Seek first the kingdom of God?

[Jesusthekingofking]

My pastor uses this verse frequently to persuade the congregation to contribute more to the church: 'Seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.'

However, from a rational perspective, it doesn't resonate with me. My ten years of experience in the church have shown me some negative aspects. I have had to lower my expectations in accordance with the reality that the church is akin to a small society. No one is perfect; most people are selfish. While there may be a slightly higher moral standard and a bit of love, we are still human.

Returning to the verse, if I choose to pursue specialization in my profession, I need to limit my time for church and attend only once a week. Yet, there is social pressure from members say it's better to prioritize the church. I have this in my head: Will the members pay my rent or cover my living expenses? Ya I know there are some leader who brag about their giving up. "If I go with my own way to become an engineer then I wouldn't become a pastor today"

What? you make all the engineers feel unworthy. That's your personal choice, shouldn't be a testimonial how much you give up for God.

I have started depending on myself, as I find it the most practical way. The world owes you nothing. Additionally, in matters of finding a life partner, do you think a female believer would choose someone who reads the Bible every day but has low socioeconomic status, or would she prefer someone with better finances? I witnessed a young church leader choosing a good-looking girl, and his preaching on love left me feeling uneasy. There seems to be competition and social signaling even among church leaders.

 

[tdidymas]

My pastor uses this verse frequently to persuade the congregation to contribute more to the church: 'Seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.'

However, from a rational perspective, it doesn't resonate with me. My ten years of experience in the church have shown me some negative aspects. I have had to lower my expectations in accordance with the reality that the church is akin to a small society. No one is perfect; most people are selfish. While there may be a slightly higher moral standard and a bit of love, we are still human.

Returning to the verse, if I choose to pursue specialization in my profession, I need to limit my time for church and attend only once a week. Yet, there is social pressure from members say it's better to prioritize the church. I have this in my head: Will the members pay my rent or cover my living expenses? Ya I know there are some leader who brag about their giving up. "If I go with my own way to become an engineer then I wouldn't become a pastor today"

What? you make all the engineers feel unworthy. That's your personal choice, shouldn't be a testimonial how much you give up for God.

I have started depending on myself, as I find it the most practical way. The world owes you nothing. Additionally, in matters of finding a life partner, do you think a female believer would choose someone who reads the Bible every day but has low socioeconomic status, or would she prefer someone with better finances? I witnessed a young church leader choosing a good-looking girl, and his preaching on love left me feeling uneasy. There seems to be competition and social signaling even among church leaders.

That verse (Mat. 6:33) is talking about making spiritual growth a priority, as opposed to worrying about physical needs. If a person is trusting God for guidance in life, they will obtain wisdom to be successful in all they do. This idea is in Joshua 1:8-9, Psalm 1:3, Jeremiah 17:7-8, and many other places. If someone uses that verse to guilt-trip people into giving money, that person is misusing scripture. It's an indication of the pastor's incompetence to feeding the sheep. If the people are edified by good teaching to becoming mature Christians, they will volunteer their giving, because they will see the value in scriptures like Prov. 11:25.

 

[Jesusthekingofking]

That verse (Mat. 6:33) is talking about making spiritual growth a priority, as opposed to worrying about physical needs. If a person is trusting God for guidance in life, they will obtain wisdom to be successful in all they do. This idea is in Joshua 1:8-9, Psalm 1:3, Jeremiah 17:7-8, and many other places. If someone uses that verse to guilt-trip people into giving money, that person is misusing scripture. It's an indication of the pastor's incompetence to feeding the sheep. If the people are edified by good teaching to becoming mature Christians, they will volunteer their giving, because they will see the value in scriptures like Prov. 11:25.

My point isn't about giving. But I'm saying many advice are hypocrites. It's an ideal but won't work in the real world.

If I trust myself and get my PhD done, my job pay my bill. If I drop my PhD and give time to the church just because of social pressure, who's going to pay my bills? Those who gave advice and influenced me to do such decision? They won't, they're busy about their own lives.

