Show me evidence for Noah's flood.

[bhsmte]

Do me the courtesy of addressing my points! You don't just get to ignore each and every one of my legitimate addressals pretending I either didn't make them or that they othewise don't count.

You started this thread to provide all this 'supposed' evidence so you can't be taken seriously if you then pull a stunt like this.

Address my arguments or concede the point.

Good luck with that.

You will continue to get this response; I have given you plenty of scientific evidence to state the bible is 100% true. Of course, you will have received zero evidence, but I think the poster needs to convince himself, what he is saying is somehow true.

 

[Acts2:38]

I think you need to look the word up in Hebrew. There is clearly a difference between the word adamah and the word erets. "Adamah (Biblical Hebrew : אדמה) is a word, translatable as ground or earth, which occurs in the Biblical account of Creation of the Book of Genesis." (Wiki) Adamah is a word used for the land that Adam came from. Eden in the Bible was a bio diverse eco system. This is something you can read about in your High School Biology book .

Also you have to realize that Noah's flood is a Paradigm that has many meaning and applications. So the Bible needs to be very exact and precise in the way this Paradigm is presented. We see this when Moses talks about the temple. Every tiny detail in the temple has meaning and a lesson to be learned.

Noah's flood as a paradigm represents a world wide flood. But his flood in his day was what we would call a local flood. You got to get real and join us in the real world. There is overwhelming scientific evidence to show that Noah's flood was NOT a world wide flood.

Look, the bible was made for the 5-7 grade reading levels. I will not be fooled into thinking that, for example, verses 19 and 20 are meant to be local and not everything. You just cannot get passed the context friend.

אֲדָמָה ʼădâmâh, ad-aw-maw'; from H119; soil (from its general redness):—country, earth, ground, husband(-man) (-ry), land.

Yes, the word earth is included in the description of "earth" in Genesis chapters 6-8. Meant to mean, earth.

Just follow the context:

Gen.7:19 = And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth (adamah); and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven (the part you missed), were covered.

By indicating to all who read, even saying land, instead of earth, would indicate ALL land under the "whole heaven". This means everything, all lands. The entire earth.

Gen 7:21 = And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:

Lets just throw another one in here and combine this example here,

Genesis 7:19 = And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.

Again, even if adamah was meant to mean just land, and not earth, you are still faced with the dilemma of the word "all" and "every".

Let me give an example:

If I were to say, "Give me all the cookies you have, every last one"

Does this mean...

1- Just the ones in the living room
2- Just the ones on the left side of the house
3- Just the ones at your work office
4- All the cookies you own no matter the location of the cookies

When "all" and "every" are used, it implies, no, directly states that I mean every last single cookie you have that you own regardless of location. If you own it, I want it.

The case is the same when it says "all the high hills...under the whole heaven" and "every man" etc etc, when "all flesh died".

I believe what you have missed is context when combining the word "adamah" with words like "all", "every", and "under the whole heaven".

When faced with that combination, you are forced with the conclusion that it was the entire earth.

Noah's flood as a paradigm represents a world wide flood. But his flood in his day was what we would call a local flood. You got to get real and join us in the real world. There is overwhelming scientific evidence to show that Noah's flood was NOT a world wide flood.

I am in the real world friend. My reading comprehension is not lacking either. I have also seen the scientific evidence as well. Fish bones found in the Nevada great basin, fish bones found in the Himalayas, fish bones found in many places around the world that would not be otherwise possible unless the flood was indeed world wide, covering all the earth. Just a tiny sample of evidence.

Noah also would not have needed and ark as God could have sent him elsewhere. Noah would not have needed God to gather ALL the animals 2 by 2 if it were local. God could have just sent the animals elsewhere. These actions would have been pointless if it were local.

Side note: You do know that the Ararat Mountain range has a peak height of almost 17k feet, right? I will leave you with this thought about how in the world that flood could possibly be local. Let's be real.

Its like you skip all the fine print. If you had to sign a contract, you make it seem like your one of those ones that read the first few lines, gets board and then skips to the bottom and signs not seeing the rest of the information. Even if you did read it, would you even see it correctly since you cannot decipher the context of sentence structure.

