So how is that BLM thing going?

ThatRobGuy said:

Autonomous groups wouldn't have to make such filings if it was just simply an organic movement with no leadership structure, no income, and no vested interests.

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when did the founders of BLM say they were an autonomous movement?

timothyu said:

Yet they, unlike the bottom, get it all back. That is the advantage of Corporatism. No matter where the bottom spends it's money it always ends back up at the top

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By get it all back, you mean, their business turns a profit the subsequent year after they pay the previous year's taxes?

I don't see a problem with that. Unless the expectation is that the 1%'s net worth is supposed to decrease each year?

SilverBear said:

when did the founders of BLM say they were an autonomous movement?

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When their website said they were a "member-led movement" (aka autonomous)
https://blacklivesmatter.com/herstory/

ThatRobGuy said:

Unless the expectation is that the 1%'s net worth is supposed to decrease each year?

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Nah, that would be the duty of the bottom.

jacks said:

I actually think political movements are like a pendulum. They swing so far in one direction, then head back to the center. BLM, defunding police, and some other movements I don't want to mention,(because all this stuff still turns into an argument) were at that far end and we are now going back towards a more moderate center. Hopefully we will keep the core good of these movements and discard the nonsense that surrounds them.

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This was never a political movement. It never had a legitimate complaint, cause, or solution.

It's a grift...sold to the easily fooled.

I don't mind pointing it out either. I didn't buy it. I still remember asking who was saying black lives didn't matter? Nobody.

How does the grift work? Here's the step by step...

1. Step 1, find viral incident of dead black person....preferably by police....never by another black citizen.
2. Claim racism is the cause of Step 1.
3. Claim to be fighting racism. Does not require any actual racism, or even a working definition of racism.
4. Play off the guilt and shame of regular people by blaming them or absolving them of blame based on the color of their skin. Don't worry about if this is racist...just call anyone who points it out or otherwise doesn't support your "movement" a racist.
5. Repeat steps 1-4 until the pile of "allies" (the duped) following you grows so large that you can demand their employers show support as well. Again, don't worry about clear goals, problems, solutions, responsibilities, etc. Keep everything super vague and keep accusing others of racism.

Success means that you are able to collect money from people who want to "help" and use that money to buy yourself mansions. Then claim you earned that money, because running a scam full time basically is a job.

When the people who you "protested for" claim they never got a thin dime from you....remind them that at no point did you claim to be a charity. You're a movement. You move money from the pockets of honest people into real estate, shell corporations, and the various other grifters you've attracted along the way. Political movement? No...a non-profit. That's how you keep your tax exempt status. Report profits? No way. Instead, have your friends start "consulting firms" so you can pay them to look for ways for you to keep that money. Start your own consulting firm....pay yourself for your thoughts.

Obviously, the accusations will keep coming. Don't flee the country...resist that urge. Instead tell everyone you're promoting black sustainability...yours. You're promoting generational wealth.....yours. You're creating black spaces (buying mansions) for black creators (of scams). You're showing people that black lives matter to you....like yours.

At this point, I honestly don't want to see Cullors or Garza or any of them go to jail. I want to see them make YouTube videos from their mansions where they complain about how difficult it is to be black/female/gender-something/cis-homo-hetero something in the US while sipping champagne. I bet it tastes like fraud.

Why don't I want her in jail? Because some people need reminders. Some people have short memories. Some people lie to themselves and refuse to accept reality.

Those people will inevitably get worked up over something vague and without any real direction or goals...they will start accusing others of being part of "the problem".

At that point, we can send them a video of Cullors doing the electric-slide in one of her multiple mansions and simply remind them they are easily fooled and utterly clueless.

Ana the Ist said:

who was saying black lives didn't matter?

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People (cops) like Derek Chauvin that's who. Wake up!

Bradskii said:

BLM the movement? It served (and is serving to some extent) its purpose. Got people asking questions.

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Questions like "how much can I safely assume about people based on their skin color?"

Or

"How much gasoline will be needed to burn down this police station?"

Or

"Should I wait for the whole story before I go looting Walmart?"

Thinking about what we should value. Who we should value.

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What is the value of the BLM t-shirt I bought online and then shared the purchase with my "online community" for likes?

