sin affects the whole world (Eastern Orthodox)

[archer75]

Can anyone recommend writings by the Fathers or others among the saints on how sin affects the whole world, not just the sinner?

Thank you.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I think St Maximos gets into this, and I think you can find it in the SVS Press work on the Cosmic Christ

 

[archer75]

I think St Maximos gets into this, and I think you can find it in the SVS Press work on the Cosmic Christ

On the Cosmic Mystery of Jesus Christ?

 

[ArmyMatt]

On the Cosmic Mystery of Jesus Christ?

yeah, I think he gets into it in there (and I know he does somewhere in his writings)

 

[rusmeister]

In general, what we do affects others. That’s why libertarianism is so wrong, not merely as a political theory, but even as a theological approach to our actions and their spiritual consequences. Our sin is, so to speak, not merely our own private business. That’s why, before we walk up to comfession at the head of the line, we turn and bow to the others behind us, why we say to everyone in general at the point, however quietly, “Forgive me!”, with the response of “I forgive, and God forgives”.
(Less popular observation):
That ‘s why I’ve harped on divorce as generally wrong for us as Christians. It’s the same principle. My marriage is indeed your business. My divorce damages you all, just as my sin does, though I perceive it not.

 

[ArmyMatt]

there would also be the Fathers’ commentaries on Genesis as well

 

[Light of the East]

In general, what we do affects others. That’s why libertarianism is so wrong, not merely as a political theory, but even as a theological approach to our actions and their spiritual consequences. Our sin is, so to speak, not merely our own private business. That’s why, before we walk up to comfession at the head of the line, we turn and bow to the others behind us, why we say to everyone in general at the point, however quietly, “Forgive me!”, with the response of “I forgive, and God forgives”.
(Less popular observation):

That‘s why I’ve harped on divorce as generally wrong for us as Christians. It’s the same principle. My marriage is indeed your business. My divorce damages you all, just as my sin does, though I perceive it not.

This is one of the BIG differences I see (and deeply appreciate) between my former BCC (so-called "Orthodox in Communion with Rome.") and the parish I am going to now. When I was waiting to be chrismated last spring, we had the Forgiveness Sunday of the first week of Lent. After Divine Liturgy, we filed outside the church on a beautiful spring day, and one by one, we would approach each other and say, "Forgive me a sinner." To which the appropriate answer was given "God forgives and I forgive." Then, having done this, we would take out place as next in line until the line stretched from one end of the parish yard to the other, each person coming down the line repeating the same formula.

Why is this so important? Because as St. Paul and Rusmeister state, our sins DO AFFECT the whole of the Body of Christ. We do not live in a vacuum. The Sunday of Forgiveness is a beautiful time to reflect upon this fact and ask others, of whom my sin has affected negatively, for their forgiveness. I never heard this once explained or approached like this the particular BCC parish I was in. The people seemed confused as to why they were approaching a person they didn't even know and asking forgiveness.

Every Orthodox parish needs to be sure that it is understood how our sins affect others and why we do what we do on this wonderful Sunday of Forgiveness.

 

[peregrinus2017]

Not quite what you asked, but approaching it from the other side, how righteousness effects the whole world.
This is from Elder Sophronys' book 'Saint Silouan the Athonite'.


The ontological unity of humanity is such that every separate individual overcoming evil in himself inflicts such a defeat on cosmic evil that its consequences have a beneficial effect on the destinies of the whole world. On the other hand, the nature of cosmic evil is such that, vanquished in certain human hypostases [persons] it suffers a defeat the significance and extent of which are quite disproportionate to the number of individuals concerned.

A single saint is an extraordinarily precious phenomenon for all mankind. By the mere fact of their existence – unknown, maybe, to the world but known to God – the saints draw down on the world, on all humanity, a great benediction from God. The Staretz [St. Silouan] writes:

‘Because of these people, I believe the Lord preserves the world, for they are precious in His sight, and God always listens to His humble servants and we are all of us all right because of their prayers.’