You make God a liar. God is the true author of scripture. Sure Moses's hand jotted the words of the first five books, but it was God who moved him to do so (2 Peter 1:21). God is the one who is the true author (2 Timothy 3:16). By telling us the God didn't say "all flesh died...every man" and "water prevailed...upon the earth...all the high hills covered... under the whole heaven", you call Him a liar. And if you are not calling Him a liar, you are surely saying that God made a mistake.

I am happy to see that you attempted to fight the case for God, however you hinder it by giving out false information and leading people to believe something that is entirely wrong and proven wrong.

informational link for you, if you cared to see.

http://genesisapologetics.com/wp-co...Facts-Was-the-Genesis-Flood-Local-3-23-15.pdf

 

[joshua 1 9]

Look, the bible was made for the 5-7 grade reading levels.

Yes and I have seen PhD is science that did not have a third grade level of understanding of the Bible. Paul tells us to AVOID the genealogies because of the endless arguments.

I will not be fooled into thinking that, for example, verses 19 and 20 are meant to be local and not everything.

Believe whatever you want, I don't care, it does not matter to me. I can only answer for myself when people ask me what I believe.

If you want to say the whole earth was flooded then that would mean the Bible is not true because all of the evidence snows us that the entire earth was not flooded at the time of Noah. That does not mean there was no world wide flood. We know that there was a world wide flood at time of Pangaea was broken up. Usually when the world was flooded with water the water was frozen and science calls this a snowball earth. If you read Jonathan Cahn's book about how the Bible is written to be a Paradigm then you can see that Noah's flood was written to be a Paradigm of a flood at a different point in time that involved the whole world. But if your going to say that Noah's flood around 4500 years ago was a world wide flood then you are going to have to say that science is not true. Because there is overwhelming scientific evidence to show us that Noah's flood was not a world wide flood.

Think about it. In the South Pacific there are over 10,000 islands. Each and every island has their own bio diverse ecology. Noah would have to go to every one of those islands, pick up the animals on that island, then after the flood take them back to where he got them. Actually if you study the islands you will see that the bio diversity was established during the ice age when the water level was a lot lower.

But this is high school science and you do not want to go there and function at the level of a high school graduate. Which is fine with me if that is what you want to do.

 

[joshua 1 9]

You make God a liar.

Careful that you are not guilty of what you accuse others of. God does not give you the ability to judge me. He only gives you the ability to judge yourself and your own heart.

The fact remains that Noah's flood in 2348 BC was not a world wide flood. There have been lots of world wide floods. Science tells us there has been 6 extinctions. What you need to do is study the shadow and types in the Bible and then you will understand why the story is written the way Moses wrote the story of Noah and Noah's flood. Have you ever studies remnant theology when God says he will save a remnant of the people to repopulate the earth? We can go into all of that if you want.

 

[bhsmte]

Careful that you are not guilty of what you accuse others of. God does not give you the ability to judge me. He only gives you the ability to judge yourself and your own heart.

The fact remains that Noah's flood in 2348 BC was not a world wide flood. There have been lots of world wide floods. Science tells us there has been 6 extinctions. What you need to do is study the shadow and types in the Bible and then you will understand why the story is written the way Moses wrote the story of Noah and Noah's flood. Have you ever studies remnant theology when God says he will save a remnant of the people to repopulate the earth? We can go into all of that if you want.

Provide scientific evidence, for these "lots" of world wide floods.

 

[Speedwell]

Look, the bible was made for the 5-7 grade reading levels.

An interesting proposition. How do you know?

 

[joshua 1 9]

Provide scientific evidence, for these "lots" of world wide floods.

It would have been faster for you to run a google search then to ask me to do a google search for you. I am talking about the 6 extinctions. Also I was talking about the snowball earth. When the earth is covered with water that water is frozen. The main extinction we are talking about was when Pangaea was broken up and the ice age that took place after that.

 

[joshua 1 9]

An interesting proposition. How do you know?

I took four teacher training classes at the university. We start the students when they are around one year old. We get them to march and sing. You can get a graduate level degree in the Bible also. Something for everyone at any level. The Bible is written for everyone at every level. The level we were talking is the level of a High School Graduate.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

It would have been faster for you to run a google search then to ask me to do a google search for you. I am talking about the 6 extinctions. Also I was talking about the snowball earth. When the earth is covered with water that water is frozen. The main extinction we are talking about was when Pangaea was broken up and the ice age that took place after that.

