So what does this mean

[raven1]

I really do wish I could have found God.

 

[hollyda]

You've been officially diagnosed with OCD - no shocker there.

You're still here, still enabling your OCD. You need to stop. You might as well ask why do I have a runny nose with a head cold. You have these thoughts because you have OCD. Plain and simple. It's no different than any other symptom to any other illness.

People have tried repeatedly to explain these things to you because the people here genuinely want to help. But you're looking for an answer I and many others have told you doesn't exist. We can't show you a unicorn anymore than we can magically give you the answer to make all your doubt vanish. Exposure isn't supposed to be easy, but if it's live like you're living now for the rest of your life or take a chance on something you haven't honestly tried, which would you rather do? A lot of hard now and relief later, or live like this forever?

 

[raven1]

What's the point I am athiest now I don't fear he'll.

 

[hollyda]

What's the point I am athiest now I don't fear he'll.

If you want to give up, that's your choice.

 

[raven1]

Why would that be giving up?

 

[hollyda]

Why would that be giving up?

You're letting your OCD win. It's the equivalent of saying you're going live with a head cold the rest of your life rather than seek treatment.

 

[raven1]

It was athiesm not OCD. I am athiest now.

 

[hollyda]

Ok so today I was officially diagnosed with OCD (theme doubting God exists) but what does that mean? Does that mean That I don't really doubt God exists?

It was athiesm not OCD. I am athiest now.

You were diagnosed with OCD. Guess you know better than the doctor, then.

 

[raven1]

No I am not saying I do but if I tried for three years to believe in God and can't and I don't fear hell anymore and are kind of relieved you are an athiest that would make u one.

 

[hollyda]

No I am not saying I do but if I tried for three years to believe in God and can't and I don't fear hell anymore and are kind of relieved you are an athiest that would make u one.

It doesn't matter how long you've tried if you've been going about it the wrong way, which I and others have told you that you have. I can dig a hole for three years but I'm no closer to getting to China than I would be if I'd just bought an airline ticket.

If you're truly an atheist now, you won't have a problem doing those exposure exercises I sent you months ago.

 

[raven1]

I don't get exposure. Desensitizing u from something that u should be afraid of ( if u are Christian and u doubt God exists you should be afraid) Wouldn't that exercise make u athiest?

I am so confused anyway. I feel all these warm fuzzies about being athiest no more fighting if God is there, it seems more logical that he isn't there anyway. I can't comprehend his creating us the universe, virgin birth, Jesus walking on water. I also think what if I don't believe because of my OCD I should at least try then I go back to but I can't believe something I don't that's forcing faith.

 

[hollyda]

I don't get exposure. Desensitizing u from something that u should be afraid of ( if u are Christian and u doubt God exists you should be afraid) Wouldn't that exercise make u athiest?

I am so confused anyway. I feel all these warm fuzzies about being athiest no more fighting if God is there, it seems more logical that he isn't there anyway. I can't comprehend his creating us the universe, virgin birth, Jesus walking on water. I also think what if I don't believe because of my OCD I should at least try then I go back to but I can't believe something I don't that's forcing faith.

Exposure is not making the fear go away. It takes your irrational reaction to the fear and places it where it should be. I'm afraid of spiders. My reaction to being afraid of spiders is to look scream and make someone kill one the second I see it. This is an irrational fear, because most spiders are harmless. I accept that. An irrational response would be to shut myself up in a room, compulsively check for spiders, and refuse to enter a new location until I have proof there are no spiders on the premises. Of course, I would never trust said proof. What if it was wrong? What if there was a chance of finding a spider in the house?

I'm always going to have the irrational fear of spiders. The fear doesn't go away, but I recognize it as being irrational and moderate my responses accordingly. I don't look for spiders everywhere I go. My aracnophobia might increase on certain days, but I don't spend every waking minute obsessing over spiders.

That's the difference.

Again, if you truly are an atheist, doing the exposure exercises should be a piece of cake.

 

[kodadog1024]

Did you ever think that maybe God never intended for you, me or any other human to "figure" out how he does it? Your not meant to know. He just does it. As a mom, does your child need a reason for everything you do in her life? NO. You do it because you know better, you have more knowledge. You have more experience. You don't always need to give them an answer for their question. "Because I said so" or "Because it is what it is, don't argue with me". You can't tell me you've never used that logic with your daughter. Same goes for your Father in heaven. He doesn't owe you an explanation. but your basing your relationship with Him on whether you can understand how He does this or that. that's wrong. Maybe you should focus on what he has already done for you....

 

[raven1]

I can't believe in him. It is not my fault. Kodadog I just can't its kind of like Santa. Him seems illogical. It's the same for me with him.

