Sex and Fasting

[Hermit76]

I was recently asked about the restrictions EOs have for sexual relations during fasting times. Can some of you ORTHODOX folk comment on your understanding of the restrictions?

 

[truefiction1]

This is generally a matter determined between those joined in Holy Matrimony, and with the pastoral council of a qualified minister if warranted.

 

[Hermit76]

This is generally a matter determined between those joined in Holy Matrimony, and with the pastoral council of a qualified minister if warranted.

This individual seemed to think that all Orthodox married couples were forbidden to have sex during all fasts and on the evening before partaking of the Eucharist.

 

[ArmyMatt]

generally abstaining from sex is a part of fasting. to help focus on prayer and the spiritual life. however, this is something to discuss with your priest.

 

[Hermit76]

generally abstaining from sex is a part of fasting. to help focus on prayer and the spiritual life. however, this is something to discuss with your priest.

Would that include Lent and Nativity fasts?

Yes, I told him it was a matter to discuss with a Priest.

 

[truefiction1]

This individual seemed to think that all Orthodox married couples were forbidden to have sex during all fasts and on the evening before partaking of the Eucharist.

No Orthodox married couples are forbidden to have sex during fasting periods because abstinence for the purpose of prayer and fasting is something that is done on the basis of mutual consent of the husband and wife. It is not a good idea whatsoever to have sex when preparing to have Communion. As a rule most devout Orthodox Christians abstain during this preparation period, from before Vespers until after Liturgy. It is good if a married couple does abstain through the fasting periods and receives greater gifts of grace as a result, but there aren't any mandates being issued by the Church hierarchy in this regard.

Your priest should be good person to talk to about this matter.

 

[Hermit76]

No Orthodox married couples are forbidden to have sex during fasting periods because abstinence for the purpose of prayer and fasting is something that is done on the basis of mutual consent of the husband and wife. It is not a good idea whatsoever to have sex when preparing to have Communion. As a rule most devout Orthodox Christians abstain during this preparation period, from before Vespers until after Liturgy. It is good if a married couple does abstain through the fasting periods and receives greater gifts of grace as a result, but there aren't any mandates being issued by the Church hierarchy in this regard.

This was my understanding. I think my friend read a rather zealous priest's thoughts.

Interesting enough I held that there should be abstinence before communion when I was a Protestant. I never knew why. It just seemed the right thing to do.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Would that include Lent and Nativity fasts?

Yes, I told him it was a matter to discuss with a Priest.

it can, again there are priests who are strict and some who are lenient.

 

[gzt]

Yeah, doing that fasting is probably a relatively advanced thing to do. Frankly, I'd recommend against even discussing it with one's priest.

 

[truefiction1]

This was my understanding. I think my friend read a rather zealous priest's thoughts.

Interesting enough I held that there should be abstinence before communion when I was a Protestant. I never knew why. It just seemed the right thing to do.

We learn a lot of things just from spiritual experience, and can know other things intuitively.

I have found yet another example of this phenomena in nature. It was found by observing male emperor penguins, that they didn't suffer any physical harm even though they abstain completely from eating any food for 40 days while they sit on the eggs laid by their female mates. Certain scientists were curious to know whether or not this same ability to fast from eating any food for 40 days applied to all other animal species or was limited only to these penguins. Their studies showed that all animals, including us humans, can go exactly 40 days without eating any food without endangering our health, but after that if we don't eat we will begin to move towards dying. How is it that we have always known that the number 40 has such significance in our spiritual and physical being? Now we know for certain that our Lord fasted to the "brink of death", as I once heard it said of Him and His forty day fast in the "wilderness".

Do we need even more evidence that the 40 day fasts of the Church are crucial elements of our spiritual lives? Just sharing some random musings.

EDIT: I must also add that the researcher came to the conclusion that we are not made, physically, to eat all the time. On the contrary, our physical health is optimized by long periods of abstinence from eating food altogether. They claim that there is mounting evidence that many of our common diseases such as heart disease, cancer, diabetes, etc. are so prevalent as they are because we don't fast. If this is all true, then by not fasting we are not only killing our spirits, but our bodies as well. Hmmmph!

 

[truefiction1]

I don't want to derail the thread, but this is the documentary we watched called "The Science of Fasting" here:

Its less than an hour long. As I watched and listened I was struck by how the things I was hearing aligned with our Holy Tradition and Scripture. As an Orthodox Christian one cannot help but be blown away by the uncanny "coincidences" that leap out of the screen and off of the words of the narrator and interviewees. Check it out sometime when your bored and have some time to indiscriminately kill.

 

[Hermit76]

I don't want to derail the thread, but this is the documentary we watched called "The Science of Fasting" here:

Its less than an hour long. As I watched and listened I was struck by how the things I was hearing aligned with our Holy Tradition and Scripture. As an Orthodox Christian one cannot help but realize the significance of it. Check it out sometime when your bored and have some time to indiscriminately kill.

You're not derailing... If anyone wants to discuss any other facet of fasting I'm good with it.

 

[truefiction1]

You're not derailing... If anyone wants to discuss any other facet of fasting I'm good with it.

Thanks.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Yeah, doing that fasting is probably a relatively advanced thing to do. Frankly, I'd recommend against even discussing it with one's priest.

that's precisely why you bring it up to your priest.

 

[gzt]

Nah.

 

[truefiction1]

Yeah, doing that fasting is probably a relatively advanced thing to do. Frankly, I'd recommend against even discussing it with one's priest.

that's precisely why you bring it up to your priest.

Your priest may be a good person to bring it up to because he may be mature and wise enough to advise either for, or against it, depending upon his discernment with regards to the couple's readiness or lack thereof. If the priest is not capable in this regard, then a couple will need to work things out on their own anyway. There's nothing to lose by bringing it up to your priest. It doesn't mean he'll be right, but there's a real good chance he could be very helpful if there is discord in the marriage over the issue of sexual abstinence. And we know that sex is a real "trouble spot" for some married couples.

 

[gzt]

There certainly is something to lose: he could give you stupid advice.

 

[Hermit76]

There certainly is something to lose: he could give you stupid advice.

So... We should just take your advice instead?

 

[ArmyMatt]

Your priest may be a good person to bring it up to because he may be mature and wise enough to advise either for, or against it, depending upon his discernment with regards to the couple's readiness or lack thereof. If the priest is not capable in this regard, then a couple will need to work things out on their own anyway. There's nothing to lose by bringing it up to your priest. It doesn't mean he'll be right, but there's a real good chance he could be very helpful if there is discord in the marriage over the issue of sexual abstinence. And we know that sex is a real "trouble spot" for some married couples.

mostly from the priest just being an extra POV to deal with spiritual issues that could arise. and this is also not something to talk about out the gate, but as your priest comes to know you.

 

[truefiction1]

There certainly is something to lose: he could give you stupid advice.

It's very understandable that, for you, not bringing up the question of sexual abstinence during fasting periods is the proper thing to do. But not everyone has the same needs as you, or lack thereof, nor do they have the same relationship with their spouses as you do, nor do they have the same priest as you. So your approach may suitable for some, but not for others. If stupid advice is given, it'll reveal itself to have been stupid rather quickly, as marriage has unique a way of testing people and teaching lessons.

This would be something that could be asked about during an adult education class or such being led by the parish priest. I would give the priest a chance to prepare for addressing the topic by letting him know in advance that the question will be raised so that the whole group can discuss it in all of its aspects. The priest may want to carefully reflect on things so that he doesn't end up giving anybody "stupid advice".