Solution to the creation/evolution debate...?

[TLK Valentine]

You haven't punched any holes in this theory, etc, lol...

I'm not even sure you even fully understand it yet, or you would automatically know that's just not possible yet, etc, or at least not until some new information is presented first, because until then, it still stands, etc...

Sounds like you're admitting that you have absolutely nothing to back up your theory...


... in which case, you're absilutely correct -- it would be impossible for me to punch holes in what is, essentially, one giant hole.

Thanks for the laugh though, lol...

Back at ya.

I like how you just "say stuff" and automatically think you have made your point, or just defeated a theory or possible truth just right off the bat automatically and just because you say you have or say so, etc, it's very very laughable, etc...

Or else, "show me the holes", if you can, etc...?

Because there aren't any yet, etc...

Well, after your laughable invention of a "pure language" in your effort to prove Biblical inerrancy, I'm still waiting for something -- anything, really -- from you to defend it.

And you never were able to explain how you knew that the angel who allegedly spoke to John in Revelation was, "very powerful" or "of a high rank" by angelic standards....

So... what was that about just "saying stuff"?

But and/or anyway, talking with you further is starting to be "no concern of mine" anymore also, etc, cause your full of "you know what", etc...

I know quite a few things -- could you be referring to knowledge? Insight? Education? Logic? Wisdom?

In which case, you flatter me... but rest assured that whatever greatness I might appear to have is only relative.

Anyway,

God Bless!

You still mean that?

 

[Neogaia777]

Sounds like you're admitting that you have absolutely nothing to back up your theory...

... in which case, you're absilutely correct -- it would be impossible for me to punch holes in what is, essentially, one giant hole.

So you "got nothing" other than "your just saying so", correct...?

Because I thought so, etc...

Well, after your laughable invention of a "pure language" in your effort to prove Biblical inerrancy, I'm still waiting for something -- anything, really -- from you to defend it.

Let's stick to the topic at hand for now, etc...

Can you punch any holes in this theory I have presented here, or can you not, etc...?

Yes or No, etc...?

And you never were able to explain how you knew that the angel who allegedly spoke to John in Revelation was, "very powerful" or "of a high rank" by angelic standards....

So... what was that about just "saying stuff"?

This is laughable, it is clear that the Angel was a very powerful and great one, but let's stick to the topic at hand for now OK...

Can you punch any holes in this theory I have presented here, or can you not, etc...?

Yes or No, etc...?

I know quite a few things -- could you be referring to knowledge? Insight? Education? Logic? Wisdom?

In which case, you flatter me... but rest assured that whatever greatness I might appear to have is only relative.

However you want to take that I guess, etc...

I could care less if you use it to tickle your ego or not, etc...

You still mean that?

Yes, I do, and do 100% fully...

And while the Bible says we should "bless our enemies", I really do not even consider you an "enemy", if that means anything to you, etc...

So why would I not want God to bless you, etc...

I'm still hoping you can be "saved", etc...

God Bless!

 

[AV1611VET]

And clearly Jesus was wrong about that, as the existence of the transgendered proves.

Your "shock interpretations" don't cut it, chief.

 

[TLK Valentine]

OK @TLK Valentine, Do you believe Jesus had to die for you to pay for your sins...?

Yes or No...?

Because if the answer to that is still "No", then you are not saved yet, etc...

Then no... I am still not "saved" because I don't believe he had to die for my sins.

That was a choice. Who made that rule, anyway?

Or do you believe He rose from the dead...?

Yes or No...?

Because if the answer to that is still "No", then you are not saved yet, etc...

Here's a surprise -- I'm still not saved! Because I do not believe in a physical, bodily resurrection from the dead.

Now, clearly something happened which caused the Apostles to completely rethink and redefine their views of Jesus as their Messiah -- since dying was certainly never part of any of the prophecies, and in fact, the method of his death would actually disqualify him as the Messiah that the Jews had been waiting for... but of course, you already knew that -- Deuteronomy 21:22-23.

What actually changed the disciples' mindset from abject despair to utter rejoicing is a mystery -- but I do not believe it had anything to do with a dead body coming back to life.

Because those are "essential doctrines" that are absolutely vital to "saving knowledge", etc...

And I don't think you fully buy into them just yet, etc...

I don't buy into them in the slightest -- so that, at least, you got right.

Are you planning on selling them?

God Bless!

Right...

 

[TLK Valentine]

Your "shock interpretations" don't cut it, chief.

What? Clearly God made more than "male and female" -- or perhaps He did a less-than-perfect job of differentiating between the two... just like he did with the day and night, or the land and water...

 

[TLK Valentine]

So you "got nothing" other than "your just saying so", correct...?