How we should address racism.

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What even is racism? How many millions of dollars can you collect for helping no one but yourself....before you can no longer claim to be a victim of oppression?

Who is responsible.

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Those running the scam.

Who suffers.

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The people who were duped....specifically, those who were family members of police shootings who were used and disposed of to gain funds.

What form it takes.

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Mass idiocy. Moral cowardice. Shameless virtue signaling.

Made us think.

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Not everyone apparently.

Opened up conversations.

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I disagree. A lot of people shut down any conversation that might have shown them they were being scammed.

Focussed our attention.

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On the wrong things.

All those things are positives.

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Only if people can be honest with themselves and learn from it.

Ana the Ist said:

A lot of people shut down any conversation that might have shown them they were being scammed.

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Well.. they learned from the best... all those noble tech giants. Interesting BLM and the Cancel Culture were allied and making headlines together.

rturner76 said:

People (cops) like Derek Chauvin that's who. Wake up!

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Did he say that?

timothyu said:

Well.. they learned from the best... all those noble tech giants. Interesting BLM and the Cancel Culture were allied and making headlines together.

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There's lessons to be learned....that's for certain. Here's one so obvious you'd think you wouldn't have to explain it.

Laws don't stop crimes from happening completely...nor is it reasonable to expect them to. Making a behavior illegal just means that people can seek justice when it occurs. Victims can seek justice...but like all crimes...they'll be asked for evidence of the crime. Victims who don't have any evidence should not be surprised if they don't get the results they wanted.

This is never going to justify the following...

1. Violent protests.
2. Personal attacks.
3. Extrajudicial justice (mob justice).
4. Casting claims of guilt.
5. Fabricating evidence (aka pulling a Smollett).

Sadly, it doesn't seem like everyone got this lesson.

ThatRobGuy said:

When their website said they were a "member-led movement" (aka autonomous)
https://blacklivesmatter.com/herstory/

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Seriously...they repeated that line so much during the first 5 years...you'd think it was the slogan.

Here's the sad thing...it was always a lie. It's a lie told to get you to do "the work" without the leaders having to "do the work". It's a lie told to get allies to repeat slogans, protest, and collect donations or shake down businesses (which is basically what they did).

The leaders always set the agenda...propagated slogans....and collected funds.

Ana the Ist said:

What even is racism?

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I think that's all you needed to post.

ThatRobGuy said:

I think at the very least, cases like this are proof-positive that the shtick about it being "an idea" or "autonomous" or a "decentralized movement" was never really the case.

That's not meant to promote (or disparage) any idea put forth by any of the individual chapters.
(for the record, while I disagree with some of the ideas they have for reforms...I've actually talked to a few of the organizers and members of BLM-Cleveland when they were out at another event I was at...they're pretty nice people for the most part and I got along with them well in the 20 mins or so I chatted with them)

...but there's definitely a pecking order there (to burst the bubble of anyone thinking it was an autonomous decentralized movement or "an idea").

Autonomous decentralized movements don't have a person who holds the title of "Managing Director" at the national level...
View attachment 315107

...but organizations with a defined hierarchy do.

Any much like any other organization with a hierarchy (whether it be a fortune 500 company, a motorcycle gang, or an ideological/cause-driven group), there's the the susceptibility for people at the top to abuse their power or use it for their own financial gain - while stringing along the people at the bottom by making them think they have their best interests at heart.

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It was actually a group of individual BLM chapters that initially criticized BLMGN (in Nov. 2020.). I’ve seen no evidence that that organization is giving any kind of orders or was even communicating regularly with most individual chapters. You can read their criticisms and the open letter they sent in 2020 here:

Home, Statement From The Frontlines of BLM

I can also tell you that the BLM movement in Portland (which as you know was huge) was not led by the Portland BLM chapter but by other organizations and groups.

I certainly understand why it’s confusing, but BLM Global Network Foundation - the organization started in 2014 - is not the same thing as the BLM movement, which is in fact very decentralized. So decentralized there was always tons of fights between different groups of people about strategy and plans. No one was in charge.

