Sin is Sin All Sins Are Equal.

[LightHorseman]

I once heard that homosexuality is inherited.
Kinda strange, since it took a male and a female
to create the person who so claimed this absurdity..

Wonder which heterosexual it was that passed the
homosexual gene to their offspring??

Go read about "recessive traits" and come back to us.

Not, there are a vast number of inherited conditions that normally result in the individual having no offspring, cystic fibrosis, sickle cell anaemia, and muscular dystrophy, just for starters.

And yet they are all passed on through genes.

 

[BigBadWlf]

I have pounded that fact into the ground to no avail - I have to say that I don't think people care what the bible spells out.
Romans 1 is the most powerful condemnation for both the lust and the sex act in homosexuality - it's called dishonouring to their bodies, shameful (lust) and unnatural - unnatural is clearly what is not natural/ against nature.

Then, they skip over Jesus' teaching on the prototype of the marital unit and why it is what it is:

Matt. 19
3 The Pharisees also came to Him, testing Him, and saying to Him, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for just any reason?”
4 And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’
5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife,
and the two shall become one flesh’?
6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”

That verse singlehandedly cancels out any other acceptable combination for marital relations that would be within God's will for humanity. It means that God created a male for the female at creation, and BECUZ OF THAT fact, they are to become one flesh together.
Not more than 2, and not any other combination but male and female. (other verses spell this out also)
1 Timothy 3:2
A bishop then must be blameless,
the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach;

Very simple and very clear - the examples of acceptable and common marital unions for God's people involved male & female only. Jesus spelled it out Himself by the model He gave which was God's will for the family unit.

Anyone rejecting what is so clear by teaching and example, I have to consider denial of overwhelming evidence.

"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." John 13:34-35





you are right it is amazing how many Christian ignore the teachings of Jesus so they can continue to assert their petty personal prejudices

 

[Apollo Celestio]

"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." John 13:34-35





you are right it is amazing how many Christian ignore the teachings of Jesus so they can continue to assert their petty personal prejudices

You're in no place to judge, with your false assertions just because someone believes differently than you.

 

[BigBadWlf]

Excellent post - I would rep you but it wont let me. God bless you richly for sharing the truth of His word.​

Why would you call a post full of false statements and unsupoorted claims excellent?

 

[BigBadWlf]

I just love how people turn this to condemnation & hatred - do you accept pedophilia?

Poor choice of comparison considering that pedophiles are almost exclusively heterosexuals.
Jenny, C., Roesler, T. A., & Poyer, K. L. (1994). Are children at risk for sexual abuse by homosexuals? Pediatrics, 94(1), 41-44
Groth, A.N., & Birnbaum, H.J. (1978). Adult sexual orientation and attraction to underage persons. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 7 (3), 175-181.
Freund, K., Watson, R., & Rienzo, D. (1989). Heterosexuality, homosexuality, and erotic age preference. The Journal of Sex Research, 26 (1), 107-117.

 

[BigBadWlf]

You're in no place to judge, with your false assertions just because someone believes differently than you.

I thought it was the right and duty of Christians to judge. Or is it you just don’t like to be judged as you personally judge others

 

[BigBadWlf]

Thats false. [/color]The term for Christ is feminine also - by that poor reasoning then Christ is a female. Word tense doesnt mean something refers to a man or woman. Again poor reasoning designed to allow for error and cover sin.

It specifically refers to the bed of a woman, not a man.

I always find it fascinating that those who demand a literal translation of the bible are the first ones to reject that literal translation when an accurate translation conflicts with their personal prejudices.

 

[BigBadWlf]

I'll stand by my Exegesis....And the FACT still remains the same Paul coined the words IN THE BIBLE..

That’s not a fact at all.

And there remains no reason to believe that it translates as homosexual specially considering that for centuries the word was translated as masturbators

 

[BigBadWlf]

They LIVE in homosexual lifestyles. I live in a heterosexual lifestyle. Where's any denigration?

Those who practice SIN (sin as a regular habit and commonly practiced) are living a life against God. Rebellion.
Hey, there's sins I'm prone to that I cannot live in and practice. The same holds true for homosexuals and anyone else who has weaknesses or fettishes or bents towards anything God tells us is wrong.

There's no difference, those who claim Christ have to turn from sin and repent. Salvation came with a price - Christ died for it, and our price we pay is to die to self on this earth to inherit a better kingdom.
Gays have to make the same choices any other sinner does. Repent or perish and we ALL have to fight against our sin natures.

With that said, I'll try to check back in later to reply.

Sadly this tactic has been used for generation by those justify prejudice against black people. those promoting racism would compare blacks to sexual deviants to bolster support for their prejudice just as you are comparing sexual oriention to a fetish. I am sure (or at least I hope) you would never attack people of different skin color by comparing that entire minority to sexual deviants I have to ask why you think it is acceptable to compare a different minority to sexual deviants

 

[BigBadWlf]

I once heard that homosexuality is inherited.
Kinda strange, since it took a male and a female
to create the person who so claimed this absurdity..

Wonder which heterosexual it was that passed the
homosexual gene to their offspring??

You might want to educate yourself on the basics of genetics and how inheritance works before making post like this again

 

[Apollo Celestio]

I thought it was the right and duty of Christians to judge. Or is it you just don’t like to be judged as you personally judge others

It is, but look how you're doing it.
"Oh, you're just against me because you hate gays (justify personal prejudice), therefore you're sinning by not loving." People continuously tell you they don't hate anyone, yet you continue to say they do and compare them to racists for believing a rational view of the bible. I'll restate, you're in no place to judge anyone about "love".