As I've already demonstrated, Google searches don't support your case. YOU need to demonstrate why YOU believe this to support your claim that it's concordant to the Bible.

 

[joshua 1 9]

As I've already demonstrated, Google searches don't support your case.

What you have failed to demonstrate is that you are even following the conversation.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Gen.7:19 = And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth (adamah); and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven (the part you missed), were covered.

This is consistent with the current belief that Eden is under the Persian gulf. Again we are talking about a Paradigm or a shadow and type that goes far beyond Noah's flood. Still Noah's flood in Noah's day was not a world wide flood.

you make it seem like your one of those ones that read the first few lines, gets board and then skips to the bottom and signs not seeing the rest of the information.

O come on. Every point your making you learned somewhere. None of this is original to you. It is all someone else argument that has been around a while.

What I have studies are the dinosaur bones that we find in the Rocky Mountains from New Mexico all the way up to Wyoming. These fossilized bones come from the continent of Pangaea. This is a time when the whole world was effected.

 

[joshua 1 9]

there is no evidence for a global flood.

There is plenty of evidence for a global flood. Just not at the time of Noah. That is why Noah's flood is a shadow and a type of the global flood that took place hundreds of million of years ago.

 

[Gene2memE]

There is plenty of evidence for a global flood.

No, there is not.

What there is plenty of evidence for is large scale fluctuations in global mean sea level. There is strong evidence of rapid rises in sea level by around 140 meters over the past ~20,000 years, with a peak mean seal level compared to the present day of about +9 meters somewhere around 8500 to 9,000 years ago.

That's not the same as a "global flood" though. Not even remotely the same.

Just not at the time of Noah. That is why Noah's flood is a shadow and a type of the global flood that took place hundreds of million of years ago.

Even if you accept that Noah was a real person who lived circa 4300-4400 years ago, there's no evidence of widescale flooding in the Near East or Mediterranean around that period. Or, at least, none that I'm aware of.

In fact, the only major climactic event around that period ago is the opposite of widescale flooding - there was a major (perhaps more than a century long) dry period and acidification about 42000 years ago that is linked to the relatively rapid collapse of several of the major human civilisations at the time (Egyptian, Indus valley, Akkadian and various Chinese cultures, to mention a few).

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

What you have failed to demonstrate is that you are even following the conversation.

and You've just failed to demonstrate.

 

[Tolworth John]

Yes, this is true. In spite of "evidence" given by young earth creationists, there is no evidence for a global flood. Or I should say, the evidence presented is woefully inadequate when compared with the evidence of modern geological science. I mean, heck; there is even evidence that the moon landing was a hoax, that the earth is flat, that 9/11 was via demolition not airplanes, chemtrails, and etc.

It is strange how some Christians insist on reading into the bible rather than reading out what it actuaky says.

Casn you point to where the bible says that the flood was local.

Also on whatgrounds do you say that theevidence is lacking for a global flood?
The evidence is the same, what is different is the world view used to interpret the evidence.

It's is either a Christian young earth or a Christian influenced by atheism old earth view.

 

[AV1611VET]

In spite of "evidence" given by young earth creationists, there is no evidence for a global flood.

God is a master at clean-up, isn't He?

Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

No scars.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

It would have been faster for you to run a google search then to ask me to do a google search for you. I am talking about the 6 extinctions. Also I was talking about the snowball earth. When the earth is covered with water that water is frozen. The main extinction we are talking about was when Pangaea was broken up and the ice age that took place after that.

And where exactly are you showing that the extinction events are linked to global floods? Because from the graph you've provided, not a single one has been caused by a flood of any magnitude.

 

[DogmaHunter]

I assume what you are asking for is scientific evidence going back to the time of Noah when Noah was alive here on the earth. This would involve evidence like archeology and that would require a time and a place. Just WHEN and WHERE did Noah's flood take place.

Noah was a real live historical person. The date of Noah's flood was between the end of October and the beginning of November in 2370 BCE according to Bishop Ussher. The question is what flooded. According to Bible Hub the word is bā·’ā·reṣ with 155 Occurrences. So YOU have to wake up and smell the coffee. What does bā·’ā·reṣ mean and just exactly what was flooded. Genesis 5:11 "The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence." "13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth."