 

[Laodicean60]

I think too much emphasis is placed on the church. God created you to be an individual and walk in Love with humankind. Jesus walked and interacted with everyone. If you are uncomfortable now maybe God wants you to do other things. What better place to walk in love and let your love shine at a school. Sit in a quiet place pray without thinking (meditate) and listen for Gods voice. God knows your desires and needs. Merry Christmas

 

[timothyu]

Consider the Way where people sold everything and gave it to the movement. It was used to establish not a church as we know it today, but to help each other in times of need as they pursued what might be considered communal living. The was the original concept of church. But as that movement based on the counter-culture of the Kingdom rather than the world of man grew, it unfortunately became institutionalized for control rather than remain small scattered self sustaining groups/communities as intended, and the parasites within started funneling the money to the business empire they were building based on a new religion, the original church/movement becoming a splinter of the religion to this day.

 

[Peacemaker1]

Consider the Way where people sold everything and gave it to the movement. It was used to establish not a church as we know it today, but to help each other in times of need as they pursued what might be considered communal living. The was the original concept of church. But as that movement based on the counter-culture of the Kingdom rather than the world of man grew, it unfortunately became institutionalized for control rather than remain small scattered self sustaining groups/communities as intended, and the parasites within started funneling the money to the business empire they were building based on a new religion, the original church/movement becoming a splinter of the religion to this day.

Consider that what Jesus says, has not been known, understood, believed, or altered.

Here I will tell it again for us all. Treasure on earth corrupts, but treasure on earth cannot, and where our treasure is our heart is, and that is the persons own purpose to finding the hidden treasure, by getting rid of what is not hidden. ( everyones earthy treasure)




Matthew 6:19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

Matthew 13:44 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.
45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.



Here we have the very quoted thread topic, with the very same teaching of Christ, to go and sell all you had, not so you can support an organisation you say would become corrupt. ( that was never Gods wisdom that comes to nothing) but so your heart is looking at the treasures of Gods eternal wisdom, treasure in heaven.


Luke 12:1 But rather seek ye the kingdom of God; and all these things shall be added unto you.
32 Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.
33 Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves bags which wax not old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approacheth, neither moth corrupteth.
34 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
35 Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning;
36 And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.



Apostle Paul did carry on the way of Christ, and even though Paul did establish the churches, told how they would become corrupt, wolves entering the flock.

But we notice exactly the same teaching of Christ, you are called to do these things for your own good, they never stopped being the way of Jesus Christ, who like paul, had nowhere to lay his head. [ no certain dwelling place] then it is still done in faith, by knowing there is a better and lasting treasure in heaven.



Philippians 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

Hebrews 10:34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.

 

[Jesusthekingofking]

Consider that what Jesus says, has not been known, understood, believed, or altered.

Here I will tell it again for us all. Treasure on earth corrupts, but treasure on earth cannot, and where our treasure is our heart is, and that is the persons own purpose to finding the hidden treasure, by getting rid of what is not hidden. ( everyones earthy treasure)




Matthew 6:19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

Matthew 13:44 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.
45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.



Here we have the very quoted thread topic, with the very same teaching of Christ, to go and sell all you had, not so you can support an organisation you say would become corrupt. ( that was never Gods wisdom that comes to nothing) but so your heart is looking at the treasures of Gods eternal wisdom, treasure in heaven.


Luke 12:1 But rather seek ye the kingdom of God; and all these things shall be added unto you.
32 Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.
33 Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves bags which wax not old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approacheth, neither moth corrupteth.
34 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
35 Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning;
36 And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.



Apostle Paul did carry on the way of Christ, and even though Paul did establish the churches, told how they would become corrupt, wolves entering the flock.

But we notice exactly the same teaching of Christ, you are called to do these things for your own good, they never stopped being the way of Jesus Christ, who like paul, had nowhere to lay his head. [ no certain dwelling place] then it is still done in faith, by knowing there is a better and lasting treasure in heaven.



