" and "thinking".

Yet his body was lying dead in a flat miles away and wouldn't be found for another four days as it happened when one of my uncles turned up to tell me he was dead. So what was he talking, hearing, seeing and thinking with? He had no voice organs, no hearing pathway, no working eyes, and no brain.

Was I hearing literal sound waves or was the communication "spiritual" in some way? I don't know. It seemed "normal" if you can call talking to a dead person "normal".

As a final comment I think we'll learn to teleport based on quantum entanglement. Supposedly it's impossible, but modern technology has a way of moving past barriers in a way that most of us wouldn't even dream about. US physicist and engineer Dr. Robert Goddard got liquid fuelled rockets to ascend around the height of a power pole in 1926, 97 years ago.


He and his team launched 34 rockets[3] between 1926 and 1941, achieving altitudes as high as 2.6 km (1.6 mi) and speeds as fast as 885 km/h (550 mph).[3]
By 1944 V2's were travelling 320 kilometres. Twenty five years later Apollo 11 landed on the moon, and returned safely. Voyagers 1 and 2 effectively entered interstellar space between 2012 and 2018. All based on liquid fuelled rockets.

I wonder where we'll be in another 97 years if quantum entanglement experiments continue? But I also believe we'll learn to teleport material items long before we can move any living creature as I believe (I know) we have a soul or spirit which won't be so easily quantised.

Eventually I think we'll learn how to get around that too, which means we'll need to have at least a toehold in "spiritual physics" by that time.

I expect to see material teleportation in my lifetime, but i won't see living creatures teleported.

I'll have a very different point of view by then. Hopefully I'll be among the "great cloud of witnesses" with a ringside seat, passing around the celestial popcorn as we amuse ourselves watching the latest shenanigans of the human race.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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1: a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions
Definition of PHYSICS
The miracles of Jesus and other miracles in the bible and human experience demonstrate that there are different laws in existence than the ones science is familiar with.

Walking on water
Producing massive amounts of food from a small amount
Raising the dead
Healing blindness
Healing the deaf
Healing all types of diseases instantly
Turning water into wine
Walking through walls
Being teleported to another place instantly
commanding animal life and having them obey
Knowing precisely what would happen in both the near and far future

-To name some miracles

The interactions with matter and energy qualify these to be physics related

Not only physics related but related to the physical

This thread is to discuss spiritual physics
I find the nomenclature "spiritual physics" an oxymoron. The spiritual world goes beyond the physical so physics cannot explain miraculous events, basically breaking the "laws of nature". I don't believe God intended miracles to be "part" of this physical realm. He intended , through miracles, to give proof of the Kingdom of God that is not of this world. Once we try to prove miracles through physics we begin to blur the lines. IMHO!
Blessings
 
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Tinker Grey

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I find the nomenclature "spiritual physics" an oxymoron. The spiritual world goes beyond the physical so physics cannot explain miraculous events, basically breaking the "laws of nature". I don't believe God intended miracles to be "part" of this physical realm. He intended , through miracles, to give proof of the Kingdom of God that is not of this world. Once we try to prove miracles through physics we begin to blur the lines. IMHO!
Blessings
And therefore this is the wrong sub-forum for that topic.
 
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Bobber

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The spiritual world and our physical world exist cheek by jowl at all times. Spiritual beings can "see" us, but we can't see them. Obviously there is a barrier of some sort between the two of us, a bit like a two way mirror.

For what it's worth I think the barrier is space-time.
Perhaps you can explain that more fully?
At Fatima in 1917, it had been raining for hours. Yet suddenly the ground and the clothes of those present were dry. I can't find it right now but I believe the energy required to vaporise all that water would have been around that of a 10 megaton nuclear explosion.
It raises the question though can the reports of Fatima be considered valid or people merely exaggerating in their wild imagination certain things have happened.