ThatRobGuy said:

When their website said they were a "member-led movement" (aka autonomous)
https://blacklivesmatter.com/herstory/

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Not quite the same thing epically when you actually listen to the founders. in an interview with teh New Yorker Alisia Garza described the network as an online platform that existed to provide activists with a shared set of principles and goals. Local Black Lives Matter chapters are asked to commit to the organization's list of guiding principles but operate without a central structure or hierarchy. the thousands of chapters operate autonomously and do not take direction from any larger organization. Cobb, Jelani (March 14, 2016). "The Matter of Black Lives". The New Yorker.
Cullors said "What sets Black Lives Matter apart from other social justice groups, however, is its decentralized approach and reliance almost solely on local, rather than national, leadership. (BLM) is not directed by one person or group of people. Miller, R.W. (July 11 2016 ) "Black Lives Matter: A primer on what it is and what it stands for" USA TODAY

Ana the Ist said:

This was never a political movement. It never had a legitimate complaint, cause, or solution.

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well it does but you would have to actually read and listen to people and challenge your own prejudices...

I don't mind pointing it out either. I didn't buy it. I still remember asking who was saying black lives didn't matter? Nobody.

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"saying Black lives matter doesn't mean every life isn't important – it means that Black lives are far to often seen as being of no or of lesser value in our society." Opal Tometi

How does the grift work? Here's the step by step...

1. Step 1, find viral incident of dead black person....preferably by police....never by another black citizen.
2. Claim racism is the cause of Step 1.
3. Claim to be fighting racism. Does not require any actual racism, or even a working definition of racism.
4. Play off the guilt and shame of regular people by blaming them or absolving them of blame based on the color of their skin. Don't worry about if this is racist...just call anyone who points it out or otherwise doesn't support your "movement" a racist.
5. Repeat steps 1-4 until the pile of "allies" (the duped) following you grows so large that you can demand their employers show support as well. Again, don't worry about clear goals, problems, solutions, responsibilities, etc. Keep everything super vague and keep accusing others of racism.

Success means that you are able to collect money from people who want to "help" and use that money to buy yourself mansions. Then claim you earned that money, because running a scam full time basically is a job.

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did you get this from a white nationalist group?


Obviously, the accusations will keep coming. [/quote] yeah hate groups are good at making fake accusations

At this point, I honestly don't want to see Cullors or Garza or any of them go to jail.

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yeah right

I want to see them make YouTube videos from their mansions where they complain about how difficult it is to be black/female/gender-something/cis-homo-hetero something in the US while sipping champagne. I bet it tastes like fraud.

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Well here is Patrisse Cullors mansion. hope you enjoy the tour

Why don't I want her in jail? Because some people need reminders. Some people have short memories. Some people lie to themselves and refuse to accept reality.

Those people will inevitably get worked up over something vague and without any real direction or goals...they will start accusing others of being part of "the problem".

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like what you are doing to BLM right here

Bradskii said:

I think that's all you needed to post.

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So what's the answer to the question?

We live in a world where a report scrutinizing a woman's alleged spending of donations, is called racist. So it is a very good question to ask.

MrMoe said:

So what's the answer to the question?

We live in a world where a report scrutinizing a woman's alleged spending of donations, is called racist. So it is a very good question to ask.

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No. Asking what racism is, is an extremely dumb question. Because we all know what racism is. The questions (plural) that we need to answer - and a lot of people have been thinking about them over the last couple of years, are those that ask in what circumstances can something be described as racist.

So the point that you just raised is then a valid one. In what circumstances were the comments made? What intent was there in making them? Is intent a necessary requisite for a racist statement? Is the ethnic background of the woman partly responsible for the comment? Do personal preferences need to be considered? If the person who makes any comment an obvious racist does that cloud the issue? Can we separate obvious divisions in society on racial grounds? If the person making the comment is the same ethnic backround as the person to whom the comments are addressed, can it still be called racist? Does any good that a racist does balance any racist comments?

Those are just some questions we could address on one single example of one comment. There are probably a lot more. And most are probably germane to other examples. And the problem is that we might agree on some and not agree on others. So there's a lot of grey areas. This is not generally a black and white matter (with very obvious exceptions).

But I think that before we even start examining any example of potential racism, then we'd be expected to know what racism actually was in order for us to be able to discuss, debate and determine whether it is or is not.

Ana the Ist said:

Did he say that?

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He did that