Sin & HS

[InSpiritInTruth]

Ephesians 4:30
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

 

[seekertruth72]

If we are the temple of God, where God resides, how is it possible for us to have sin?
And if we have sin, does that mean we don't believe?

Its possible to grieve Gods Spirit within us. Its about being renewed in our minds by putting away evil things and doing good instead. Maybe not concentrating on the word sin so much can be helpful, we can instead focus on putting off the old and putting on the new, focus on not grieving gods spirit and instead focus on being renewed in our minds.

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.


Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

 

[Giver]

No! Sin/Satan cannot abide in the same house with God.

A person who is baptized in Jesus name, and receives the Holy Spirit, is able to live the whole Word of God. When this person lives the whole word of God then Jesus and the Father make a home in that person. Sin/Satan can’t live in the same home.

(John 14:21-23) “Whoever holds to my commandments and keeps them is the one who loves me; and whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I shall love him and reveal myself to him. Judas –not Judas Iscariot – said to him, ‘Lord, what has happened that you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world? Jesus replied: Anyone who loves me will keep my word and my Father will love him, and we shall come to him and make a home in him.”


John tells us that one who sins has never seen God nor does he or she know God. If one were a temple of God it would be reasonable to believe he or she would know God. That says to me that one who knows God does not sin.

(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “ Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”

 

[seekertruth72]

No! Sin/Satan cannot abide in the same house with God.

A person who is baptized in Jesus name, and receives the Holy Spirit, is able to live the whole Word of God. When this person lives the whole word of God then Jesus and the Father make a home in that person. Sin/Satan can’t live in the same home.

(John 14:21-23) “Whoever holds to my commandments and keeps them is the one who loves me; and whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I shall love him and reveal myself to him. Judas –not Judas Iscariot – said to him, ‘Lord, what has happened that you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world? Jesus replied: Anyone who loves me will keep my word and my Father will love him, and we shall come to him and make a home in him.”


John tells us that one who sins has never seen God nor does he or she know God. If one were a temple of God it would be reasonable to believe he or she would know God. That says to me that one who knows God does not sin.

(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “ Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”

But how are we sealed by Gods spirit and still able to grieve Him as spoken of in the Ephesians scripture above? It may be more edifying to not stumble over Johns words and just obey what the apostles teach us to do, which is not to do things that grieve Gods spirit, to put off the old things and put on the new, thereby being renewed in our minds.

 

[Giver]

But how are we sealed by Gods spirit and still able to grieve Him as spoken of in the Ephesians scripture above? It may be more edifying to not stumble over Johns words and just obey what the apostles teach us to do, which is not to do things that grieve Gods spirit, to put off the old things and put on the new, thereby being renewed in our minds.

If one does not sin then he or she will not greave the Holy Spirit.

If one sins that makes the Holy Spirit greave.

 

[Going Merry]

If one does not sin then he or she will not greave the Holy Spirit.

If one sins that makes the Holy Spirit greave.

When Christ was talking about the sins of the heart, he made two examples. Lusting is adultery. Hatred is murder. As evidenced by how the apostle James sees hatred as well he calls those who hate their brothers "murderers" Anyway, Jesus also said when he was listing out all the sins that come out of a persons heart, is the sin of an evil eye. In other words, not having done a 'sin' in the traditional sense, but seeking it. For my self, I may not sin with action whatsoever for a long time. But sometimes I may 'look' for it. That's enough to make the holy spirit grieve in me, to where I feel like a terrible person for doing that.

What do you consider 'sin' ?
What is the minimal limit to be able to grieve the holy spirit?

 

[PaladinValer]

Jesus was around sinners all the time.

The Holy Spirit was with Him always.

So, therefore, yes, sin and the Holy Spirit can coexist in the same space.

Those who say they don't sin are Pelagians.

 

[Giver]

Jesus was around sinners all the time.

The Holy Spirit was with Him always.

So, therefore, yes, sin and the Holy Spirit can coexist in the same space.

Those who say they don't sin are Pelagians.

I do not sin, and I also believe in original sin.

Being around sin is much different then having sin in one, or being a sinner.

 

[seekertruth72]

If one does not sin then he or she will not greave the Holy Spirit.

If one sins that makes the Holy Spirit greave.

I agree. But how can they have Gods spirit and sin too? Its seems obvious they can.

 

[Going Merry]

I agree. But how can they have Gods spirit and sin too? Its seems obvious they can.

To me, Jesus already blotted out sin.
They 'cant' sin because the payment has been taken care of with interest.
"If anyone does sin, they have an advocate with the Father, Jesus"
Someone who speaks on behalf of - showing that the Lord blotted out their sin.

 

[Lion King]

No! Sin/Satan cannot abide in the same house with God.