But there was no trace of any such energy being applied. Had it been, the crowd and everything around them would have disappeared in a fireball. God just removed the water by some sort of supernatural sleight of hand but I have no idea how He did so.
You're arguing your points here Bob that this truly without any doubt took place in a very real sense. I believe there's testimonies of people that were there who were asked about this and didn't have a clue what some of these people were talking about. For the threads sake were probably best to refer to miracles recorded in the Bible. Fatima would make an interesting thread though where people can talk about the yeas and nays.
I've often claimed that the night my father died he appeared in my room. We talked and argued and at the end he gave this blood curdling scream and then just disappeared.
You might want to consider it wasn't your father but a familiar spirit. My grandfather in the 1950s , a farmer in rural areas, seemed to always know when farmer Joe or another farmer would die....he'd walk out into the kitchen and say so an so died last night. They appeared at my bedside and he'd have that happen many, many times. Phone calls would confirm it later. But such doesn't mean it was THAT person. Familiar spirit can take on a spiritual form of a persons looks .....Scripture speaks of no such things about spirits of humans after death merely walking around visiting places.
Yet his body was lying dead in a flat miles away and wouldn't be found for another four days as it happened when one of my uncles turned up to tell me he was dead. So what was he talking, hearing, seeing and thinking with? He had no voice organs, no hearing pathway, no working eyes, and no brain.
And as I"ve suggested this wasn't truly your relative.....but having said that.....upon death ones spirit does leave their body.....that doesn't mean your spirit doesn't have it's body appearance . Angels carry spirits from place to place in order to do that they must be substantial in the spirit. People that have died and came back have said they're looking at the hospital bed at this something that looks like them. But they still have hands, feet, arms the whole bit.
Was I hearing literal sound waves or was the communication "spiritual" in some way? I don't know.
You had a spiritual experience. Other's in the room with you would not have heard anything. Similar to Paul seeing the Lord on the road to Damascus. Other's around Paul saw a light but didn't hear anything Paul heard though Jesus speak to him.
I wonder where we'll be in another 97 years if quantum entanglement experiments continue? But I also believe we'll learn to teleport material items long before we can move any living creature as I believe (I know) we have a soul or spirit which won't be so easily quantised.
Well I'd suggest men some day upon God's timing will be able to jump from star to star, galaxy to galaxy in mere seconds. The natural mind brain rebels at this saying no way.....physicals things have mass and can't break beyond light speed. They've never stopped to consider that when the spiritual comes more into preeminence than the physical all this you can't go past light speed is set aside. Men can't see out of the box for they put forth the physical materialist part of MAN as the number 1 primary thing that he is. Fact is its really not. I think the spirit realm really laughs at men's ignorance. They see things like Star Trek Warp 10....going REALLY FAST......nope...that still merely crawling. (more could be said)
 
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truthpls

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I have thought about this for years. From a pulpit its just good to stay in the mode of God releases his power and this or that occurs.

So what is the power which does miracles. Different words can be used. The Bible say this a lot when Jesus released his GLORY (turning the water to wine) the disciples believed on him. Glory is the power, might, divine energy power it manifest itself we could say atomic power.....although I'd never say atomic power in church .....but God did not create all things out of nothing. Science says a way you can define physical things is that it's a form of energy. Everything is energy.
So our physical laws work in unison with some other laws that we are not aware of. Some spiritual and physical mix happens when God orders it. In the case of Elijah, he ordered it and God arranged it was carried out. The same is true for the apostles and others. Come to think of it Jesus spoke and all things came to exist. For angels and people in spiritual form after they die, and in heaven, another set of rules apply. So it looks like when miracles happen on earth, there is some sort of fusion between the rule sets that change things here.
 
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truthpls

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its all perception .... time and the process of our soul being one and the same ... knowledge being a comparison of two opposites ... you can not have one without the other ... a beginning and an end being two points of reference needed for measurement and this measurement our perception we measure ourselves by ... Jesus was not bound between these two pillars whilst he walked the earth ...
I don't think it is perception at all but reality. Reality that exists regardless of how anyone perceives things.
 