Philippians 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

Hebrews 10:34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.

so I should give studying phd and commit to church?

 

[Pekka]

Faith does not equal church. At least to me my personal seeking of Gods will is my oxygen. Get alone in room, office etc, spend time with God, approach Him in faith thru Jesus and let Him get close to as bible says. When we approach God he approaches us.

As to church I am quite allergic to the money speeches as well. I am thinking if the church focuses on following Jesus and looking for Gods will first the financials will be provided by God as well.

 

[Peacemaker1]

people prefer words of people, not words of God now, is it not seen on this forum constantly..


2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

 

[Bobber]

My pastor uses this verse frequently to persuade the congregation to contribute more to the church: 'Seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.'

It's fine for your pastor to do this. Keep in mind there's more in a congregation then just one. If you're feeling God has lead you to the type of career you're in you are Seeking First the Kingdom in doing what you need to do.

Returning to the verse, if I choose to pursue specialization in my profession, I need to limit my time for church and attend only once a week.

Take your mind off men and upon what you feel lead in your spirit what God is wanting you to do. It can be a very valid thing that God wants people with professional credentials. Main thing is keep walking in LOVE towards those who may not understand you. Actually many around you may understand you and agree you may need to do what you do. You haven't forsaken the fellowship of believers for going once a week. Acts says the general members would meet many times daily but that's not a command of scripture.

Yet, there is social pressure from members say it's better to prioritize the church.

It's best to prioritize what God is leading you to do with your life. That's the only thing you should consider. Be nice and kind and loving to all those about you though and don't get into ill will about this.

"If I go with my own way to become an engineer then I wouldn't become a pastor today"

What? you make all the engineers feel unworthy. That's your personal choice, shouldn't be a testimonial how much you give up for God.

No you're right it shouldn't. If he became a pastor he might say he was lead by God to become one. NOT EVERYONE is called to the five fold ministry. I'm sure Jesus wants different saints to the light of the world in all sorts of professions. Something that can be a possibility too. Some pastors may not have been called to become one. (not saying your pastor) but some maybe should have been in a secular job being a light in the workplace. If EVERYONE became a pastor the world may not see us much.

I witnessed a young church leader choosing a good-looking girl, and his preaching on love left me feeling uneasy. There seems to be competition and social signaling even among church leaders.

I don't know what you mean by this.

 

[Peacemaker1]

also people are lovers of their own selves, and al people have is a form of godliness, they are manifest to all men as God told..



2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

2 Timothy 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was.


2 Timothy 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.



ALSO, these people speak of the world, not of God, see their difference as they try to get away with it on this forum. ( MANY FALSE PROPHETS/TEACHERS)


1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.
6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

 

[tdidymas]

Why do you ask someone what you should do? Be convinced in your own heart what you should do. As long as you are seeking to obey God's moral will in all you do, does it matter then what you're doing? If you're convinced that your life is pleasing God, then it shouldn't matter what anyone says you should do. Just trust God to guide you, and that should be enough to satisfy. It's a matter of personal faith.

 

[Peacemaker1]

there is unified faith or no faith at all.


1 Corinthians 1:10
Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

 

[com7fy8]

You need people who help you to grow in Jesus and how He has you loving.

"And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

If a pastor is using and promoting money the wrong way, this can be because of the person's character. So, money is not the main thing, here, if this is so.

And if ministers are competing and conflicting, what matters the most is they need to be corrected by God, so they minister good example >

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 3-4)

And if they aren't helping you to grow in Jesus and are not feeding you how to love each and every person, God wants you to have hope for them and be their good example.

And make sure you are sharing with mature Christians who can see through you and help you get real correction, so you are not just criticizing while you keep having your own sin problems.

 

[oikonomia]

so I should give studying phd and commit to church?

I think you should finish the educational program.

