Scripture, literal view vs liberal view

[Brieuse]

The way I see it, the Bible is something very special. I believe that it serves it's purpose for every Christian who undertakes to understand the teachings of it for historical understanding and for their guidance in their walk with God.

Somewhere along the lines of debate here, I sense some misunderstanding in how people from the liberal side tend to view the literal guys and visa versa.

I'm not sure how Uber and them will agree with my approach, but I tend to see the original scripture as the closest thing we have to learning about God. I do not desire to doubt anything in the original scripture. I have not come to any conclusions myself if there really was a single Adam and a single Eve, or if there really was a snake that could talk to Eve, and lost his legs. Or if Jonah really did get swallowed by a big fish. I believe the message behind those passages are for more important.

However, I have some doubts to the influence that man has had over the last 2000 years on translations of the original scripture, and I tend to be a little suspicious on the motives behind the translations.

 

[brightmorningstar]

Dear Brieuse,

Scripture, literal view vs liberal view

From what you have described I cant see what you mean by literal or liberal view.
I am a bit puzzled by this contradiction however…

I do not desire to doubt anything in the original scripture.

However, I have some doubts to the influence that man has had over the last 2000 years on translations of the original scripture, and I tend to be a little suspicious on the motives behind the translations.

So you do doubt that what we have is not the original scripture? Am I correct?

Therefore can I ask you how you came to the conclusion the original scripture translations have been influenced and in what way?

Furthermore as the New Testament frequently states it is a witness of all seen and heard about Jesus, how do you see this motive might affect the truth in the scriptures?

 

[ILove2Worship]

The way I see it, the Bible is something very special. I believe that it serves it's purpose for every Christian who undertakes to understand the teachings of it for historical understanding and for their guidance in their walk with God.

I agree with you here. It is something very special and something that should be taken how its written not how you want it to sound.

Somewhere along the lines of debate here, I sense some misunderstanding in how people from the liberal side tend to view the literal guys and visa versa.

Liberal side will argue to the end about it being translated wrong or whatever they want to say. The Bible has been translated for hundreds of years I think if there was a mistake someone would of caught it

I'm not sure how Uber and them will agree with my approach, but I tend to see the original scripture as the closest thing we have to learning about God. I do not desire to doubt anything in the original scripture. I have not come to any conclusions myself if there really was a single Adam and a single Eve, or if there really was a snake that could talk to Eve, and lost his legs. Or if Jonah really did get swallowed by a big fish. I believe the message behind those passages are for more important.

The stories of the Bible are meant in a way to boggle our minds to think that even the most craziest things can happen. But also, they are taught for us to learn, and you are exactly right the story is far less important to the meaning.

 

[ReformedChapin]

More like..

Conservative View vs Bible is wrong Who cares?

 

[united4Peace]

I dont believe the Bible is wrong...
Nor do I believe its Translated wrong...
I believe its our Interpretation...

I have 2 Children...they get into a fight, they both tell me their side of the fight, they both are right, they both have a different interpretation of the fight...myself I have to look at it and make up my own mind about how I see it, if my husband was there he is also going to see it differently again...
So one fight...4 different views...yet 4 truths

I do agree with you Bruise...that its whats behind the story of Jonah and the Whale or what's behind the story of Genisis rather than the question of was there a literal Adam and Eve...
Its the message behind that God wants us to see...
The Bible is complete Truth (100 %)...Historic Truth along with Poetry and metaphor

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

I do not believe there is such a thing. There is only one correct way, and we all do it wrong. Luckily that isn't what matters as long as it leads back to God. God knows more than the Bible and the Bible doesn't know everything and the Bible has every chance to be flawed. The purpose of the Bible is to be a lantern on the dark path that leads us to God, not to become our God. If we start thinking views of the Bible, we're starting to put the Bible before God.

There's no such thing. The Bible is the Bible. It's a good book, it's an excellent guild book to help aid you in understanding God and strengthening faith. But if you use it too much it becomes a crutch and God starts to fall out of the picture. The laws inside give an idea, a sketch of what is unholy, but without God of course it's just going to be words on paper.

You know what, I'm changing my mind. There are two different views of the Bible. The humanistic view and God's view. EVERYONE who says that the Bible is either completely literal, the Bible is misinterpreted/translated/whatever is right in their own effect. Okay, that's what the BIBLE is. God is not the Bible. I know ya`ll get tired of hearing it but it apparently needs to be said. God is not the Bible. And if you try to put a label on how to view the Bible, I can tell you right now they're all wrong. Liberal, literal, conservative, it's all wrong. The only appropriate view of the Bible is God's view and the only way to achieve that view is by keeping an open mind to God, to our sin and to the Bible at the same time. We seem to have a problem with this because we're always bias in favor of either the Bible or ourselves because it seems so hard to listen to God. You don't need to be a prophet to hear Him. When Christ died for us, and when we accept the Spirit, that breaks down that wall. Prophets don't exist anymore or rather any Christian is a prophet on their own.