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truthpls

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I find the nomenclature "spiritual physics" an oxymoron.
Not contradictory in this case though. Harmonious. No conflict, but a working together of what we know and what exists here with something else that either does not usually exist here or is separate and beyond our ability to detect.
The spiritual world goes beyond the physical so physics cannot explain miraculous events, basically breaking the "laws of nature".
Physics alone cannot explain miracles when physics is limited to what man knows. When the invisible laws are applied to or added to the physical laws man is able to see, then the result is that there is more at work than just what we can detect and what we are aware exists.
I don't believe God intended miracles to be "part" of this physical realm.
Hard to say what He intended. However since miracles are a part of life here, and always have been, and will be in the last several years of tribulation according to bible prophesy, God must intend for the ability to add the spiritual to this physical as needed. So we might say it is part of the physical world, but only a part time, occasional part in this present time.
He intended , through miracles, to give proof of the Kingdom of God that is not of this world.
Well, also that He is near and answers and can do all things and that nothing is impossible for Him. Even affecting this physical world and set of rules.
Once we try to prove miracles through physics we begin to blur the lines. IMHO!
Blessings
One could never prove miracles using only the visible and physical rules we know about. That is because miracles involve more. One cannot 'prove' what one does not know anything about, using only what one does know about.
 
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Bobber

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So our physical laws work in unison with some other laws that we are not aware of. Some spiritual and physical mix happens when God orders it. In the case of Elijah, he ordered it and God arranged it was carried out. The same is true for the apostles and others. Come to think of it Jesus spoke and all things came to exist. For angels and people in spiritual form after they die, and in heaven, another set of rules apply. So it looks like when miracles happen on earth, there is some sort of fusion between the rule sets that change things here.
Yes perhaps. Maybe we don't really need to know the mechanics of it all. We just release our faith in God and know that he's working.

eg I don't have a clue how the internal part of a computer work.....don't need to know I just know to hit this button, that button or this.....God takes care of all the other. He just wants me to stay in simplicity and don't become complexed .
 
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truthpls

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Yes perhaps. Maybe we don't really need to know the mechanics of it all. We just release our faith in God and know that he's working.
Right, nor can we know if we wanted probably. However it is nice to know more than the laws we know do exist
eg I don't have a clue how the internal part of a computer work.....don't need to know I just know to hit this button, that button or this.....God takes care of all the other. He just wants me to stay in simplicity and don't become complexed .
Right, but knowing that there is more at work is essential. Physics tells us our bodies will rot in the ground and be eaten by worms eventually. With more at work than just the physics we know, what actually happens to believers is that they will be raised up into the air and receive eternal bodies. Bodies that are spiritual as well as physical, like Jesus has. It goes almost without saying that once we have a body yhat is physical as well as spiritual combined, that the laws of physics alone will not dictate what we can do or limit us in any way. Jesus had that kind of body. He was not a ghost (purely spiritual) or purely just physical. He waked through walls. He ate food. He hugged. He made a fire. Etc

It is also good to know God is not limited by physics and that much more exists. It is also good to be able to deal with scoffers who, for example mock Jesus walking on water as impossible. Etc
 
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Bobber

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Right, nor can we know if we wanted probably. However it is nice to know more than the laws we know do exist

It goes almost without saying that once we have a body yhat is physical as well as spiritual combined, that the laws of physics alone will not dictate what we can do or limit us in any way.
Right and if only worldly folks would consider this and study it out I think you'd see a lot less being obstinate against God as they would recognize by gosh I don't want to miss out on this! The potential of what this means can stagger the mind (in a good way) Only those who are counted worthy to have this though will receive it.
 
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truthpls

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Right and if only worldly folks would consider this and study it out I think you'd see a lot less being obstinate against God as they would recognize by gosh I don't want to miss out on this! The potential of what this means can stagger the mind (in a good way) Only those who are counted worthy to have this though will receive it.
Right. Amazing. I think, though, that many people who are not believers in the world do know that there are forces at work beyond all that we are familiar with. Most people actually.
 
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I don't think it is perception at all but reality. Reality that exists regardless of how anyone perceives things.

the perception our five senses afford us is not the truth of who we are, and therefore our souls measurement of reality is subjective ...
 
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Bob Crowley

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For what it's worth I think the barrier is space-time. -
Perhaps you can explain that more fully?