‘Prayer keeps the world alive and when prayer fails, the world will perish…”Nowadays,” perhaps you will say, “there are no more monks like that to pray for the whole world.” But I tell you that when there are no more men of prayer on earth, the world will come to an end and great disasters will befall. They have already started.’

 

[ArmyMatt]

I am sure there are also scattered nuggets in the Philokalia.

 

[archer75]

Not quite what you asked, but approaching it from the other side, how righteousness effects the whole world.
This is from Elder Sophronys' book 'Saint Silouan the Athonite'.


The ontological unity of humanity is such that every separate individual overcoming evil in himself inflicts such a defeat on cosmic evil that its consequences have a beneficial effect on the destinies of the whole world. On the other hand, the nature of cosmic evil is such that, vanquished in certain human hypostases [persons] it suffers a defeat the significance and extent of which are quite disproportionate to the number of individuals concerned.

A single saint is an extraordinarily precious phenomenon for all mankind. By the mere fact of their existence – unknown, maybe, to the world but known to God – the saints draw down on the world, on all humanity, a great benediction from God. The Staretz [St. Silouan] writes:

‘Because of these people, I believe the Lord preserves the world, for they are precious in His sight, and God always listens to His humble servants and we are all of us all right because of their prayers.’

‘Prayer keeps the world alive and when prayer fails, the world will perish…”Nowadays,” perhaps you will say, “there are no more monks like that to pray for the whole world.” But I tell you that when there are no more men of prayer on earth, the world will come to an end and great disasters will befall. They have already started.’

Great quote, thank you

 

[IoanC]

As far as causation, God sometimes gets angry because of our sin. Orthodox prayers contain this element, and prayers to The Theotokos are very efficient because She can intercede for us which stops Her Son's anger.

Based on this, we could say our sin affects God primarily, but not literally because God cannot suffer. Theoretically, God has to fix what we break. But He left us The Theotokos,so we don't worry about this.

 

[The Liturgist]

I am sure there are also scattered nuggets in the Philokalia.

Indeed, texts 14-15 in One Hundred Texts On the Practice of the Virtues by Nikitas Stithatos, which is one of my favorite writings in the Philokalia, come to mind as addressing this issue of sin making us an enemy of creation.

 

[Light of the East]

As far as causation, God sometimes gets angry because of our sin. Orthodox prayers contain this element, and prayers to The Theotokos are very efficient because She can intercede for us which stops Her Son's anger.

Based on this, we could say our sin affects God primarily, but not literally because God cannot suffer. Theoretically, God has to fix what we break. But He left us The Theotokos,so we don't worry about this.

Please understand, I am not trying to start a fight here, but this whole idea of "God's Anger" sounds very Roman Catholic to me. I see this all the time in so many of the posts by Catholic "seers," that God is angry and only the Theotokos is holding back His arm from administering a serious whuppin'. There is a healthy fear of sin, and admission of our sins, in Orthodoxy, but the "Angry God" is just not that which I have heard all that much in Orthodoxy.

 

[prodromos]

As far as causation, God sometimes gets angry because of our sin.

Diseased eyes suffer pain when they look upon the same light that healthy eyes experience with pleasure. The light does not change with our sin, our experience does.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Indeed, texts 14-15 in One Hundred Texts On the Practice of the Virtues by Nikitas Stithatos, which is one of my favorite writings in the Philokalia, come to mind as addressing this issue of sin making us an enemy of creation.

thanks!

 

[The Liturgist]

Please understand, I am not trying to start a fight here, but this whole idea of "God's Anger" sounds very Roman Catholic to me. I see this all the time in so many of the posts by Catholic "seers," that God is angry and only the Theotokos is holding back His arm from administering a serious whuppin'. There is a healthy fear of sin, and admission of our sins, in Orthodoxy, but the "Angry God" is just not that which I have heard all that much in Orthodoxy.

Indeed, Metropolitan Kallistos Ware, memory eternal, decried the concept of the Angry Father as harmful to the retention and conversion of people to Christ when explaining Orthodox soteriology in his lecture Salvation In Christ. Which has been on YouTube for years.

And the model @prodromos outlined is what I have always read in EO texts, and it makes much more sense in terms of God being immutable.