 

[gracealone]

Hi Hollyda,
Funny thing is that I've used the spider analogy too to help me understand my OCD. I'm also really terrified of spiders but I've also tested myself by doing some level of exposure to them. I started gardening and forced myself to weed the plants even if a spider was very near my hand. Then I went from that to forcing myself to kill them in the house instead of calling my husband. I graduated from using the vacumn hose if they were up high or dropping a phone book on them if they were on the floor to being able to kill them with toilet paper.
I had a big set back a few years ago when I got bit on the neck by this enormous spider which gave me a reaction and the docs. in the ER thought it was a brown recluse. I don't really think it was. I think it was just possibly a huge pine spider. Anyhow my spider fear escalated for quite some time and I did a lot of checking compulsions related to it. I mean ALOT. Then I just said.. I'm not going to do this anymore so I began to work on desensitizing myself again. I'm doing pretty good again and am now able to kill them once again with a bunch of wadded up toilet paper. I've yet to touch or hold a tarantula but I just know that if I could bring myself to do it I'd completely conquer that fear. My point... exposure works for all obsessional fears even simple phobias.
With pure O we have a phobic response to our thoughts and the only way to get over that is to do exposure exercises that centers on the theme of those thoughts. This is scary stuff cause we have to go into that kind of exercise still being afraid that the thoughts might really be true.
It always feels like risky business.
Love your insight on OCD it's always spot on. And I also love that you remain respectful of our faith in Christ. My faith teaches me to treat all people with honor and respect because they are valuable to God and I think it's very honorable that you do the same.
Mitzi

Exposure is not making the fear go away. It we didn't have the fear that they might be true we wouldn't be needing to do exposure.
takes your irrational reaction to the fear and places it where it should be. I'm afraid of spiders. My reaction to being afraid of spiders is to look scream and make someone kill one the second I see it. This is an irrational fear, because most spiders are harmless. I accept that. An irrational response would be to shut myself up in a room, compulsively check for spiders, and refuse to enter a new location until I have proof there are no spiders on the premises. Of course, I would never trust said proof. What if it was wrong? What if there was a chance of finding a spider in the house?

I'm always going to have the irrational fear of spiders. The fear doesn't go away, but I recognize it as being irrational and moderate my responses accordingly. I don't look for spiders everywhere I go. My aracnophobia might increase on certain days, but I don't spend every waking minute obsessing over spiders.

That's the difference.

Again, if you truly are an atheist, doing the exposure exercises should be a piece of cake.

 

[gracealone]

I can't believe in him. It is not my fault. Kodadog I just can't its kind of like Santa. Him seems illogical. It's the same for me with him.

Except that you're not afraid that if you don't believe in Santa that you won't get any more Christmas presents. You know Santa isn't real. But God????? Well that's just too big of a risk isn't it?

 

[raven1]

I had a priest tell me if I became athiest and God did exist he would forgive me because I didn't chose to be athiest.

 

[gracealone]

Raven : I don't get exposure. Desensitizing u from something that u should be afraid of ( if u are Christian and u doubt God exists you should be afraid) Wouldn't that exercise make u athiest?

Except that it's impossible to be afraid of something you don't believe is real. Right? Are you afraid of Vampires? Why not? I mean what if you're wrong and it turns out that vampires really do exist? Silly eh? But; "what if I'm wrong and God really does exist." Now that is a really deep concern to you. Therefore, your belief that he does exist outweighs your supposed belief that he doesn't. Otherwise, just like Hollyda said, you'd have absolutely no trouble doing those exposure exercises she sent you. (By the way... I'd be interested to see those Holly - I'll bet they are very similar to the ones I did for my Religous OCD.) Anyhow, why should you care that they might make you and Athiest? Real athiests aren't upset that they are atheists they embrace their belief and move on. No fear of hell or what might happen in the afterlife. Right Holly? (I love that you're on this forum because it's good exposure for those of us with this obsessional theme.)
And no ERP doesn't make you an atheist. Athiesm is a choice not a "I can't help it!!" kind of thing. After you do exposure and the fear is no longer a factor you can then calmly choose whether you want to be a Christian or an Athiest. But the reason you'd rather not do the exposure is that your OCD fear is this; "I'm so afraid that doing the exposure will in the end, REVEAL that I'm an athiest after all so I'd rather not do it." So... prove me wrong and go ahead and do the exposure therapy. Sit with that "vampire" - I dare ya.
You should know by now Raven.. that what I'm saying to you is a form of tough love but more than that, it's also a road that I've already traveled myself otherwise I'd never ask you to do it.
Love you! Mitzi/Momma Moo


I am so confused anyway. I feel all these warm fuzzies about being athiest no more fighting if God is there, it seems more logical that he isn't there anyway. I can't comprehend his creating us the universe, virgin birth, Jesus walking on water. I also think what if I don't believe because of my OCD I should at least try then I go back to but I can't believe something I don't that's forcing faith.[/quote]

 

[gracealone]

Was this priest trying to reassure you to go ahead and do the therapy for OCD? Just curious.

I had a priest tell me if I became athiest and God did exist he would forgive me because I didn't chose to be athiest.

 

[kodadog1024]

I can't believe in him. It is not my fault. Kodadog I just can't its kind of like Santa. Him seems illogical. It's the same for me with him.

Yes you can.