It boils down to personal experience. Way back in my pre-Christian atheist life I was about to do something very immoral. To my surprise someone appeared who looked pretty much like me (guardian angel?) and I went down like a pole axed bull.

But I had this sense of something being pulled aside like a curtain as he appeared, and I put it down as "space-time". I can't say much more but that was personal experience just as much as my father turning up the night he died. Take it or leave it - it's my opinion and that's all. I can't prove it.

It raises the question though can the reports of Fatima be considered valid or people merely exaggerating in their wild imagination certain things have happened.

In summary, 70,000 people including reporters from all the principal daily newspapers in Lisbon, Portugal, saw the sun dance three times.

Reference: Fatima: Did 70,000 people witness a miracle?

However, the sun reversed course and, retracing its zigzagging course, returned to its normal place in the heavens. All of this transpired in approximately ten minutes. After realizing they were not doomed, the crowd began ecstatically laughing, crying, shouting and weeping. Many discovered their previously drenched clothing to be perfectly dry.



You can either believe the testimony of many people who were there, or the skeptics who weren't there. Take your pick. In addition they were staring at the sun for ten minutes and yet there were apparently no reports of eye damage. There should have been reports of sun induced damage all over the place. That was the third miracle.

You're arguing your points here Bob that this truly without any doubt took place in a very real sense. I believe there's testimonies of people that were there who were asked about this and didn't have a clue what some of these people were talking about. For the threads sake were probably best to refer to miracles recorded in the Bible. Fatima would make an interesting thread though where people can talk about the yeas and nays.

You might want to consider it wasn't your father but a familiar spirit. My grandfather in the 1950s , a farmer in rural areas, seemed to always know when farmer Joe or another farmer would die....he'd walk out into the kitchen and say so an so died last night. They appeared at my bedside and he'd have that happen many, many times. Phone calls would confirm it later. But such doesn't mean it was THAT person. Familiar spirit can take on a spiritual form of a persons looks .....Scripture speaks of no such things about spirits of humans after death merely walking around visiting places.

I'm quite sure it was him. For one thing he said I needed to forgive him (for his lifelong cruelty) or I would destroy myself. He also added it wasn't for his benefit - "it's too late for me" he said. "All I was expected to do was to look after my own family and I didn't even do that. It's for you!"

Do you think a demon is going to tell you to forgive them, ot that you're at risk of destroying yourself if you don't?

Then there were some predictions. I'll only give one of a personal rather than political nature. He said "I served the devil. You do too, but you'll become a Christian" (I was an atheist at the time and not living a particularly good life). Shortly afterwards he said "You'll meet a pastor. You'll think he's great but all he'll do is to discourage you even more!" (than he had himself).

I met the pastor nearly four years later when I became Christian. About nine years after that and not long before I left his church (I was getting married and moving away while he had cancer and died about four months later) he apologised to me with the words "... I owe you an apology... You needed encouragement, but all I've done is to discourage you even more!" I pointed out he'd just quoted my deceased father back to me almost word for word.

He blurted out "You really did see your father that night!" I've seen several people about the episode and I'm quite convinced it was him. The primary purpose of God sending him was to apologise, as he opened the exchange with "I've wrecked your life. I've completely destroyed your confidence". He had a few things to apologise for, I can assure you.

It was later in the conversation that he said I needed to forgive him, and he was adamant about it, almost desperate.

I'm well aware of familiar spirits, but I also think we modern Christians are a bit too afraid of the spiritual world. It exists and that is all there is to it.

As the same pastor said to me once when talking about a chap who had a deliverance ministry and who could be a bit over the top sometimes - "Some of these people who get involved in those sorts of ministries start seeing a demon under every rock and behind every tree!"

It was him, and going by the departing scream, I haven't got much doubt he was heading for Hell, or more accurately Hell was coming for him. It was obvious something was approaching him, and it terrified him to the core.

End of story.
 
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The miracles of Jesus and other miracles in the bible and human experience demonstrate that there are different laws in existence than the ones science is familiar with.
This has not been demonstrated. The miracles have not been demonstrated to have happened.

The claims of the Bible are unsubstantiated.
 
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