A person who is baptized in Jesus name, and receives the Holy Spirit, is able to live the whole Word of God. When this person lives the whole word of God then Jesus and the Father make a home in that person. Sin/Satan can’t live in the same home.

(John 14:21-23) “Whoever holds to my commandments and keeps them is the one who loves me; and whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I shall love him and reveal myself to him. Judas –not Judas Iscariot – said to him, ‘Lord, what has happened that you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world? Jesus replied: Anyone who loves me will keep my word and my Father will love him, and we shall come to him and make a home in him.”


John tells us that one who sins has never seen God nor does he or she know God. If one were a temple of God it would be reasonable to believe he or she would know God. That says to me that one who knows God does not sin.

(1 John 3: 5 - 6) “ Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him.”

This man speaks the TRUTH! Sin cannot co-exist with the Holy-Spirit in the temple of God (body). Can a person be clean and unclean at the same time?

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: you cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils. 1 Corinthians 10:21


Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house. Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Matthew 12:29-30

 

[seekertruth72]

To me, Jesus already blotted out sin.
They 'cant' sin because the payment has been taken care of with interest.
"If anyone does sin, they have an advocate with the Father, Jesus"
Someone who speaks on behalf of - showing that the Lord blotted out their sin.

Yes thats the way i see it too. That's why i think its more edifying to concentrate less on the word sin and more on not doing things that grieve Him.

 

[seekertruth72]

This man speaks the TRUTH! Sin cannot co-exist with the Holy-Spirit in the temple of God (body). Can a person be clean and unclean at the same time?

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: you cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils. 1 Corinthians 10:21


Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house. Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Matthew 12:29-30

No one is advocating that its ok to sin. We are just studying what John actually means by using the writings from Paul.

 

[seekertruth72]

We are clean by the word that the Lord spoke. But we must still abide in Him and not grieve His spirit.


Joh 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Joh 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

 

[Giver]

No one is advocating that its ok to sin. We are just studying what John actually means by using the writings from Paul.

(2 Peter 3:15-16) “Think of our Lord’s patience as your opportunity to be saved: our brother Paul, who is so dear to us, told you this when he wrote to you with the wisdom that is his special gift. He always writes like this when he deals with this sort of subject, and this makes some points in his letter hard to understand; these are the points that uneducated and unbalanced people distort, in the same way as they distort the rest of scripture a fatal thing for them to do.”

 

[Giver]

I agree. But how can they have Gods spirit and sin too? Its seems obvious they can.

Infants in Christ can sin, but do they have the Holy Spirit?

Paul says they are not yet spiritual.

(1 Corinthians 3:1-3) “Brothers, I myself was unable to speak to you as people of the Spirit; I treated you as sensual men, still infants in Christ. What I fed you with was milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it; and indeed, you are still not ready for it since you are still unspiritual. Isn’t that obvious from all the jealousy and wrangling that there is among you, from the way that you go on behaving like ordinary people?”

 

[seekertruth72]

Infants in Christ can sin, but do they have the Holy Spirit?

Paul says they are not yet spiritual.

(1 Corinthians 3:1-3) “Brothers, I myself was unable to speak to you as people of the Spirit; I treated you as sensual men, still infants in Christ. What I fed you with was milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it; and indeed, you are still not ready for it since you are still unspiritual. Isn’t that obvious from all the jealousy and wrangling that there is among you, from the way that you go on behaving like ordinary people?”

Yes but the fact remains they are sealed by Gods spirit and can sin. But we can think we are sealed and not be i guess, Jesus will separate the sheep from the goats.


Mat_7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
2Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Mat_24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

Rom_6:19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

 

[Giver]

When Christ was talking about the sins of the heart, he made two examples. Lusting is adultery. Hatred is murder. As evidenced by how the apostle James sees hatred as well he calls those who hate their brothers "murderers" Anyway, Jesus also said when he was listing out all the sins that come out of a persons heart, is the sin of an evil eye. In other words, not having done a 'sin' in the traditional sense, but seeking it. For my self, I may not sin with action whatsoever for a long time. But sometimes I may 'look' for it. That's enough to make the holy spirit grieve in me, to where I feel like a terrible person for doing that.

What do you consider 'sin' ?
What is the minimal limit to be able to grieve the holy spirit?

Any wrongdoing is a sin. Not all sins lead to death. For a spiritual person any wrongdoing that he or she knows is wrong, and willingly commits; is a deadly sin.

(1 John 5:17) “Every kind of wrongdoing is sin, but not all sin is deadly.”

 

[seekertruth72]

No man can say Jesus is Lord except by Gods spirit, so they must have Gods spirit, even though they are infants.

 

[Going Merry]

Gods spirit should be plain, not a mental game. tbh.