Because I thought so, etc...



Let's stick to the topic at hand for now, etc...

Can you punch any holes in this theory I have presented here, or can you not, etc...?

Yes or No, etc...?

That would be the one where you invented an entirely new race of humans, correct?

This is laughable, it is clear that the Angel was a very powerful and great one,

Certainly compared to John, but that wasn't my question.

but let's stick to the topic at hand for now OK...

Can you punch any holes in this theory I have presented here, or can you not, etc...?

So where and when did God create that "lesser" race of humans?

However you want to take that I guess, etc...

I could care less if you use it to tickle your ego or not, etc...

The alternative would involve me reporting your post for flaming... and they take that sort of thing seriously around here (I ought to know...)

So... yeah, I'm gonna take that as a compliment -- for your sake.

 

[Neogaia777]

Then no... I am still not "saved" because I don't believe he had to die for my sins.

That was a choice. Who made that rule, anyway?



Here's a surprise -- I'm still not saved! Because I do not believe in a physical, bodily resurrection from the dead.

Now, clearly something happened which caused the Apostles to completely rethink and redefine their views of Jesus as their Messiah -- since dying was certainly never part of any of the prophecies, and in fact, the method of his death would actually disqualify him as the Messiah that the Jews had been waiting for... but of course, you already knew that -- Deuteronomy 21:22-23.

What actually changed the disciples' mindset from abject despair to utter rejoicing is a mystery -- but I do not believe it had anything to do with a dead body coming back to life.



I don't buy into them in the slightest -- so that, at least, you got right.

Are you planning on selling them?



Right...

Believe it or not, I actually do love you @TLK Valentine...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

That would be the one where you invented an entirely new race of humans, correct?

It is a theory of two races, yes...

But I'm still not seeing the "holes", etc...?

Certainly compared to John, but that wasn't my question.

And what was your question again...?

Oh yeah, I forgot, that the Angel wasn't a high or powerful one, even though the text clearly said/says the Angel was, etc, right...?

So where and when did God create that "lesser" race of humans?

They were brought about by process of evolution, etc...

The alternative would involve me reporting your post for flaming... and they take that sort of thing seriously around here (I ought to know...)

You mean you'd resort to that, just to get rid of me, etc...?

Because that just doesn't seem like you @TLK Valentine, etc...?

So... yeah, I'm gonna take that as a compliment -- for your sake.

Take it however you wish, I still love you, and don't consider you my enemy...

God Bless!

 

[TLK Valentine]

It is a theory of two races, yes...

But I'm still not seeing the "holes", etc...?

Well, you're adding material that the Bible says nothing about -- now, I don't care one way or the other how extensively you want to edit the Bible, but people who actually believe in it might object...

....but you can ask them about that yourself.

And what was your question again...?

Oh yeah, I forgot, that the Angel wasn't a high or powerful one, even though the text clearly said/says the Angel was, etc, right...?

The text describes an impressive display, but nothing indicating the angel's true rank or importance in the heavenly hierarchy.

Now, John was clearly impressed by the spectacle, and clearly you are as well, but here's my next question:

Does the phrase, "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" mean anything to you?

They were brought about by process of evolution, etc...

No argument from me -- but now you just lost every anti-evolutionist you were (allegedly) trying to help as well.

What does a man profit if he gains TLK Valentine but loses all the Creationists? ~Matthew 16:26 (more or less)

Although personally, I think you'd be getting the better end of the deal

You mean you'd resort to that, just to get rid of me, etc...?

Because that doesn't sound like you, etc...?

It has nothing to do with getting rid of you -- the forum has rules. Break them at your own peril.

Take it however you wish, I still love you, and don't consider you my enemy...

God Bless!

Nor do I consider you one... I'm far too entertained at the moment.

 

[ottawak]

Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

Look at that! Jesus uses Torah passages in His preaching to Jews. Therefor he must certinly agree with your assessment of the literary genre of the text he refers to. QED.

Of course many preachers who don't agree with your assessment use the text in exactly the same way. I wonder why that is?

 

[Neogaia777]

Well, you're adding material that the Bible says nothing about -- now, I don't care one way or the other how extensively you want to edit the Bible, but people who actually believe in it might object...

I expect "objections" "all over the place", etc...

Again, it's a theory, and a working one that does not need nor require absolute proof right now, because if it did, then it would be an absolute fact, etc...

And the Bible talks about the descendants of Adam being of the race of the Sons of God, who then began to intermix or interbreed with the sons and daughters (well daughters at least) of men, etc, and it does not take much of a stretch at all, to interpret it that way, etc...

The text describes an impressive display, but nothing indicating the angel's true rank or importance in the heavenly hierarchy.

