Speaking in Tongues a Cessationists’ View

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

1Co 14:39
Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.

Why do some say "Oh, the Bible is so perfect!" yet they do the very opposite of what it says here.

JESUS=G.O.A.T · Aug 1, 2018

Dave L said:
Paul says, "for we know in part, and we prophesy in part, but when what is perfect [Or "when completion"] comes, the partial will be set aside." 1 Corinthians 13:9-10 (NET)

"And now these three remain: faith, hope, and love. But the greatest of these is love." 1 Corinthians 13:13 (NET)

Paul contrasts tongues, interpretation of tongues, and knowledge with love, faith and hope. If as some say, prophecy, tongues and interpretation remain until the end of the world, Paul's comparison is meaningless.

How is it meaninlgless if LOve, faith, and hope remain even after the end of the world? While toungues and prophecy don’t just as Paul said in the text

JESUS=G.O.A.T · Aug 1, 2018

Dave L said:
Scripture is perfect and does a better job for us than tongues and prophecy. Here's what Peter says;

“For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.” (2 Peter 1:17–21)

All that says is they have reliable prophecy . The next part simply says that true prophecy of scripture never came about by a mans interpretation but by men of God who spoke as led by the Holy Spirit. I’m not sure how this goes against what I said

Dave L · Aug 1, 2018

JESUS=G.O.A.T said:
All that says is they have reliable prophecy . The next part simply says that true prophecy of scripture never came about by a mans interpretation but by men of God who spoke as led by the Holy Spirit. I’m not sure how this goes against what I said

It says scripture is better that God speaking personally. Because it isn't of private interpretation (like tongues were).

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

swordsman1 said:
You and your fellow students 'got' something, but I'm afraid it wasn't the Baptism of the Spirit nor was it the gift of tongues - according to the biblical descriptions of those things.

You have no knowledge of my experience.

swordsman1 · Aug 1, 2018

JESUS=G.O.A.T said:
I’m referring to the way in which God manifest himself. It was prophecied God would be in flesh... it was prophecied God would be in us (Holy Spirit) there’s no prophecy about the holy Spirit changing. But also I ask this... let’s say in some hypothetical world you were right that gifts cease... you never show in scripture when they would cease or that they did cease. The one you quoted simply mentions that they will cease (and I pointed out how it does show when... when that which is perfect is come), but no one is perfect now... so I mean clearly that time isn’t here Yet... but anyway that’s beside the point. Paul mentioned it clearly as being a future state he was not yet in “I have only part knowledge but when I come face to face... I will know “... and he was old when he said this... so I mean I just don’t see how you ignore the Greek, common sense, age of Paul,etc that all point towards this being something that happens not in this life

If the Holy Spirit hasn't changed in the way he operated since the apostolic age then why don't we have scripture-writing, miracle-working apostles today? The gift of apostleship was withdrawn. And along with apostleship went prophecy (Eph 2:20). And along with prophecy went tongues (1 Cor 13:8).

Paul uses the future tense because at the time of his writing those particular gifts were still in operation.

He was in his late forties when he wrote 1 Corinthians, so not that old. He had no idea when the canon would be completed.

JESUS=G.O.A.T · Aug 1, 2018

Dave L said:
It says scripture is better that God speaking personally. Because it isn't of private interpretation (like tongues were).

Can you post the portion of the scripture you’re referring to cause I didn’t see that

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

Dave L said:
Because it isn't of private interpretation (like tongues were).

Now you are saying that Tongues were a matter of private interpretation. This is ridiculous, Interpretation was another gift of the Holy Spirit.

Do you FORBID TO SPEAK IN TONGUES, Dave L.?

swordsman1 · Aug 1, 2018

JESUS=G.O.A.T said:
Paul says he’s not complete though.. so it couldn’t have come yet. Also we still live in the NT... its not complete...also we will have to agree to disagree regarding KJV vs NIV. I believe the KJV is more credible so I guess this discussion comes to a close here.

See my previous post:
https://www.christianforums.com/threads/speaking-in-tongues-a-cessationists’-view.8075635/page-4#post-73012792

JESUS=G.O.A.T · Aug 1, 2018

swordsman1 said:
If the Holy Spirit hasn't changed in the way he operated since the apostolic age then why don't we have scripture-writing, miracle-working apostles today? The gift of apostleship was withdrawn. And along with apostleship went prophecy (Eph 2:20). And along with prophecy went tongues (1 Cor 13:8).

Paul uses the future tense because at the time of his writing those particular gifts were still in operation.

He was in his late forties when he wrote 1 Corinthians, so not that old. He had no idea when the canon would be completed.

I’m referring to how the Holy Spirit operated with Christians in general back then not the apostles specifically. look at the verse I quoted to you the other day it stated all people have access to these gifts. I’m referring to how the Holy Spirit operates in Christians in general just as the verse is here. The 12 apostles were unique in their own right and had certain abilities, insights, and authority that the rest didn’t have . However everyone is declared to being able have manifestations of the Spirit
1 Corinthians 12:7-10 King James Version (KJV)

7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;

9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues. .

swordsman1 · Aug 1, 2018

Anto9us said:
1Co 14:39
Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.

Why do some say "Oh, the Bible is so perfect!" yet they do the very opposite of what it says here.

Because what people do today is not speaking in tongues, as scripture defines it.

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

RSV

1Co 14:39

So, my brethren, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do notforbid speaking in tongues;

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

NASB

1Co 14:39

So, my brethren, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues;

Albion · Aug 1, 2018

Besides, no one is actually forbidding the practice that Pentecostal Christians think is speaking in tongues. Is there?

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

NIV

1Co 14:39

So, my brethren, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues;

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

Albion said:
Besides, no one is actually forbidding the practice that Pentecostal Christians think is speaking in tongues. Is there?

Not forbidding in the sense of BEING ABLE TO STOP IT FROM HAPPENNING, Albion...

Forbidding in the sense of erroneously claiming it doesn't happen anymore, shooting off their mouths about glossalalia as a stress reliever, charismatics seeking a 'high', dopaminergic genes, sheesh --

forbidding in the sense of saying Oscarr's 50 years and my 45 of being able to pray in Tongues is NOT REAL, forbidding in the sense of saying we 'open ourselves up to evil spirits' - and - oh yeah, it's PLEASURE-SEEKING and akin to sex -- have you SEEN all the outlandish things attributed to Tongue-talkers in this thread?

But, no, not forbidding in the sense of BEING ABLE TO STOP IT -- because just like Gamaliel said when it all started in the first place:

Act 5:38
And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought:

Act 5:39
But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God.

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

ESV

1Co 14:39

So, my brothers, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

Darby

1Co 14:39

So that, brethren, desire to prophesy, and do not forbid the speaking with tongues.

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

Young's Literal

1Co 14:39

so that, brethren, earnestly desire to prophesy, and to speak with tongues do not forbid;

Anto9us · Aug 1, 2018

NKJV

1Co 14:39

Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and do not forbid to speak with tongues.

Speaking in Tongues a Cessationists’ View

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