This is becoming very long, so I'll just end it here.

 

[Der Alte]

[SIZE=-1]The way I see it, the Bible is something very special. I believe that it serves it's purpose for every Christian who undertakes to understand the teachings of it for historical understanding and for their guidance in their walk with God.

Somewhere along the lines of debate here, I sense some misunderstanding in how people from the liberal side tend to view the literal guys and visa versa.

I'm not sure how Uber and them will agree with my approach, but I tend to see the original scripture as the closest thing we have to learning about God. I do not desire to doubt anything in the original scripture. I have not come to any conclusions myself if there really was a single Adam and a single Eve, or if there really was a snake that could talk to Eve, and lost his legs. Or if Jonah really did get swallowed by a big fish. I believe the message behind those passages are for more important.

However, I have some doubts to the influence that man has had over the last 2000 years on translations of the original scripture, and I tend to be a little suspicious on the motives behind the translations.[/SIZE]

Well if all that is SPAM-Fig[SIZE=+1]*[/SIZE] then Jesus must be a liar!

Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,

Mar 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.​

[SIZE=+1]*[/SIZE] Symbolic, poetic, allegorical, metaphorical, figurative.​

 

[ReformedChapin]

I do not believe there is such a thing. There is only one correct way, and we all do it wrong. Luckily that isn't what matters as long as it leads back to God. God knows more than the Bible and the Bible doesn't know everything and the Bible has every chance to be flawed. The purpose of the Bible is to be a lantern on the dark path that leads us to God, not to become our God. If we start thinking views of the Bible, we're starting to put the Bible before God.

There's no such thing. The Bible is the Bible. It's a good book, it's an excellent guild book to help aid you in understanding God and strengthening faith. But if you use it too much it becomes a crutch and God starts to fall out of the picture. The laws inside give an idea, a sketch of what is unholy, but without God of course it's just going to be words on paper.

You know what, I'm changing my mind. There are two different views of the Bible. The humanistic view and God's view. EVERYONE who says that the Bible is either completely literal, the Bible is misinterpreted/translated/whatever is right in their own effect. Okay, that's what the BIBLE is. God is not the Bible. I know ya`ll get tired of hearing it but it apparently needs to be said. God is not the Bible. And if you try to put a label on how to view the Bible, I can tell you right now they're all wrong. Liberal, literal, conservative, it's all wrong. The only appropriate view of the Bible is God's view and the only way to achieve that view is by keeping an open mind to God, to our sin and to the Bible at the same time. We seem to have a problem with this because we're always bias in favor of either the Bible or ourselves because it seems so hard to listen to God. You don't need to be a prophet to hear Him. When Christ died for us, and when we accept the Spirit, that breaks down that wall. Prophets don't exist anymore or rather any Christian is a prophet on their own.

This is becoming very long, so I'll just end it here.

Your right God is not the bible, the bible is the WORD of God. And without we don't know anything about God other than general revelation tells us which cannot save us.

 

[Der Alte]

[SIZE=-1]I do not believe there is such a thing. There is only one correct way, and we all do it wrong. Luckily that isn't what matters as long as it leads back to God. God knows more than the Bible and the Bible doesn't know everything and the Bible has every chance to be flawed. The purpose of the Bible is to be a lantern on the dark path that leads us to God, not to become our God. If we start thinking views of the Bible, we're starting to put the Bible before God.

There's no such thing. The Bible is the Bible. It's a good book, it's an excellent guild book to help aid you in understanding God and strengthening faith. But if you use it too much it becomes a crutch and God starts to fall out of the picture. The laws inside give an idea, a sketch of what is unholy, but without God of course it's just going to be words on paper.

You know what, I'm changing my mind. There are two different views of the Bible. The humanistic view and God's view. EVERYONE who says that the Bible is either completely literal, the Bible is misinterpreted/translated/whatever is right in their own effect. Okay, that's what the BIBLE is. God is not the Bible. I know ya`ll get tired of hearing it but it apparently needs to be said. God is not the Bible. And if you try to put a label on how to view the Bible, I can tell you right now they're all wrong. Liberal, literal, conservative, it's all wrong. The only appropriate view of the Bible is God's view and the only way to achieve that view is by keeping an open mind to God, to our sin and to the Bible at the same time. We seem to have a problem with this because we're always bias in favor of either the Bible or ourselves because it seems so hard to listen to God. You don't need to be a prophet to hear Him. When Christ died for us, and when we accept the Spirit, that breaks down that wall. Prophets don't exist anymore or rather any Christian is a prophet on their own.