Well, he was clearly a "great" Angel, and perhaps "rank" might have been the wrong word maybe, etc, for we don't even know if there is "rank" in Heaven yet, etc...

Now, John was clearly impressed by the spectacle, and clearly you are as well

And you wouldn't be, etc...?

but here's my next question:

Does the phrase, "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" mean anything to you?

View attachment 314109

Not particularly, etc...

No argument from me -- but now you just lost every anti-evolutionist you were (allegedly) trying to help as well.

Some of them might come around in time, etc...

What does a man profit if he gains TLK Valentine but loses all the Creationists? ~Matthew 16:26 (more or less)

Although personally, I think you'd be getting the better end of the deal

Now this is seriously funny, and no sarcasm intended in this case

It has nothing to do with getting rid of you -- the forum has rules. Break them at your own peril.

OK... It just didn't seem like you, etc, I personally have never reported anybody, etc...

Nor do I consider you one... I'm far too entertained at the moment.

Awesome, I'm glad your having a good time, and again, absolutely no sarcasm intended, but I mean that seriously, etc.

God Bless!

 

[AV1611VET]

What? Clearly God made more than "male and female" --

Leave it to academia to add to the Bible.

Can you imagine Caitlyn Jenner going to Heaven and living the rest of hir life with hir new name?

A man's name!?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I expect "objections" "all over the place", etc...

Again, it's a theory, and a working one that does not need nor require absolute proof right now, because if it did, then it would be an absolute fact, etc...

You think a theory requires proof to graduate into "fact"?

You also think that creationists are ever going to accept any nugget of information from a source not the Bible?

And the Bible talks about the descendants of Adam being of the race of the Sons of God, who then began to intermix or interbreed with the sons and daughters (well daughters at least) of men, etc, and it does not take much of a stretch at all, to interpret it that way, etc...

Creationists don't "stretch" anything unless it's to their advantage -- which your ideas are not.

Well, he was clearly a "great" Angel, and perhaps "rank" might have been the wrong word maybe, etc, for we don't even know if there is "rank" in Heaven yet, etc...

He was greater than John, to be sure, but who isn't -- angelically speaking?

You were impressed, but for all we know, what was described in revelation was merely the angelic equivalent of Uncle Bob pulling a quarter out of your ear... or maybe that trick where you pretend to take your thumb off...

What sorcery is this?!?

See the point? Without meeting any other angels, we have no way of knowing the difference between "true power" and parlor tricks.

And you wouldn't be, etc...?

The world is full of beings far more powerful than myself -- but generally speaking, I've found that the more someone tries to impress with their "phenomenal power," the weaker they actually are.

The truly strong have no need to show off.

Not particularly, etc...

Too bad -- a rudimentary knowledge of classic cinema might help you here -- if nothing else, you'd take the occasional peek behind the curtain before deciding who was truly powerful.

Some of them might come around in time, etc...

Not through your efforts -- far better attempts have been made to sway them.

OK... It just didn't seem like you, etc, I personally have never reported anybody, etc...

Odd that you would think I would look the other way if a rule was being broken...especially if it was broken against myself.

Awesome, I'm glad your having a good time, and again, absolutely no sarcasm intended, but I mean that seriously, etc.

God Bless!

And why wouldn't I be?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Leave it to academia to add to the Bible.

That's their job -- to add to the incomplete and correct the inaccurate.

Can you imagine Caitlyn Jenner going to Heaven and living the rest of hir life with hir new name?

A man's name!?

Well, supposedly when we get to heaven we will be given "perfect" bodies, will we not?

I can only imagine that part of that "perfection" would include being able to shape them in whatever way we wanted... wouldn't that include being able to be whatever gender we wished? Or neither? Or both at once? Or whatever we felt like from one day to the next?

ETA: in fact, I think a "perfect" body which could be changed at will would be pretty cool, don't you? Think about it: you could spontaneously grow to 7' 2" for that basketball game tomorrow... or sprout a third arm to work on your drum solos...

 

[Neogaia777]

You think a theory requires proof to graduate into "fact"?

You also think that creationists are ever going to accept any nugget of information from a source not the Bible?




Creationists don't "stretch" anything unless it's to their advantage -- which your ideas are not.



He was greater than John, to be sure, but who isn't -- angelically speaking?

You were impressed, but for all we know, what was described in revelation was merely the angelic equivalent of Uncle Bob pulling a quarter out of your ear... or maybe that trick where you pretend to take your thumb off...

What sorcery is this?!?

See the point? Without meeting any other angels, we have no way of knowing the difference between "true power" and parlor tricks.



The world is full of beings far more powerful than myself -- but generally speaking, I've found that the more someone tries to impress with their "phenomenal power," the weaker they actually are.