 

[LightHorseman]

It is, but look how you're doing it.
"Oh, you're just against me because you hate gays (justify personal prejudice), therefore you're sinning by not loving." People continuously tell you they don't hate anyone, yet you continue to say they do and compare them to racists for believing a rational view of the bible. I'll restate, you're in no place to judge anyone about "love".

Can you see how frustrating it is to see people claiming to "love" homosexuals when blind bloody freddy can see that they hate them, with a deep, visceral, irational hatred?

 

[Nadiine]

Can you see how frustrating it is to see people claiming to "love" homosexuals when blind bloody freddy can see that they hate them, with a deep, visceral, irational hatred?

Hey, some people DO hate gays AND homosexuality both.

However, the false attacks on these boards is unprecedented in this subject - it's mostly based on a Christian claiming the act of homosexuality (ie. the sex acts specifically) is SINFUL.

But rarely do these people ever stop to look at their own hatred against the one's they're attacking! (pro homosexual against conservative Christian). Their ad hom bombs & hateful accusations (I believe some are flat out lying) are actually MUCH MUCH worse than what conservative Christians even say about homosexuality!

If WE used the same language and attacks that are used on us towards gays, we'd be burned at their stakes for it.... ie: they don't even use an even scale to judge us with.
It seems ok for them to use hostile, rude combative attacks & accusations against our beliefs. They do the very thing they judge & attack us for - only worse as I see it.
I call that hypocrisy and intolerance.
It would seem that they believe hatred & judging are Ok only when THEY do it!

Now - once again I'll go into why it isn't hatred or judgmentalness on our part becuz of what we believe about sin and restoration (& ps. again, it's a myth that all judging is wrong. Judging sin is NOT forbidden by God, it's commanded. We ARE to judge whats right and wrong John 7:24)

Christians hold the same view Christ does about sin itself: SIN IS BONDAGE and sin keeps people from an unhindered relationship with God AND sin keeps people from an abundant life that Christ came to lead them to. Christians are promoting that people in any such sins FIND RELEASE FROM THOSE CHAINS OF BONDAGE to freedom in Christ instead.
John 10:10
The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy.
I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.

Romans 6:16
Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey,
you are that one’s slaves whom you obey,
whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness?

2 Peter 2:19
While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption;
for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.

Not many can view their pet sins as "bondage" becuz they love them and they fulfill & gratify our sin nature which makes us feel good in the natural sense; it's natural for us to like what is wrong for us.
But once you ARE free from them, that's when you see the bondage they were. There are a few things in my own personal life that I can attest to that being fact; one of them was drinking alcohol - and alot of it.

I didn't view my sins as "bondage" - but once you're on the other side of them, you see that they really were when that veil is lifted off your eyes!!

IF people who are fanatically pro gay would stop and see what we're saying and WHY we say it, they'de see that it's rooted in LOVE when we say something is wrong and needs to be stopped, then they might get a revelation about our intentions.
But many of those people I believe are blinded by their own hatred and won't be able to see those facts about us. So be it.

I'd also add that we as Christians have to stop our own sins too - we don't just preach that gays have to turn from their sins while we skip along our merry way down the same destructive paths; we also have to do the same with our own sins that we're prone to. EVERYBODY has pet sin/sins that they struggle with.

It's one thing to admit what it is and continue working on it, it's quite another to just dismiss it to say "it is not sin" so we can continue in it without having to feel the guilt.

 

[LightHorseman]

But rarely do these people ever stop to look at their own hatred against the one's they're attacking! (pro homosexual against conservative Christian). Their ad hom bombs & hateful accusations (I believe some are flat out lying) are actually MUCH MUCH worse than what conservative Christians even say about homosexuality!

If WE used the same language and attacks that are used on us towards gays, we'd be burned at their stakes for it.... ie: they don't even use an even scale to judge us with.

I don't know that thats fair... i mean, I have yet to see a more "liberal" Christian make up false claims that "conservative" Christians are the biggest health threat facing a nation, or that being a "conservative" Christian results in direct, immediate empirical harm to the person in question, indeed, I can't think of a single example of "liberal" Christians making up false witness against "conservative" Christians, yet I can cite you examples in this very thread of "conservative" Christians making up blatant lies about homosexuals. Nor hav I seen any "liberal" Christians claim that "conservative" Christians who commit suicide deserve to die and are unworthy of any sympathy, or similarly offensive insensitive posts, which seem targeted at homosexuals quite commonly. All these claims I have seen made by "conservative" Christians in these threads in the last few days.

All I have ever seen the more "liberal" Christians say is "Hey, try accepting people for who they are, and leave the judging up to God"... I have to say, the "gays are plague bearers/threat to society/suicide worthy/deviant" point of view looks a bit harsher than the "if you don't like it, don't do it, but let people live their lives" point of view

(conservative and liberal are quotated as I write because I deeply disaprove of their use in this context, as i consider myself deeply conservative by any realistic definition, yet am frequently labelled a "liberal" here)

 

[stumpjumper]

MOD HAT POST

This thread is closed for review.

The discussion has strayed far from the overall topic of sin into bickering and overly personal posts. Everyone needs to address the post or topic not the posters.

Whether or not you all hate each other is not the topic.

ETA: After further staff discussion, thread closed permanently.