What you should do is begin each day with having a short time with God.
It is a daily matter. God should always be an enjoyment.

Do not fret on how you should change course or dedicate the rest of your life.
Simply begin each day with a time to love God, read someting of His word, confess any known sins, offering praise and thanks to your heavenly Father and ask Him for that day's worth of Christ filling your heart.

 

[Miles]

That is one perspective. Another perspective is that if we have Jesus, if we have a reconciled relationship with our creator, then we have everything. Christians don't lose it when we suffer. Not even the martyrs lost it when they were killed. Our treasures are with God, which is where our hearts should be. This can be easier said than done, as the world can be appealing and God put us here for a reason, but eternity helps us keep perspective.

What people give up to follow Christ will vary. God blessed you with a mind and a body. Use them wisely.

Regarding people who fall for materialistic things, or are perhaps just materialistic in ways that differ from or exceed our own materialism, think of it like dodging a bullet. Personally, I wouldn't be interested in a woman who would primarily view me as a paycheck. I wouldn't want somebody like that to be my wife. I'm not saying that she shouldn't care at all that I'm gainfully employed, but it's matter of priorities. Sober reality in this case helps put an end an end to jealousy. Our primary treasures, where our hearts can be found, should be with God. Not with stuff.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

My pastor uses this verse frequently to persuade the congregation to contribute more to the church: 'Seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.'

However, from a rational perspective, it doesn't resonate with me. My ten years of experience in the church have shown me some negative aspects. I have had to lower my expectations in accordance with the reality that the church is akin to a small society. No one is perfect; most people are selfish. While there may be a slightly higher moral standard and a bit of love, we are still human.

Returning to the verse, if I choose to pursue specialization in my profession, I need to limit my time for church and attend only once a week. Yet, there is social pressure from members say it's better to prioritize the church. I have this in my head: Will the members pay my rent or cover my living expenses? Ya I know there are some leader who brag about their giving up. "If I go with my own way to become an engineer then I wouldn't become a pastor today"

What? you make all the engineers feel unworthy. That's your personal choice, shouldn't be a testimonial how much you give up for God.

I have started depending on myself, as I find it the most practical way. The world owes you nothing. Additionally, in matters of finding a life partner, do you think a female believer would choose someone who reads the Bible every day but has low socioeconomic status, or would she prefer someone with better finances? I witnessed a young church leader choosing a good-looking girl, and his preaching on love left me feeling uneasy. There seems to be competition and social signaling even among church leaders.

That pastor is twisting the Scripture for financial gain. Seeking the kingdom of God is making sure we are in the faith by reaffirming that we are trusting in the finished work of Christ on the Cross, making sure that we are filled with the Spirit every day, and departing from the works of the flesh and walking in the fruit of the Spirit. In this way, we are growing in grace, and everything that we need will be provided.

It sounds like this pastor is a disciple of the word faith prosperity movement, that if one seeks God in order to name and claim what they want from God in terms of wealth, getting more posteriors on seats, and increased offerings by teaching that if people give their money in faith, God will bless them with better bank balances, homes and motor vehicles.

 

[oikonomia]

Seeking first the the kingdom of God and His righteousness begins with some realizations:

1. ) God created all things for His eternal purpose.
2.) God loved me and saved me for this eternal purpose.
3.) Christ did die for me personally. But it was on a larger scale salvation for His eternal purpose.

One has to eventually transcend the naturally self-centered to realize ALL that the Triune God
has done, is doing, and will do is with a view towards His kingdom.
It is all or His expression and His good pleasure. All other things I need on an individual basis is no problem to God.
He will surely provide what I need. Maybe He will not provide everything I WANT. He will provide what I need.

And that too He will do with a view towards His good pleasure, His eternal purpose, His administration, and His eternal
expression in the universe.

So the One who surely was the prime example of all this taught us -

. . . For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things.
But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be added to you. (Matt. 6:32b,33)