The truly strong have no need to show off.



Too bad -- a rudimentary knowledge of classic cinema might help you here -- if nothing else, you'd take the occasional peek behind the curtain before deciding who was truly powerful.



Not through your efforts -- far better attempts have been made to sway them.



Odd that you would think I would look the other way if a rule was being broken...especially if it was broken against myself.



And why wouldn't I be?

God Bless You @TLK Valentine.

God Bless!

 

[coffee4u]

You should read more stories before you say something quite so silly.

When was the last time you read a story that included the line, "And don't forget, boys and girls -- none of this actually happened"?

Generally that type of story starts 'once upon a time'. I am sure no one is under the impression that it is real and doesn't continue down through history with important men also believing it is real. Mosses believed it was real, Jesus believed it was real, Paul believed it was real. There is no comparison between one and the other. Also when the Bible is telling an actual story it says this is a story. "Then he told them many things in parables" "Jesus told them another parable:" and so on.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Generally that type of story starts 'once upon a time'.

Or "In the beginning..."

I am sure no one is under the impression that it is real and doesn't continue down through history with important men also believing it is real.

Ooo...important men believed it was real! How embarrassing would it be if only unimportant men thought it was real!

Mosses believed it was real, Jesus believed it was real, Paul believed it was real.

The absolute only evidence you have of any of this is what is written in the very book you're trying to convince me is "real."

You realize that, right? It's like saying that Star Wars is real because Luke Skywalker believed in it.

There is no comparison between one and the other. Also when the Bible is telling an actual story it says this is a story. "Then he told them many things in parables" "Jesus told them another parable:" and so on.

Only in a handful of instances, by one or two authors in an anthology that spans centuries.

The level of literary scholarship displayed is not even laughable.

 

[coffee4u]

Or "In the beginning..."



Ooo...important men believed it was real! How embarrassing would it be if only unimportant men thought it was real!



The absolute only evidence you have of any of this is what is written in the very book you're trying to convince me is "real."

You realize that, right? It's like saying that Star Wars is real because Luke Skywalker believed in it.



Only in a handful of instances, by one or two authors in an anthology that spans centuries.

The level of literary scholarship displayed is not even laughable.

Who said I was trying to convince you that the Bible is real?
Pretty sure my original post on this thread was to Neogaia777.

You are asking me questions and I am providing answers, it isn't my job to convince you of anything. I am simply sharing what I believe to be true, you can take it or leave it, you have free will.

All people are of equal importance in God's eyes, but the fact remains that those men are looked up to, people sat at their feet to be taught, they were leaders. They weren't playing Kindergarten. Jesus of course was also God.

I don't require any evidence, nor is it about evidence, I know in my spirit. One time I was agnostic but not since God revealed himself to me over 30 years ago. Since your label says agnostic I guess you haven't found God. Again, not my job is not to convince you, merely to share the good news of the kingdom.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Who said I was trying to convince you that the Bible is real?
Pretty sure my original post on this thread was to Neogaia777.

And yet you responded to me.

You are asking me questions and I am providing answers,

Yeah, that's how conversations work.

it isn't my job to convince you of anything. I am simply sharing what I believe to be true, you can take it or leave it, you have free will.

And because I have free will, I choose a third option: correct it.

All people are of equal importance in God's eyes, but the fact remains that those men are looked up to, people sat at their feet to be taught, they were leaders.

They were infallible?

They weren't playing Kindergarten. Jesus of course was also God.

Perhaps not Kindergarten, but certainly they were being schooled -- among Jesus' many titles by his apostles was "Rabbi," a title which means, among other things, "scholar" or "teacher" (of Jewish Law).

As a teacher myself, I use fiction, myth, and legend all the time to get my lessons across -- do I therefore believe them to be true facts?

It should also be noted that which Jesus was the teacher, his students weren't always what we would call "Honor Roll" candidates -- especially in the opening chapters of John's Gospel; he keeps trying to make points which just keep sailing over their heads... and always for the same reason.

I don't require any evidence, nor is it about evidence, I know in my spirit. One time I was agnostic but not since God revealed himself to me over 30 years ago. Since your label says agnostic I guess you haven't found God. Again, not my job is not to convince you, merely to share the good news of the kingdom.

And if the "Good News" has anything to do with literalism, I'll take the unpleasant truth instead.

 

[AV1611VET]

As a teacher myself, I use fiction, myth, and legend all the time to get my lessons across --

That's nice.

Some are good candidates for the Humpty Dumpty School of Thought.

But when they come on to a Christian website, they'd better be prepared to set their nursery rhymes aside, else they'll myth a lot of stuff.