Right now the evidence from Google earth satellite photos indicated that the the area of Noah's flood is under the Persian Gulf. This is based on Genesis 2:10 "And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads." After the river left the garden of eden it parted into four rivers. So if you want to find the Garden of Eden and the location for Noah's flood you have to study the remains of ancient rivers. We do this using the cameras on space satellites developed for use by the military. This is new technology and this gives us new information that past generations did not have available for them to use when trying to understand the story of Noah & what we read about Noah in our Bible. Could be someone in the military right now using space photos of the Persian gulf to make a determination of exactly what flooded and where the Garden of Eden was.

Lost Civilization May Have Existed Beneath the Persian Gulf

What other evidence do we have?

What you stated above was anything but evidence....
You just made a bunch of claims. Basically, you just told the story.

You didn't give any evidence whatsoever.

Lets think about what exactly was ON Noah's ARK. Again you want scientific evidence so we have to go to the experts on Botany, or the ancient plants in the Middle East. The experts have PhD's on the evolution of plants. Mostly they publish in peer review articles. Sometimes they put a collection of articles into a book. They are professors and teach at the universities in Jerusalem. This is what we call experts. I have actually done a far amount of study on this if anyone wants to have a conversation about it.

I ONLY want to make ONE comment right now. IF you put the plant seeds on the ark the plant is no longer a wild plant is is now domesticated. Wild plants require the wind or natural elements to distribute their seeds. Cultivated plants requires man to be a part of the equation. Everything on Noah's Ark was domesticated nothing was wild. All the plants and all of the animals from the Garden of Eden was on Noah's Ark. Evolutionary theory tells us a LOT about the Garden of Eden. Evolutionary theory knows a lot about Bio Diverse Eco Systems. From beginning to end. This is why science uses the words: "Adam", "Eve" & "Eden" a lot. We know exactly who Adam and Eve in the Bible were because we have their genealogies in the Bible. Abraham, Noah, Moses, David and Jesus were all descended from the Adam and Eve we read about in our Bible. We know Adam and Eve in the Bible that lived 6,000 years ago were Hebrew or Jewish or whatever the correct term is. God gave the descendants of Abraham the entire Arab Continental Plate. This area 1500 miles by 1500 miles in the future will be the New Jerusalem. Abraham's covenant with God is perpetual from age to age and from generation to generation. This is a big fight among the descendants of Abraham for the land and the mineral rights to the land and the air space above their land. This is a fight between the son of Abraham's wife Sarah and the son from Sarah's handmaiden the Egyptian Hagar. Gentiles are adopted into the family of God (Abraham) We are not natural descendants of Abraham. We are wild branches grafted into a domesticated tree because the natural branches did not produce fruit and they were thrown into the fire.

Genesis 2 "8 And the Lord God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed."

I could go on and on about all of this. Lots of books could be written to show evidence for Noah and Noah's flood. This is just a post: pixels on a computer screen. So I am limited on just how much evidence I can give you one post.

I like how you first make a brief mention of botany and universities, and then switch to biblical preaching again and then call it "evidence.

 

[DogmaHunter]

"Show me evidence of Noah and of the flood"

A global flood would have global consquences.
Had it been less that a global flood Noah would have been told to leave the area, travel to the distant mountains etc.
But he was told to build a structure some 400 feet long, for a local flood!

In Noah's defense, in the movie "Evan Almighty", Evan is also told to build a gigantic ark and at the end (spoiler alert) it just so happens that it's just a dam breaking.

So, as demonstrated in that movie, it is perfectly reasonable to build a physically impossible ark to save animals that don't even live in the area to be saved from a flood in that area, which otherwise wouldn't have affected them at all in the first place.

/end-sarcasm

 

[DogmaHunter]

the rainbow - as to God promised to never flood the world again by water-He will not destroy it by water like in the past.

uhu...

The name Egypt - is from one of the grandsons of Noah.
land of Canaan - name of a grandson of Noah

But outdate abrahamic religion.

We eat animals now, not just grains, seeds and such.

We've been doing that since prehistoric times.

It seems that seasons started then too.

Is that why ice cores at the poles show hundreds of thousands of layers of winter/summer cycles?