This is becoming very long, so I'll just end it here.[/SIZE]

The above is what the "world" says. Below is what God says.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Mat 4:4 But he [Jesus] answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me [Jesus].

Act 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

2 Tim 3:15 and how from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to give you wisdom for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 3:16 Every scripture is inspired by God and useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 3:17 that the person dedicated to God may be capable and equipped for every good work.​

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

The above is what the "world" says. Below is what God says.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Mat 4:4 But he [Jesus] answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me [Jesus].

Act 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

2 Tim 3:15 and how from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to give you wisdom for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 3:16 Every scripture is inspired by God and useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 3:17 that the person dedicated to God may be capable and equipped for every good work.​

I'm fairly sure that post was as far away from the "world" as I could possibly make it. If you interpretted otherwise I apologize. But I repeat myself. You can post verses until your fingers turn blue Der Alter. But you're only posting the Bible and giving it off as God's law. It means about as much as if I were to post quotes from Harry Potter and try to prove that magic is real. It simply doesn't work that way. To teach God's law, you need to teach God. The Bible, as I said, is a tool you can use to teach God but it isn't God, so you shouldn't teach it.

I would never say the Bible is a bunch of drivel, but there are parts that are more unclear than you think. Or too general to be accepted face value but people do it anyway. Humans are all either very lazy or very do-it-yourself that we think we can read the Bible without calling on God and exercising the Holy Spirit. It doesn't work that way though. We need help if we want to understand it. But if you listen hard enough you SHOULDN'T even need the Bible to help yourself anymore because God makes Himself more and more clear to you the harder you listen.

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

Your right God is not the bible, the bible is the WORD of God. And without we don't know anything about God other than general revelation tells us which cannot save us.

The Bible could be considered such, but if the Bible is the Word of God than we obviously need God's help to read it properly. If we can't understand God DIRECTLY when through His son we're given the greatest chance to do so, but we think that we can understand His Word so clearly when it's written on paper? I don't believe that makes sense, and I also don't believe it serves all the excuses we use the Bible for. The most popular being "This is what the Bible says". If that's what the Bible says, peachy. But what does God say? Because in the end, the Bible is just a book. It's God that we should be concentrating on. Like I said, imagine how much the world could change if we stopped listening to ourselves, which is the same as listening to the Bible, and started listening to God, like He intends.

 

[ReformedChapin]

The Bible could be considered such, but if the Bible is the Word of God than we obviously need God's help to read it properly. If we can't understand God DIRECTLY when through His son we're given the greatest chance to do so, but we think that we can understand His Word so clearly when it's written on paper? I don't believe that makes sense, and I also don't believe it serves all the excuses we use the Bible for. The most popular being "This is what the Bible says". If that's what the Bible says, peachy. But what does God say? Because in the end, the Bible is just a book. It's God that we should be concentrating on. Like I said, imagine how much the world could change if we stopped listening to ourselves, which is the same as listening to the Bible, and started listening to God, like He intends.

Again how do we know what God is saying without the scriptures?

You say the bible is not the word of God then what other source of knowledge is given to us to know God's will?

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

Again how do we know what God is saying without the scriptures?

You say the bible is not the word of God then what other source of knowledge is given to us to know God's will?

I believe I never said that. But thank you for twisting my words like such because it's leading me to believe you have nothing else to give me. I said if the Bible is God's word, we'll never understand it without God. Meaning quoting the Bible means absolutely nothing unless you read it through God's eyes, which by the way, comes with the Holy Spirit. It's a full package. You don't become God but you're given the wisdom to understand Him and His Word.

We don't need any other source of knowledge anymore. God is giving us a chance to talk to Him directly. It isn't my fault that everyone else is too scared to talk to Him directly and feel more comfortable reading a book.

 

[plmarquette]

right , wrong , fair are not words to discuss ...God has a position , it does not change ... whether bishops, popes, angels , or anyone else says some thing God discourages , is permitted ... it it wrong ...

we have a free will ... we can do what Paul speaks of in 1 corinthians 6.9 , but there are consequences for our behavior ... just like ones for running a red light , speeding , breaking and entering ...

there is forgiveness for some one with an obsession , who daily lives , battles , that he might overcome ... an alcoholic who doesn't drink , a fornicator who chooses to be married & be with his wife , a drug addict who chooses to have help and accountablility ....

lesbians and gays who choose to be celabate rather than violate God's precepts ...