• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Speaking in tongues

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
39,595
29,158
Pacific Northwest
✟815,588.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
So I figured I might as well find for myself if there are any surviving Albigensian texts which have also been translated. And, as it turns out, there are. Here is one of them:

Cathar Texts: The Book of the Two Principles

The above links to The Book of the Two Principles, which is a Cathar critique against orthodox Christian doctrine; its chief arguments are that there are two Principles, not one; and that God is not the maker of the world, but that the world was made by the evil principle.

From the above work,

"I grant that the Lord our God is the creator and maker of this creation, but not of the "weak and needy elements" of this world, to which the Apostle, for example, refers in saying to the Galatians, "How turn you again to the weak and needy elements, which you desire to serve again?" And to the Colossians the same Apostle says: "If then you be dead with Christ from the elements of this world, why do you yet decree as though living in the world? Touch not, taste not, handle not, which are all unto destruction by the very use." Therefore, it can by no means be conceded that the Lord our God is creator or maker of death, or of those things which are wholly in death, as is written in the Book of Wisdom, "For God made not death, neither hath He pleasure in the destruction of the living." So undoubtedly there is another creator or maker, who is the source and cause of death and perdition, as of all evil, just as we pointed out with sufficient clarity above." - Book of the Two Principles, Part IV, s. 1

The charge of Manichaean stands; for the Cathars believed:

1) That there were two First Principles, one good and one evil.
2) That God is the cause of the good, and is responsible only for the spiritual creation.
3) That the evil principle is the cause and maker of the material world.

These can be ascertained by a simple reading of the Book of the Two Principles, already linked above.

Further Albigensian writings, translated from the original Occitan, can be found here: Cathar Texts and Rituals

Which begs the question, if the Cathars were "true Christians", why did they vehemently insist on such obvious heresy; and of those who claim that they were "true Christians", had they actually ever themselves read any Cathar works?

-CryptoLutheran
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Site Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,968
10,837
77
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟867,272.00
Country
New Zealand
Gender
Male
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Here is the link to the article.
A Great Betrayal
I won't go any further with this because it is getting a little off-topic.
 
Upvote 0